Ask Nano Questions and Find Information (Nano Expert Albert Thiel)

[alberthiel]

Book Update : Today is the last day you can pre-order my New Book "Nano-Reef Aquariums" at the low pre-publication rate. In fact the linked document already mentions that the price went up, but since I did not post the message yesterday, I will let those who wish to order the book do so at the old pre-pub price until tonight at midnight.

After that the price goes from 15.00 to 25.00 (+ shipping on both cases). Click on the image in the sig and you will see what the content is and at the bottom are the ordering instructions AND what else you get for FREE

Albert

 

[alberthiel]

Suggested List of What NOT to keep in a Nano-Reef even if it is 30 to 40 gallons, so definitely not IMO in smaller ones ( I ) - Anemones -

1. Heteractis magnifica, not only does it need a large aquarium (e.g. 90 or more gallons) but is a "mover" and likes to roam around in search of the best spot but never seems to find for some reason in smaller tanks. Also, as it moves around it will in some cases end up in a pump or power head intake and get shredded to pieces or very seriously damaged that it will not survive

2. Macrodactyla doreensis, referred to by several common names one of which is the Corkscrew anemone. Needs a large tank, a mixed sand substrate (not too thin sand) and regular feeding and even then it usually does not make it for very long in even larger tanks

3. Stichodactyla gigantea, the Carpet Anemone : needs a real big tank as it can become very large and spreads out many inches in every direction, and it traps fish if it can and stings them and captures them with its very sticky tentacles

4. Heteractis crispa : a great looking anemone but again not suited for Nano-Reefs (suggested size 55 gallons at least)

5. Cerianthus species anemones : referred to as tube anemones and some other names. Its long tentacles are loaded with very powerful nematocysts and the anemone will use them to sting and capture whatever it can. I have observed it killing many corals in smaller tanks including fairly sizable Tridacna clams.

Before adding any anemone to your tank you need IMO and IME do some in-depth research on their behavior, care, nutritional needs, substrate needed, etc. and on the minimum recommended size.

If you cannot find enough information, feel free to ask here, or if you have my book you will find it in there.

 

[alberthiel]

Suggested List of What NOT to keep in a Nano-Reef even if it is 30 to 40 gallons, so definitely not IMO in smaller ones ( II ) - Soft Corals -

Several soft corals are not recommended for Reefs in general unless you are a very experienced Hobbyist, and even then it is hard to keep them alive for more than a month or two ... even Advanced Aquarist have trouble keeping the two species listed below alive and thriving.

Dendronephthya such as for instance Carnation corals. You will find them offered for sale but as I said ... the are not recommended for Nano Reefs and not even for larger ones unless you are prepared to gain experience in how to keep them alive even if you have done a lot of research on them

Scleronephthya : Tree corals ... same remarks as above

Pennatulacea : Sea Pens - very delicate and very hard to keep alive for any length of time

And there are others such as Sea Fans, Sea Whips, Gorgonians and the like ... do your research very carefully before acquiring any Soft Coral if you really want to pursue keeping one but IMO only advanced hobbyists should attempt keeping any of them, if at all

 

[alberthiel]

Factors controlling the Expansion of Favia favus - A technical article on the effects of Light, Flow and Planktonic Prey in the water

Abstract + Full article

Factors Controlling the Expansion Behavior of Favia favus (Cnidaria: Scleractinia): Effects of Light, Flow, and Planktonic Prey

 

[alberthiel]

Pathogens identified for White Syndrome in Corals - Technical Article (full version)

PLOS ONE: Coral Pathogens Identified for White Syndrome (WS) Epizootics in the Indo-Pacific

 

[T.W.]

Albert, in your post above are you suggesting that , for example, me as a beginning reefer I should stay away from those particular species mentioned above or soft corals in general?

 

[alberthiel]

Albert, in your post above are you suggesting that , for example, me as a beginning reefer I should stay away from those particular species mentioned above or soft corals in general?

IMO yes as most authors agree that soft corals especially the first three mentioned are hard to keep and keep alive for an extended period of time. Usually they may do fairly well for a month or two or even three but soon they start showing signs of not doing so well. Also some soft corals may contain toxins and if they die in a small aquarium they can cause major problems. I am not saying that it cannot be done, as there are always exceptions, but in the majority of cases they will not make it especially when kept with LPS and SPS corals or one of the two. They also need heavy feeding of planktonic food on a near constant basis which makes controlling the water quality more difficult. They are also very sensitive to changes in the water chemistry e.g. when a water change is done. In addition most of them need nitrate in the water and in highly filtered tanks that may not be there in sufficient quantity.

What are you keeping in your tank right now if I may ask?

 

[alberthiel]

Fireworm Husbandry .... Really ? But this is worth reading for sure !

