Nitrates not coming down again, Cyano taking over

[Saltgator]

Need some guidance or thoughts on Nitrates and Cyano. My nitrates are at 20ppm and refuse to budge. Sps and lps show no signs of color loss but no new growth. Sps have no polyps (no bugs).
I've done decent water changes (50g a week) using instant ocean, changed all my ro/di filters, resin, flow restrictor, etc.
I run 1.5 cups of gfo and 1.5 cups of carbon.
My feeding schedule is not I every other day and diy food on opposite days. Diy food contains fresh seafood (peeled shrimp, squid, scallops and white fish). My food is prepared in my zero tds water and frozen after a blending thru the processed.
Skimming is via a swc 230 running in between dry and wet.
No debris in the sump settled or decaying.
Other numbers that I can provide:
No3 is 20 via seachem
Po4 is zero via hanna
Alk is 9.5 via Hanna
Cal is 450 via elos
Salinity is 1.025
Temp is 78
PH is 8.2
Alk is 2 part baked @ 350 degrees for 1+ hour (baking powder) (2 cups)
Cal is 2 part mixed overnight of Dowflake (2.5 cups)
Lights are all LED, reef radiance 155e for 7 hours
Flow is 2 x wp40 on else mode and 2 x no name 3600 gph water movers from online
Tiny tiny fuge lit by a par 38 for fuges (18 hours), trying to grow fern and grape calupera with no success (no growth, just green). Incorporating a 50g fuge but waiting on a bulkhead and sand.

I know there is something I'm forgetting but go ahead and give me your thoughts and ideas.

 

[Reefing Madness]

Aquarium Chemistry: Magnesium In Reef Aquaria ? Advanced Aquarist | Aquarist Magazine and Blog
What do you want the Nitrate number to be?
If you want it down more, you'd have to do your 50g water changes consecutively, this will take them down, then you'd have to find the water change range that eould keep them there.
Next, if your bio load is up there, the skimmer you have won't help you in the nitrate removal, its to small for your needs.

 

[Saltgator]

I've considered a huge skimmer so that's on the table. I'd like my nitrates at 5-10.

 

[luxauterna]

I am wondering about the bio load too. Also, when was the last time you blasted your rocks with a turkey baster or anything? How are your CUC numbers? Also, when you do your fuge, I would nix the sand. I've been reading a lot about some efficiencies on refugiums. A way to keep them cleaner is to just go with your rock with caulerpa or chaeto .. Some are running just chaeto in a box 'o' water. Are the areas where the cyano is growing pretty void of flow?

 

[Saltgator]

240g, 55g sump (half filled so 25g). Adding the 50g fuge this weekend. Bio is 2 Picasso clowns, 1 regal angel, 1 mag Foxface, 1 black tang, 1 white tail bristletooth tang. All under 6 inches.
Rocks have a growth on them. Not sure so it's unidentified yet. No debris on the rocks that's loose. I blast these with a maxi jet while I do a WC. Cyano grows throughout the entire sand, especially in the dunes where the flow is pretty darn strong. Cuc is almost depleted. A few nerites and a few golf ball size zebra turbos.

 

[candcreef]

Hey brad....how ya been? Quick question for ya....when was the last time you changed your membranes in your rodi? Had a similar problem and after much frustration I came to find out my membranes were shot....just my two cents....btw just added my first angel to my system...

Conan

 

[mike007]

Sounds to me everything is in order I would suggest to cut down on your feeding.
I feed my fish once a day sparingly.Fish are pigs and will eat as much as we feed them. Water changes are great but they will only temporary cure the problem. You have to find the source of the problem. I find that overfeeding is the main cause.I have had problems with cyano myself and tried everything once I replaced my mp 40s with the Maxspect gyro with increased flow my cyano went away in several days.

 

[Saltgator]

Hey brad....how ya been? Quick question for ya....when was the last time you changed your membranes in your rodi? Had a similar problem and after much frustration I came to find out my membranes were shot....just my two cents....btw just added my first angel to my system...

Conan

Hey bud! Glad to here from ya. Changed everything on the ro/di less than a month ago (thought it might be the cause). Lets see some pics or a build thread!!!

 

[Saltgator]

Sounds to me everything is in order I would suggest to cut down on your feeding.
I feed my fish once a day sparingly.Fish are pigs and will eat as much as we feed them. Water changes are great but they will only temporary cure the problem. You have to find the source of the problem. I find that overfeeding is the main cause.I have had problems with cyano myself and tried everything once I replaced my mp 40s with the Maxspect gyro with increased flow my cyano went away in several days.

