14 Day Guarantee Policy Encourages Bad Husbandry

[heifinator]

I do think that the 14 day guarantee policy on corals is pretty generous of LA, however the fact that it was damaged during shipping and had BJD that was not given to it by one of your other corals is sketchy.

Since you notified them about the issues long before your 14 day policy was up, I feel that you were a good candidate for an extended warranty on your torch.

Did the other head on the torch survive? I may have misinterpreted something somewhere, but at this point I believe only the one head is dead when there were two?

The second head died on day ~15-16 and when I contacted them with a picture of the whole skeleton (in the same support email with the initial indication of damage a few days into warranty period, they denied the claim).

TLDR I have a dead skeleton a couple days outside guarantee and got no coverage.

 

[Perthegallon]

The second head died on day ~15-16 and when I contacted them with a picture of the whole skeleton (in the same support email with the initial indication of damage a few days into warranty period, they denied the claim).

TLDR I have a dead skeleton a couple days outside guarantee and got no coverage.

Tbh i would fight that on my card and be such a pain in the butt till they give it to you

 

[heifinator]

Sure it does as stated several times nothing can make a person do anything they are not already willing to do aka kill off somthing in order to get money rather then trying to save it knowing they might lose the money

Then you said
If it was a fish sure, I could see your argument, that is a living creature with a consciousness.

This is invalid as stated above

The policy is not the problem people are the problem and how they use the policy

This makes absolutely no logical sense, it seems more like you want to defend the policy of LA regardless of the logic behind why the policy is flawed.

Tbh i would fight that on my card

Technically they didn't break their policy. It died after 14 days ,I read the terms, I'd probably lose... Hence why I was pointing out, I would have been better off finishing the coral off and sending them a picture early.

 

[Perthegallon]

This makes absolutely no sense.



Technically they didn't break their policy. It died after 14 days ,I read the terms, I'd probably lose... Hence why I was pointing out, I would have been better off finishing the coral off and sending them a picture early.

But you did buy “two heads” and one head did die I mean I feel like that’s justified. Also second you paid for a healthy living coral not a coral that was infected with brown jelly did they really deliver on the item that they promised?

maybe I’m wrong I just feel that you didn’t get the item you paid for

 

[heifinator]

But you did buy “two heads” and one head did die I mean I feel like that’s justified. Also second you paid for a healthy living coral not a coral that was infected with brown jelly did they really deliver on the item that they promised?

The coral listing was actually for 1 head, but it had two. So their original argument on day 5, was that the dead head wasn't even purchased. I explained that this dead head was creating an infection in the other head I did pay for. They didn't care. It had to be dead before 14 days to get coverage...

 

[Perthegallon]

The coral listing was actually for 1 head, but it had two. So their original argument on day 5, was that the dead head wasn't even purchased. I explained that this dead head was creating an infection in the other head I did pay for. They didn't care. It had to be dead before 14 days to get coverage...

Yeah I got you I think the best ethical solution to this next time would be to find a picture of a dead coral and use that on the final day of the policy to get a new one then see if the one you’ve been sent comes back and if it does you could just simply tell the company you don’t want a replacement win win you don’t have to kill the coral and you don’t have to scam anyone

 

[heifinator]

Yeah I got you I think the best ethical solution to this next time would be to find a picture of a dead coral and use that on the final day of the policy to get a new one then see if the one you’ve been sent comes back and if it does you could just simply tell the company you don’t want a replacement win win you don’t have to kill the coral and you don’t have to scam anyone

I'm just going to take my money elsewhere. I've spent about $6,000 dollars with DF&S / LA over the last 10 years or so. Had maybe, 3 DOA's that entire time. First time I really need some help they deny it. I'm going to continue to recommend to others: Go elsewhere.

 

[jamie1210]

That's strange of them. In the past, if the coral doesn't look too great even after a week, when I call them, they've always let me extend the 14 day guarantee. Usually they give me another week. I think the last time I did that was about a year ago. I guess lots has changed since then (pandemic, change in ownership, etc?)

 

[Tankkeepers]

This makes absolutely no logical sense, it seems more like you want to defend the policy of LA regardless of the logic behind why the policy is flawed.



Technically they didn't break their policy. It died after 14 days ,I read the terms, I'd probably lose... Hence why I was pointing out, I would have been better off finishing the coral off and sending them a picture early.