Short Take: Fireworm Husbandry?! — Advanced Aquarist | Aquarist Magazine and Blog

 

[alberthiel]

Algae : The Good, The Bad and The Ugly ... Bob Goemans

The LIVING Marine Aquarium Manual:

 

[alberthiel]

Nano-Reef and Aquarium Maintenance : Bob Goemans

The LIVING Marine Aquarium Manual:

 

[T.W.]

Albert,

I haven't even started cycling my tank (20g) yet lol.. I am thinking I will be starting it up in about 2 weeks or so. I am just gathering as much knowledge and information as I can before I start. But as far as corals go, now I am unsure. I will have to do some more research as I was wanting to do zoanthids and R. yuma. May need to regroup and dig a little deeper. I just want this tank to be successful. No point setting it up just to fail right?

 

[alberthiel]

Albert,

I haven't even started cycling my tank (20g) yet lol.. I am thinking I will be starting it up in about 2 weeks or so. I am just gathering as much knowledge and information as I can before I start. But as far as corals go, now I am unsure. I will have to do some more research as I was wanting to do zoanthids and R. yuma. May need to regroup and dig a little deeper. I just want this tank to be successful. No point setting it up just to fail right?

Gathering as much information as you can is indeed the right way to go so you know in advance what to expect, what fish are suitable and compatible with each other, what corals you can keep based on the size of the aquarium (20 gals you say), feeding requirements, lighting, etc. etc. so you are doing the right thing for sure.

Now I hope I did not mislead you as by soft corals I do not mean Zoanthids and Ricordea ones as they Corallomorpharia and are among the hardiest that you can add to your tank. You can check in the Article section as I wrote an article on the Ricordea yuma one in the Nano reef Article section.

So those you can definitely put on your list. Others you can consider are Duncan coral and Candy Cane coral. They are hardy too and there is an article on one in the Article section too. My Yumas reproduced in the my 20 Gallon btw. Red Mushrooms are fine too and they too reproduced in my tank. The hardy ones are the ones with the smooth surface not the knobby ones although those are hardy too.

There are a lot of links in this thread to corals and their care but I know that it is a lot of pages to go through but you can do some searches ... or what I suggest is look around at what is available and if you have any questions, feel free to ask them here.

Zoanthids are excellent too and they will reproduce in your tank as well as long as your water quality is up to par and you place them at the bottom and do not put too intense light on them.

But as I said ... think about the corals and fish and if you have questions just post them here and I will be more than happy to answer them.

 

[T.W.]

That is good to know Albert. Thank you for the clarification. I am still learning about the different corals and which ones go into what category. I will get it down before long.
Thanks again for the insight, info and help.

 

[alberthiel]

That is good to know Albert. Thank you for the clarification. I am still learning about the different corals and which ones go into what category. I will get it down before long.
Thanks again for the insight, info and help.

Anytime, You are always welcome to ask as many questions as you wish. Glad to help

 

[alberthiel]

Cyanide poising signs in fish :

Although the incidence of cyanide poisoned fish has gone down considerably from what it used to be years ago the issue still exists with fish coming from certain Ind-Pacific areas, and the ones often mentioned are Indonesia and the Philippines, athough great strides in reducing the incidence of the use of cyanide have been made.

Whether those are the only ones and whether the practice of capturing fish using sodium cyanide, and variations of it, to numb fish and make it easier to catch them is not really known, as what happens at the catching stations is often not available, and enforcement of the laws prohibiting its use are according not reports by many not adequately enforced.

Signs of cyanide poisoning include, but are not limited to:
- erratic swimming and not been able to deal adequately with the water current in the tank
- bumping into LR and even the glass or acrylic panes of the tank
- a change in eating habit and quantity
- listlessness
- loss of weight usually visible as the sunken belly syndrome
- sudden unexplained death when the fish was doing fine
- and more

This brings me of course to the suggestion that you should buy tank bred fish or fish bred in captivity, depending on how you wnat to call it, but not all species have and so you will still encounter wild caught specimens of many species.

Often when cyanide poisoning has occurred the fish will not survive for very long and one technique that I have used is to purchase a fish and ask the LFS to keep it for me for up to a week and then collect it. If after its long travel to an LFS, having gone from the capturing station, to the holding one, to then being shipped to a wholesaler and sitting there for a while, and then to an LFS, and adding to that the time the LFS has had it + the waiting time I suggested, should give plenty of time for you to know whether the fish is healthy or not as the result of cyanide poisoning usually will become apparent before you actually collect the fish. And if you see any of the signs described then it would be wise not to buy that fish of course.

 

[Paul B]

Signs of cyanide poisoning include, but are not limited to:
- erratic swimming and not been able to deal adequately with the water current in the tank
- bumping into LR and even the glass or acrylic panes of the tank
- a change in eating habit and quantity
- listlessness
- loss of weight usually visible as the sunken belly syndrome
- sudden unexplained death when the fish was doing fine
- and more

Albert of course is correct. I would like to add one more thing about cyanide poisoning, sometimes the fish looks better and have more vibrant colors than fish that were collected without the use of cyanide. Like a person on speed would seem to have more energy and may look healthier than they normally do.
But that symptom does not last and the fish is often un able to use the food that it is eating and in a week or two usually stops eating and dies.
I have seen copperband butterflies like that. They swim like crazy and eat everything but die in a week while looking fantastic.
Most new fish normally hide and are shy until they get used to their new surroundings, some cyanide collected fish show no fear while others exhibit to much fear and never come out.

