I finally have a fish to post on the disease forum

[Paul B]

I find this fascinating and I am all excited. I have had this copperband a few years from a baby and now is about 5" long. I just noticed, and don't know how long it has been there, but he now has a black spot and a few smaller ones. I have seen red patches, brown patches and even white patches, but never a black patch like this one. Otherwise he seems fine, but if this fish dies (and I have time) I will autopsy him to see how far internal this spot goes and if I can learn something about it.
This is something I think I can learn something from because it is obviously an internal condition and not something from collection because I have had him for so long. He also has some patches on his other side so I know it is not an injury. Please don't come up with parasites as that is not it, and No I will not change the water or look at my parameters or phases of the moon.
OK Humble, I am awaiting your diagnosis because I have absolutely no idea unless he had a tattoo or bar code

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

 

[Paul B]

Don't give me
I find it fascinating. I never saw a spot like that. How cool is that!

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Don't give me
I find it fascinating. I never saw a spot like that. How cool is that!

me too buddy. following along. I love to learn stuff. esp when it baffles the expert.

Ill sit quietly at the kids table now.

 

[Paul B]

I guess I am not the expert on black spots on copperbands. Looks like some form of skin cancer but I am not sure fish even get that as I have never seen it. I think it just showed up because I didn't see it before and I kind of see that fish every day because he is my biggest fish.

 

[Humblefish]

Could be dried up blood which pooled under the skin aka a bruise.

Does the spot appear to be completely under the epithelium or is any of it above the surface?

 

[Brew12]

Have you added any new fish that may be playing rap music after you go to sleep?

 

[Paul B]

Could be dried up blood which pooled under the skin aka a bruise.

Does the spot appear to be completely under the epithelium or is any of it above the surface?

I don't think so because he has a few of those places that are black. There are some on the other side. Doesn't look like blood, wrong color. Very weird
I can't tell if it is on the surface or under it but there are quite a few places which are turning black. Couldn't be a wound.

No rap music that I can hear

 

[4FordFamily]

I've never seen anything like that either!

 

[Reefahholic]

Paul, is he able to eat from the feeder?!?

HaHa... how you been man? I'm assuming this is the same paul I know from RC.?

 

[melypr1985]

Does anybody else see the darker area (kinda reddish) near the tail? Wondering if I'm imagining things?

 

[Paul B]

Hello Reefahalic, yes it's me. Nice to see you.

Hi Meredith, no, there is no red mark near his tail. The black areas are odd because the skin and scales there appear to be perfect, no bruising or raised scales. It appears as if someone (perhaps a hermit crab) wrote on him with a magic marker. It is just a skin discoloration. It is happening on the other side on the borders of the color bands. When the lights come on I will look closer.
The only thing I can think of, and this is a stretch, is that for a month, I have been feeding the tank yeast. It is just an experiment like everything I do, it clouds the water a little then clears in 20 minutes. My theory is that the yeast, high in the B vitamins will feed the corals and sponges. I am not sure about the corals but the sponges, of which I have many, took on a life of their own and started to cover anything they touch. It's like the invasion of the body snatchers. The sponges started to grow up some of the branches of the gorgonians and one of the gorgonians has started to overgrow another, different type of gorg.
This so me is completely amazing and I would like to experiment further. But maybe the copperband is allergic to yeast. I know that sounds like a stretch and I am not even sure if fish can become allergic but it is a theory. Not a very good theory, but a theory none the less.
I am going to stop the yeast for a while to see if it affects the copperband. I also feed my live blackworms yeast every day and they are noticeable healthier and fatter and redder. It seemed to have a positive result on worms, so I figured I would try it on the tank. I used it many years ago but I forgot what benefit, if any it provided as that was the fish only days.

Ingredients in yeast:

No cholesterol

• No sodium

• No sugar

• High in dietary fiber

• Very high in niacin

• Very high in pantothenic acid

• Very high in riboflavin

• Very high in selenium

• Very high in thiamin

• Very high in vitamin B6

• Very high in vitamin B12

• Very high in zinc

 

[Paul B]

OK the lights came on and it gets weirder. The black coloration is in a few places but "only" on the orange parts of the fish. No where is any discoloration on the white parts which to me would rule out a disease. It seems to be a symptom of something in the pigments of the fish. There are quite a few chromatophores in fish " iridophores, leucophores, melanophores, xanthophores, erythrophores, cyanophores anderythro-iridophores (Hickman et al, 1995; Goda et al, 2013).

I am not sure if it is possible to have a condition that causes this in just one pigment, but it does seem logical now that I am looking at it.

 

[ahiggins]

Is it possible that it's a color morph brought on by those "ingredients" in the yeast?

 

[stevo01]

If not a bruise I would guess melanoma. In 2012 researches found melanoma like lesions on 15% of the coral trout caught on the great barrier reef.

 

[Paul B]

Is it possible that it's a color morph brought on by those "ingredients" in the yeast?

I would imagine it could be as that is the only change. I am stopping the yeast for now

If not a bruise I would guess melanoma. In 2012 researches found melanoma like lesions on 15% of the coral trout caught on the great barrier reef.

I was also thinking this, but not sure it would only manifest on the orange portions. But it is possible.
I find this extremely interesting.

 

[jenreefer]

I would imagine it could be as that is the only change. I am stopping the yeast for now



I was also thinking this, but not sure it would only manifest on the orange portions. But it is possible.
I find this extremely interesting.

I am wondering if it is a hyperpigmentation? some causes of this can be metabolic in nature. My other thought is that too much yeast will outcompete some of the normal/good bacteria in your system. Yeast and bacteria can get out of balance in other animals causing issues. Just some thoughts. I will be interested to see if it resolves when you cut back on the yeast.

 

[bios]

Ciao Paul melanoma attack melanocites of only particular cells
So you se it only orange portions

 

[Paul B]

Jen, it could be the yeast. It would be interesting if it is. The fish otherwise seems normal.
Bios, that makes sense. I think it will clear up, but we will see.
Isn't it a pleasure to not discuss parasites and all that occasionally.

 

[stevo01]

I am wondering if it is a hyperpigmentation? some causes of this can be metabolic in nature. My other thought is that too much yeast will outcompete some of the normal/good bacteria in your system. Yeast and bacteria can get out of balance in other animals causing issues. Just some thoughts. I will be interested to see if it resolves when you cut back on the yeast.

Hyperpigmentation was my next comment