Quarantine 40-50 fish from existing 500 gallon reef

[Jeffdstafford]

So, when I'm done with copper, is there any reason to take all the fish out of the QT and do a freshwater dip, or just move on directly to Prazi?

 

[Humblefish]

Can we see the little black dots on the bottom of a white bucket during a dip?

If memory serves, their color fades once exposed to freshwater. Not exactly white (like flukes), but more of a light grey color. It's been awhile since I've had to deal with black ich.

So, when I'm done with copper, is there any reason to take all the fish out of the QT and do a freshwater dip, or just move on directly to Prazi?

I would just move on to prazi.

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Sounds like a plan

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Just an update; end of tomorrow will be 2 weeks in on the copper treatment, all fish are doing great and no other casualties since I brought the copper level down to 2.0.

For the first time in 2 years, I'm dealing with an algae issue in the display tank, which is weird since I'm no longer feeding the tank other than some sporadic coral feeding, but not enough that should cause an algae outbreak. (I imagine I probably had an issue all along, but I had enough tangs to keep the issue hidden all the time by their grazing) I'm getting zero readings on my Hanna phosphate checker, and no nitrates on my NYOS test, however I know those are false negatives since I have algae.

I've been really curious about Lanthanum Chloride dosing for a year since GFO is VERY expensive on a 600 gallon system packed full of fish. I've done a lot of research on dosing it, and I found a good thread by Scott Leif detailing his usage of LC on his reef, which is similar in size and contents to my tank, and he's had good results with it. I was emailing with him yesterday and he told me about the Ultra Low Range Hanna Phosphorous reader that will test the low phosphate levels we maintain in our reefs vs the regular Phosphate reader, so I'm going to pick one of those up as well to get a better reading on my levels.

I am waiting for the IV dripper bag and 10 micron filter socks to arrive, and I'm going to see how it does in my system. I do have the bottle of LC, and got a glass of tank water and put a drop of LC in it, and it is crazy to watch it instantly precipitate PO4 out of the water..there was a lot of fallout, so I've got a lot of phosphates. Scott says he uses both GFO and LC in combination, but the LC allows the GFO to last longer and it's overall easier to maintain proper levels, so I think I'm going to go that route as long as I have good success.

I'll report back with results! If anyone else has used LC on their system, I'd love to hear first hand experiences.

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Just finished up a 2nd round of Lanthanum Chloride in the display tank, and it has gone very well. I bought very long 16" 10 micron filter socks, so I didn't have to change it out due to the large size, so 1 sock per round makes it very simple to do. The corals are actually looking better with great polyp extension, so no ill effects on the tank yet. My Hanna ultra low range phosphorous tester will be here mid week, so I'll be able to test levels to see where I'm at, but I'm hoping with another dose or two this week, I'll see the hair algae start to fade away.. We'll see.

Everyone is still doing well in the QT, only 1 yellow tang is struggling with turbellaria, but keeping an eye on everyone to make sure it doesn't get out of control.

Also, with some difficulty, I was able to confirm no fish in the overflows with a flashlight and my phone's camera, so that's a major relief! I've been keeping a close eye on the sump and am 99% sure there's nothing down there either, but haven't had the time to remove all the equipment.. As you can see from the picture, it's packed in like sardines! I'll get around to it soon, hopefully.

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Just a quick update everyone; I'm still alive and nothing really new to report, getting close to the 30 day mark on copper treatment and all fish are still doing great, will start PraziPro soon.

On the display tank, the algae issue has gone neutral, no more explosive algae growth but not going away either. Picked up the Hanna phosphorus test and somehow I've still got .06 phosphates, so I will continue my lanthanum chloride treatment. Did 2 rounds of it a couple weeks ago with no ill effects, and now that I have the low range phosphate tester I can see exactly how effective it is.. Will do another LC dose this weekend.

I guess with the cleaner water without fish, my corals have done really well and getting serious growth, but it's putting a large alk demand on the tank, and my large calcium reactor is barely keeping up. I've got an Avast Kalk stirrer and am going to tie that into the top off line this weekend hopefully and experiment with Kalk to see how the tank responds.

On a funny side note, occasionally I'll drop some food in the tank for all the hermit crabs, and I really need to film it next time..as soon as they sense the food in the water, they will all simultaneously jump off the top of my 3ft tall rock work in the tank and dive bomb the pellets on the sand...they have all become Base Jumper daredevils, quite entertaining!

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Oh, and since my tank addiction/sickness is on hold, I had to find an outlet for my obsessive tendencies and need to stay busy, so I picked up this little jewel..why are the best hobbies the most expensive ones?!

 

[Empress]

Oh, and since my tank addiction/sickness is on hold, I had to find an outlet for my obsessive tendencies and need to stay busy, so I picked up this little jewel..why are the best hobbies the most expensive ones?!

Um....nice.....but what is it?

 

[Humblefish]

Um....nice.....but what is it?

Here's a hint: If you see one of those hovering outside your bedroom window, close the curtains and call the cops.

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Um....nice.....but what is it?

I call it a ton o' fun; it's a quadcopter drone, the Autel X-Star Premium

Here's a hint: If you see one of those hovering outside your bedroom window, close the curtains and call the cops.