 

[alberthiel]

Albert of course is correct. I would like to add one more thing about cyanide poisoning, sometimes the fish looks better and have more vibrant colors than fish that were collected without the use of cyanide. Like a person on speed would seem to have more energy and may look healthier than they normally do.
But that symptom does not last and the fish is often un able to use the food that it is eating and in a week or two usually stops eating and dies.
I have seen copperband butterflies like that. They swim like crazy and eat everything but die in a week while looking fantastic.
Most new fish normally hide and are shy until they get used to their new surroundings, some cyanide collected fish show no fear while others exhibit to much fear and never come out.

Thanks Paul and yes you are correct and it is disconcerting as it gives the hobbyist the impression that the fish is doing great and then a few days later that same fish is dead or missing and lying behind a rock or in a spot where he cannot be seen. If the fish remains lying dead in such a spot for too long predation will start by snails, shrimp, bristleworms etc ... depending on which ones of those the hobbyist has in the tank.

The other collecting practice that is banned but still used in some areas is dynamiting parts of the reef and this is often done to catch fish that can wedge themselves in a crevice and kind of lock themselves in those crevices by erecting a spine e.g. like Triggers can do.

The dynamiting is used to stun the fish so they are easier to catch but the internal damage it does leads to large loses even at the catching site and some that make it to the holding station die there, and then even fewer make it through and get shipped out. Some die during transport to wholesalers but others make it through but then unfortunately will die at the fish store or in a hobbyist's tank ... terrible practice it is but it is unfortunately used.

Besides cyanide other chemicals are used sometimes to get fish stunned, one of them is a numbing med and there even is a glue derivative used in some areas. All of those practices are banned but unfortunately enforcement of the ban is often not undertaken or enforced by the authorities. The bans are put in place to get "pressure" off the country by International organizations but they do not enforce the laws because of the large amounts of taxes countries earn on fix exports.

And then their are the capturing of fish that are banned from being caught .... but that too is still going on. Not long ago a very rare Angelfish from off the Coast of Belize was found in a shipment that went to California and was actually sent by a very well known collector and mislabeled as another Angel species but Fish and Wildlife caught on and the collector was fined $40,000 and the fish were given to a Public Aquarium.

It is sad that all of this still goes on ... but if the demand does not go down for wild caught fish such as those caught in the manners described, the practices will unfortunately continue I am afraid.

 

[alberthiel]

I was going to post some pics of my tank but I did a major maintenance on the tank earlier and all corals are very teed off right now ... fish are in slowmo mode too ...

- cleaned all rock
- replaced floss for mech filtration
- removed 2 pieces of rock
- cleaned part of the sandbed
- replaced GAC
- replaced GFO
- replaced Poly Filter pads (2 3" wide ones stuck in the HOB fiter
- cleaned HOB filter completely inside and outside
- cleaned out skimmer completely, inside and outside
- cleaned glass
- moved some Zoas to a different location
- move a Pavona frag to another spot
- did a 20 % water change

As you can see it was a total and complete maintenance routine and so now all corals look unhappy ... but they will be OK in a few hours ,,,

 

[Paul B]

The other collecting practice that is banned but still used in some areas is dynamiting parts of the reef and this is often done to catch fish that can wedge themselves in a crevice and kind of lock themselves in those crevices by erecting a spine e.g. like Triggers can do.

I did something like that in Viet Nam during the war. If we wanted to swim in a bomb crater we would first throw in a couple of grenades. That would kill the snakes and other nasties in the water. It didn't seem to bother the leeches though excet to wake them up.

 

[alberthiel]

I did something like that in Viet Nam during the war. If we wanted to swim in a bomb crater we would first throw in a couple of grenades. That would kill the snakes and other nasties in the water. It didn't seem to bother the leeches though excet to wake them up.

Yes a few grenades would get rid of just about everything ... guess the leeches were in hiding and knew a meal was coming ... pulling those buggers off is a pain too. I used to go to the Belgian Congo, well now Zaire or the Congo, not sure as they seem to change name every week, and went we went swimming in the Congo River we would sometimes get them on ourselves too, but you get used to them and just burn them off so they would let go of their hold on your legs or where ever they were.

I remember the days when Doctors used them to supposedly lower people's blood pressure ... guess that tells you a little about my age but then you know it already anyway.

Amazing how things change ... in the late 50's I could go to a pharmacy if I had a tooth ache and buy tincture of opium to put on a tiny bit of cotton ball or similar and stick on the tooth to numb the pain ... But I would not go to a Pharmacy nowadays and ask for that ... they may look at me as if i were nuts