Thanks Mike. I'm considering switching to LRS and see if that helps in case my food has junk in it.

 

[luxauterna]

I like Mike's idea as well. Keep us posted! Also time to update the CUC

 

[Saltgator]

I like Mike's idea as well. Keep us posted! Also time to update the CUC

Definitely agree on the updated cuc. I hate hermits and Nass snails, but gotta get the ball rolling again.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What do you plan to put in the refugium?

Growing macroalgae will help.

You could also consider organic carbon dosing (liquids or pellets) or a denitrator of some type.

In my system, I use large rock filled refugia with macroalgae in the top few inches, vinegar dosing, GFO, skimming, and GAC for nutrient export.

 

[Saltgator]

What do you plan to put in the refugium?

Growing macroalgae will help.

You could also consider organic carbon dosing (liquids or pellets) or a denitrator of some type.

In my system, I use large rock filled refugia with macroalgae in the top few inches, vinegar dosing, GFO, skimming, and GAC for nutrient export.

I'm planning grape and fern for my macros. I tried vinegar in June/July but never seen a difference (in skimming or bacteria growth) in 8 weeks. Probably my fault for giving up on it. Plus I was up to 45 mL a day.

 

[jt17]

I dose vinegar and run a small refugium (13 gal. in a 150 gal. system) and feed heavily an my nitrates stay between 2 and 5 ppm. One thing that really helped the efficiency of my fuge was to keep the macros tumbling. I had a mix of macros at first but have been eliminating most in favor of the dragons tongue macro. I call it my Fireball fuge. The only problem is company watches the fuge more than the DT

Also, in carbon dosing the concept is the addition of carbon provides food for bacteria allowing the nitrate and phosphate to assimilated into bacteria which in turn are removed from the system via the skimmer. Could it stand to reason that phosphate could be a limiting factor in your system. I know you are not carbon dosing but the same processes are still taking place in all tanks. This is just a thought and I hope Randy will chime in if I'm way off on this one but I noticed you have 0 phosphates maybe using a little less gfo and allowing phosphates to rise to .02-.05 ppm might create a nitrate to phosphate ratio better suited for bacteria production.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I'm planning grape and fern for my macros. I tried vinegar in June/July but never seen a difference (in skimming or bacteria growth) in 8 weeks. Probably my fault for giving up on it. Plus I was up to 45 mL a day.

Tracking nitrate would be a better way to gauge if organic carbon dosing was working.

FWIW, while I grow caulerpa racemosa in my refugium, a huge drawback is that it can get into the main tank where it becomes a monster pest unless you have fish that will eat it.

 

[Electrobes]

When was the last time you cleaned out your equipment, especially your flow (Pumps and Powerheads), but more importantly... your skimmer? Maybe its functioning inefficiently, and not doing the work it's supposed to be doing?

 

[Saltgator]

When was the last time you cleaned out your equipment, especially your flow (Pumps and Powerheads), but more importantly... your skimmer? Maybe its functioning inefficiently, and not doing the work it's supposed to be doing?

Hey Christian (it's BC13 from swfmas). All pumps were soaked for 24 hrs 2 months ago to clean cal deposits and junk, skimmer was disassembled a month ago for a deep cleaning. Once a week I remove the skimmer intake and clean out cal deposits too

 

[Saltgator]

Update:
Nitrates still high. Ranging around 40+.
Went back to vinegar dosing via the reef keeping chart.
Testing to see when nitrates budge.
Skimmer working flawless. Been skimming a tad wet to assist the nitrate.
Fuge seems to be starting to grow a bit. White tips on the fern macro and it's now rooting down.
Bought some kent iron to help boost the fuge growth.

Anything I missed or comments or concerns?

 

[Electrobes]

Hey Brad!

I am sending you a PM on the local forum (Just want to see where you live) and maybe I can take a look at the tank, and help you spot any potential sources for this problem.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Update:
Nitrates still high. Ranging around 40+.
Went back to vinegar dosing via the reef keeping chart.
Testing to see when nitrates budge.
Skimmer working flawless. Been skimming a tad wet to assist the nitrate.
Fuge seems to be starting to grow a bit. White tips on the fern macro and it's now rooting down.
Bought some kent iron to help boost the fuge growth.

Anything I missed or comments or concerns?

How much vinegar now?