How long do you let your tank sit fallow after ich

payamsh

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Hello,
I have a 470 gallon FOWLR tank. Yesterday I notice that all of my fish were heavily encrusted with ich. I immediately dosed with Cupramine and turned off the uv. Unfortunately most of my fish were dead by this morning. I removed the surviving 2 and now the tank is empty. My question is how long should I let it sit empty? I tested the parameters and everything was within normal limits. No excess nitrates or ammonia. Oh was at 8.2 and sal at 1.025. I don't know what the stressor was that caused the tank to wipe out like that. TIA
 

143MPCo

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Bump... anyone?
 

143MPCo

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Requesting the post be moved to Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis forum, maybe a better location for answers. [h=1][/h]
 

jason142

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When I ran my tank fallow I did it for 12 weeks so I would say that is minimum but the longer you can go fishless the better.
 

NeuroticAquatics

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6 weeks is safe. 8 weeks is what I do to be extra safe. I've never heard of anything showing a reason to go three months...as that is weeks beyond the maximum possible Ich life cycle in a fallow tank.

Are you 100% sure it was Ich though? To go from noticing it to mass deaths overnight sounds more like Velvet.
 

Humblefish

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Are you 100% sure it was Ich though? To go from noticing it to mass deaths overnight sounds more like Velvet.

^^This. 6 weeks is the "standard" fallow period for velvet. However, 72 days is the standard fallow period for ich, and that's how long I would go fallow for just to be safe. Btw, sorry about your losses. I know the feeling, as I have suffered through many tank wipe-outs in my time. :sad:

Moving forward, I would highly suggest you QT all future fish purchases: https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/fish-disease-treatment-diagnosis/189815-how-quarantine.html
 

NeuroticAquatics

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^^This. 6 weeks is the "standard" fallow period for velvet. However, 72 days is the standard fallow period for ich, and that's how long I would go fallow for just to be safe. Btw, sorry about your losses. I know the feeling, as I have suffered through many tank wipe-outs in my time. :sad:

Moving forward, I would highly suggest you QT all future fish purchases: https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/fish-disease-treatment-diagnosis/189815-how-quarantine.html

I was talking about 8 weeks for Ich, but this does not strike me as Ich. MV kills quick, Ich usually does not and it usually does not knock off groups of fish all at once.

Where is the 3 months timeframe coming from? I've read many articles on Marine Ich and have not seen any that show the lifecycle being that long in a fallow environment. Most articles agree that 6 weeks works, 8 weeks is close to overkill. Three months is almost double the lifespan, so I'm wondering why someone would go that long.
 

aran

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I just did 12 weeks to make sure it was gone ...may be have been overkill but I treated all the fish with hypo and copper in QT for 12
Weeks before putting them back in dt so that's how long it remained fallow
 

TJ's Reef

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Seems to be all over the board here for suggested times on running Fallow, but typical research states 8-10 weeks to get past the life cycle of MI/MV. The one thing that is being overlooked in this particular thread OP is that Cupramine/copper was used so in essence if a full dose was used there is little chance for either parasite to survive very long. So I would say that by going through the standard 15 day Cupramine treatment will do the deed and then just need to be diligent on QT practices moving forward.


Cheers, Todd
 

NeuroticAquatics

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I totally agree with QT. Your luck will only last so long before a fish is introduced that is carrying something nasty. Been there, done that and it is no fun.

I've always referred to articles like the ones on ChucksAddiction or ReefCentral. One goes into some interesting statistical analysis and ends up stating that at 4 weeks fallow, you are at 84%, 5 weeks 97.7% and 6 weeks 99.8% that it's gone. I've always done 8 just to push a little closer to 100%. I guess another month can't hurt, but just seems like massive overkill.

I'm not trying to argue, just pointing out what I've seen/read over the years.
 

Humblefish

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I was talking about 8 weeks for Ich, but this does not strike me as Ich. MV kills quick, Ich usually does not and it usually does not knock off groups of fish all at once.