Humble, you are full of wisdom on so many subjects!

 

[Empress]

Here's a hint: If you see one of those hovering outside your bedroom window, close the curtains and call the cops.

LOL! Ok so it's one of those flying saucer thingies. Forgot what they're called. Droid?

 

[Empress]

Now that I'm thinking about it.....what in the world does that "thing" have to do with reefin? [emoji576]

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Now that I'm thinking about it.....what in the world does that "thing" have to do with reefin? [emoji576]

Absolutely nothing!

 

[Empress]

Absolutely nothing!

Unless you want to spy on your fish. [emoji872]

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Maybe I can find a way to automate the drone to drop in some pellet food all from the comfort of my couch!

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Need some input from the BrainTrust; end of today will complete my 30 days of copper, but I just thought of something potentially really bad that I did. Early on, I threw in a large block of MarinePure that was established from the main tank into the QT, and while the bacteria load from it did solve the ammonia issue in the beginning, did I jeopardize the effectiveness of the copper by introducing potential unhatched eggs inside the MarinePure that could go unhatched and unharmed beyond the copper's 30 days? *Note that my 30 day countdown of copper did not start until after I introduced that MarinePure block.

Not sure if I'm overthinking this or not, but wondering if I need to treat longer, or a 2nd round of copper. Thanks Team!

 

[melypr1985]

Need some input from the BrainTrust; end of today will complete my 30 days of copper, but I just thought of something potentially really bad that I did. Early on, I threw in a large block of MarinePure that was established from the main tank into the QT, and while the bacteria load from it did solve the ammonia issue in the beginning, did I jeopardize the effectiveness of the copper by introducing potential unhatched eggs inside the MarinePure that could go unhatched and unharmed beyond the copper's 30 days? *Note that my 30 day countdown of copper did not start until after I introduced that MarinePure block.

Not sure if I'm overthinking this or not, but wondering if I need to treat longer, or a 2nd round of copper. Thanks Team!

Here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to lay out the facts and let you decide what you want to do.

There are strains of ich where the tomont can stay on a hard surface, unhatched, for 72 days. Copper only kills the free swimming stage. If the strain of ich you had is the 72 day variant then bringing the copper down at this point would then allow your fish to be reinfected. If not, then your fish would probably be fine. So you have two choices. A: Remove the copper and watch for signs of ick coming back. If that happens then you're in for another 30 days of copper possibly extending your fallow period ect. B: Leave the copper in the QT for the full 76 day fallow period. I'll tell you now, that I've kept many fish in a copper system - at full therapeutic levels- for up to a year with no problems. Assuming your fish are all doing well in the copper then you shouldn't have any problems with it either.

Up to you sweetie. If it were me, and my fish, I would probably remove the copper and watch for symptoms since the 72 day variant isn't super common.

 

[Jeffdstafford]

Hmm, that's a tough one..I guess I never fully thought through the idea of the 72 day strain relating to the QT, even though I'm planning to go fallow for a full 3 months just to be overly cautious...guess I had a bit of a brain disconnect between the two systems.

Good to know you've done long term copper treatment successfully; I think I'm leaning that way since I want to eliminate all possibilities of not fully eradicating it from my system. I don't even want to think about the deep, dark depression I'd go into if I went through all of this just to see ich on the fish a week after they go back in!


I've kept a very close eye on all the fish daily, and the current survivors don't seem phased at all, so I'm going to keep at it, unless things take a turn for the worst, then I'll reconsider at that point.

Thanks Meredith!

 

[Brew12]

Here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to lay out the facts and let you decide what you want to do.

There are strains of ich where the tomont can stay on a hard surface, unhatched, for 72 days. Copper only kills the free swimming stage. If the strain of ich you had is the 72 day variant then bringing the copper down at this point would then allow your fish to be reinfected. If not, then your fish would probably be fine. So you have two choices. A: Remove the copper and watch for signs of ick coming back. If that happens then you're in for another 30 days of copper possibly extending your fallow period ect. B: Leave the copper in the QT for the full 76 day fallow period. I'll tell you now, that I've kept many fish in a copper system - at full therapeutic levels- for up to a year with no problems. Assuming your fish are all doing well in the copper then you shouldn't have any problems with it either.

Up to you sweetie. If it were me, and my fish, I would probably remove the copper and watch for symptoms since the 72 day variant isn't super common.

I've had some conversations with @Humblefish about this behind the scenes. I don't believe you have made a mistake. There is evidence that copper will kill ich in the encysted stage if exposed for the entire month.

What you have done is no difference than if you put fish into a QT, watch them for a few days, and then begin copper treatment. I hope he will come in and verify this, but I really think you will be fine.

 

[melypr1985]

I've had some conversations with @Humblefish about this behind the scenes. I don't believe you have made a mistake. There is evidence that copper will kill ich in the encysted stage if exposed for the entire month.

What you have done is no difference than if you put fish into a QT, watch them for a few days, and then begin copper treatment. I hope he will come in and verify this, but I really think you will be fine.

There very well may be. Honestly if it were me I'd just go for the 30 days and watch carefully the rest of the time. But, like I said, I wanted him to make his own decision. Some evidence doesn't equal fact.