Wow all it seems like no matter what anyone says you have to be right about why the policy is flawed reread what I put and if you can't comprehend what I'm saying then logic is not your friend and it sounds more like to me your mad and unwilling to see the bigger picture as a whole or you have used the policy to many times raising a red flag your lucky they even have that long of a policy as most wont cover anything other then doa if your that unhappy stop shopping there otherwise stop complaining peace I'm out

 

[Tankkeepers]

I will one last time try and explain myself as I'm not to good at it and mabey I have not done a good job so here it goes

Firstly you used encourages

This is not the same as allows

I was trying to point out that even if the policy allows people to take advantage of it by killing a living thing without remorse to get thier money back this policy does not encourage people who would otherwise not kill a living thing for money

either you will or you won't regardless of monitary losses or gains

Secondly I was pointing out that regardless of what the policy is weather its a 14 day guarantee or a doa only or no policy at all someone will take advantage of it

Third you said

If it was a fish sure, I could see your argument, that is a living creature with a consciousness

I was pointing out that coral are living things with consciousness not as advanced as ours but still conscious they know when they need to eat when to poop when something is harming them etc and to think otherwise is just plain stupid

I hope you can see my point

I am in no way defending what they said to you as I do not agree with it I have never and now will never shop there

But you also stated it was officially dead after tbe 14 day policy idk if you have tryed to take advantage of the policy to many times or not but there are alot of people who have im sure which is why im sure they are so strict on it being 14 days

This is the same as you trying to return anything else after the return policy they will not let you otherwise they have to let everyone and then where does it end 30 days 90 days 5 years

If this does not make logical sence to you then again sry but logic is not your friend

I will not be posting a follow up as this took a long time to put together and I'm tired of trying to get you to see that policys help consumers and without them we would be getting dead stuff all the time because the seller could with no reproduction not saying all would but enoff of them would not care

To all have a good night

 

[LiveAquaria]

@heifinator Good morning. We are sorry to hear of your dissatisfaction with our guarantee/warranty policies. For starters, we would never condone or encourage intentional harm to any live species. Often times, warranties are extended to allow for additional care for an animal that is not doing well. Please PM us your order information so we are able to review the details/history of your order and the service that was extended. Thank you and have a great Wednesday!

 

[heifinator]

I was pointing out that coral are living things with consciousness not as advanced as ours but still conscious they know when they need to eat when to poop when something is harming them etc and to think otherwise is just plain stupid

I hope you can see my point

Factually incorrect. Consciousness is an awareness of your existence. Corals do not have this. Not understanding the factual reality of what consciousness is just "plain stupid".

I never argued that LA's policy doesn't help consumers. There are edge cases where it is better for the consumer to kill their own corals, that is due to the rigidity of the policy.

You are arguing points that I don't disagree with... Not sure where you are even going with this?

 

[heifinator]

con·scious·ness
/ˈkän(t)SHəsnəs/

noun
the state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings

If you dont think coral are awake and aware of their surroundings your and idiot

I mean, really, its not that hard to understand

Corals are non-sentient life, so claiming they are conscious is at best, barely debatable. They meet at most 1 of the scientific criteria for consciousness...

I'm really unsure why you've taken this so personally and are now resorting to name calling?

It's "You're" by the way, not your.

 

[Tankkeepers]

In philosophy of self, self-awareness is the experience of one's own personality or individuality. It is not to be confused with consciousness in the sense of qualia. While consciousness is being aware of one's environment and body and lifestyle, self-awareness is the recognition of that awareness

 

[Tankkeepers]

They are aware of thier lifestyle what they need to do in order to live enviroment external stimulus like being harmed and body they need this so they know where they are currently at and do not just building right on top of another aka Zoe stacking rather then growing next to eachother in the same colony

 

[Tankkeepers]

And i dont care about grammer or spelling

 

[heifinator]

They are aware of thier lifestyle what they need to do in order to live enviroment external stimulus like being harmed and body they need this so they know where they are currently at and do not just building right on top of another aka Zoe stacking rather then growing next to eachother in the same colony

You're arguing for sport at this point it seems. For every test you could point to that corals pass for consciousness there are 5 tests they fail...

Educate yourself

I'm going to see myself out at this point though, if you want to make additional points or "win" go for it.

 

[Tankkeepers]

I have educated myself a whole lot mabey you should take your own advice and I'm not taking anything personally just poining out that your defence of why it's ok to harm corals as you stated earlier is not ok and wrong

 

[heifinator]

FYI, after posting this here publicly LA had a change of heart or resolved a mistake made by another rep and has fully resolved the issue to my satisfaction.

 

[Flame2hawk]

As an individual, my husbandry practices to save any ailing specimen when received does not change no matter what the policy. There are risks ordering online coupled with delivery by UPS, FEdEx, etc.The least we can do is try our hardest to save the creatures that often have been plucked from the oceans dspths- no matter what the policy. Some w/b encouraged to prematurely stop trying to get the credit...that is too bad as it is a terrible testimony of the hobby. Others will do the right things....so lets do the right thing as it is better to have the 14day guarantee then not....