I agree completely that this sounds like a case of marine velvet. However, it's difficult to be sure without a biopsy to be examined under a scope or even pictures of the deceased fish. So IMO, it's wise to just "play it safe" and assume ich, since that has the longer fallow period.

Where is the 3 months timeframe coming from? I've read many articles on Marine Ich and have not seen any that show the lifecycle being that long in a fallow environment. Most articles agree that 6 weeks works, 8 weeks is close to overkill. Three months is almost double the lifespan, so I'm wondering why someone would go that long.

IMO; 72 days is the "safe bet" for going fallow with ich. I base this upon one study done by Colorni and Burgess in 1997 (see quote and link below). Now the odds of encountering the strain of ich they studied are probably quite low, but my motto is "better safe than sorry" :wink::

The time required for theront development varies. In one study (Colorni and Burgess 1997), theronts emerged from a group of tomonts sometime between 3 and 72 days, with most released from 4 to 8 days after tomont formation. In another study (Diggles and Lester 1996c ), tomite development and theront release occurred, on average, between 5 and 12.1 days after tomont formation, depending upon strain and temperature. There was no correlation between tomont size and theront release. Yoshinaga and Dickerson (1994) observed, in laboratory studies, that theronts were released only between the hours of 2:00 am and 9:00 am, even in total darkness; some suggest this strategy increases the chance for theronts to find a host, as many fish may be resting or closer to substrate during this time period.

Taken from: FA164/FA164: Cryptocaryon irritans Infections (Marine White Spot Disease) in Fish
 
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NeuroticAquatics

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I absolutely agree with the better safe than sorry moto when it comes to treating. Can't go wrong with that.

The 72 days is the longest ever reported, so it's out there. I bet there is worse that's not reported/recorded. I guess 2.5 months covers it. I guess people going the extra two weeks can't hurt.
 
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payamsh

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Thank you everyone for the replies. So I do have a qt tank but it backfired. I have a 30gal set up. I bought a 6inch harlequin tusk about 2 weeks ago and put him in the qt. Unfortunately my qt wasn't cycled for long enough so naturally, the ammonia and nitrates went off the charts. The bio filter couldn't handle the bio load of the harlequin. Even with 5 gal water changed every night, the parameters were ugly. He started to show signs of stress so I elected to put him in the dt after only 12 days of qt thinking I was going to lose him in qt. I should have planned it better. I guess with the type of fish I want to keep in a 470g dt I need to have a bigger qt system.
I didn't think about marine velvet. The dead fish had signs of subcutaneous hemorrhage (bruising/bleeding under the skin). Ive lost fish to ich before but never noticed the hemorrhage. will do some research on mv.
Back to square one. :/
(Ps I'm new to this forum and clearly posted this question in the wrong subsection. Apologies.)
 

143MPCo

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No apology needed, just glad we got you some excellent info.
 

Humblefish

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Moving forward, what kind of bio filter are you running on the QT? Perhaps we can give you some suggestions to make it work more efficiently and control ammonia better for future fish purchases.
 
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payamsh

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I actually thought I was "over-filtered". I have an Ehiem external box filter rated for up to 75 gal. Inside it I have ceramic rings, and two layers of foam. I also have an internal sponge filter which was inside the sump of my dt getting seeded..I also have a pump hooked up to a reactor which has little sponge cubes laced with carbon laced. So really think it comes down to the tank size, and allowing it cycle longer. Does anyone recommend adding LR to the qt to increase bio-filter?
 

Humblefish

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Does anyone recommend adding LR to the qt to increase bio-filter?

You can, but there are pitfalls. For one, if a fish in QT comes down with a disease you will have to remove the LR prior to medicating to prevent absorption. Next, that LR would then be considered "disease contaminated," and you would either have to go fallow with it or sterilize & re-use as dry rock. :squigglemouth:
 

NeuroticAquatics

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Agreed. A good long term way of getting beneficial bacteria in QT is to have pieces of filter sponge in your sump/refugium. When you are setting up a QT, pull one of the pieces out and it should be loaded with bacteria. It is less expensive than rock and easier to clean.
 

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