A lot of led fixture question

A. grandis

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Yup I'm a die hard T5HO and Halide guy, but at the end of the day I work for my customers, so if they insist that we only use LED because they have some notion they're stuck on that changing bulbs or the 'heat' from a halide or T5 will be detrimental then I have to go with what they want. I always try to get the 'best' light for the health of my customers animals so I generally recommend and try to persuade them to go with halides, t5s, or both. And will usually suggest we add a royal blue strip with a remote so they can put that on in the evening when the main lights are out if they'd like to view the corals in crazy psychedelic color mode haha- which I think is great if that's what floats their boat and I feel like LEDs are really in their element when it comes to targeting spectrums like the royal blue for visual effect. I've never had someone whose tank I converted to T5 or halide say they wish they went back or their corals look better under LED. I have had people switch to LED and switch back to T5 though....
That is one of the reasons I've never went into the aquarium business.
I wouldn't be happy let 'em telling me what to run in many aspects.
I've got lot's of people saying I should do this for living. I actually do at home as a hobby though. Hehe.
I still have to work hard for money so I can pay my bills.
Good to share observations here!! Thanks!
Grandis.
 

A. grandis

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So having had a bunch of great growth once the LEDs were dialed in do you think that the problems you ran into were micro hotspots from the lens? That was always my assumption. That said the red planet i the middle of the tank shot grew from a frag to a 4" coral in about 10 months. That's pretty darn fast and it didn't run into the hot spot issue at all. Also if you look at all of those frags in the rack on the left you will see 5 or 6 red planets on 1" plugs. Those were only about 45 days old. The beach bum and other monties were all grown under MH and transferred to that tank but continues to grow albeit a little slower. That was under what would basically be 14 k - lots of blue/uv with whites tossed in at 30% to blue/uv. No green or reds. One thing about that tank to consider is that I was running RedSea A/B coral care products, had lots of fish that got fed twice daily, ran NoPox and kept my A/C/M at 12/500/1400. The tank also had 2 Gyres on either sides of the tank making a crazy amount of flow. High Energy tank. So there maybe something to consider with respect to highly usable (spectrum), densely packed protons and a need for available nutrients.
No, not hot spots from the lenses IMO. I believe that is a bit forgiven when the system has good water flow. Not that the corals won't "see" the difference, but maybe it wouldn't damage them. Unless the flow is compromised. That could be the case in some tanks though.

I had lots of flow with 6 Tunze powerheads on 24/7. hehe... I think what happens is that the colonies are "reading" the light as temporary boost and taking advantage of it to apply it's energy for extra growth, no matter how the intensity is, but the change in quality of light emitted from the diodes, and perhaps direction of light (?). Some times that also happens with halides and T5s when we introduce them into a new system and is normal, part of the adaptation period. But when they realize the new light isn't temporary, the colony shuts down tired and stops to drive that energy into "growth mode". With halides that growth slows down, with T5s sometimes it stops for a while and goes back to a fair growth rate, with LEDs the stress comes and makes the colony weak and the recession happens. I tried to turn the lights a bit lower when noticed the first tissue recession and some of the polyps were retracting loosing color and it actually got worse. The algae was under control and some of the colonies were starting to show the weird shapes and polyps were deformed after 8 to 10 months. We see that a lot in pictures of tanks under LEDs. People think that is normal, probably because they don't know better??? And if we use the relativism we can direct that to personal taste of "that's the way it is with that type of light". Acceptable? Maybe for some. Not my vision.

I think there are people who fully understand what happens and why halides and T5s are still to be the ultimate artificial light sources to offer, but they can't explain because there is lots of money involved in the aquarium market of LEDs.
The LEDs are acceptable and keep corals alive. The old T12s too. We can choose what we want. I choose what I think is the best for me.

You keep your params high and lots of water motion is great for reef tanks!
One thing I hear from people having hard corals is that some times the shapes change drastically when they change for LEDs and the skeletons are more fragile due to the initial "fast growth" under LEDs. Have you noticed anything like that with your corals?

Ah, the halide ics please..;)

Grandis.
 

Daltrey

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Ok, what ever you say.

It's not me saying it. It's Business Insider, CNN, FOX, Forbes, Car and Driver, Wikipedia, NADA guides, USA Today, Consumer Reports, AutoTrader and a few thousand other sites.

But you never know. I guess it's possible that the whole world could be wrong. Anything's Possible.

The chances are about the same as proving Einstein's Theory of Relativity Wrong though.

20180206_172135.jpg
 

A. grandis

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LOL!
I was holding myself, but...
I have a Ford too!
Haha!
Grandis.
 

Centerline

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Yes, some see also the same encrusting and branching observations you did.
Some say their LEDs were better for some corals and bad for others...
Many say the halides gave 'em an explosion of colors and growth, like I've experienced too!!
In my case with the LEDs I had a fast growth at first and then saw the shapes turning weird and very unnatural. I also noticed some tissue recession in some of the colonies which turned me off and I went back to T5s. As soon as I went back to T5s everything went great in that 125gal. Never changed my 75gal. and I'm still glad.
But I want my tank to be a slice of the ocean at home and therefore I compare to what I observe while snorkeling.
Some of local friends have LEDs and are "LED people" **LOL!** but when I point things out, they actually can see what I mean and agree, but it's aways like... "it's just that I don't like to change bulbs", or " it would be too hot and I'll need chiller" kinda deal.
I understand we do what we can and like.
Not a big deal anymore. LOL!
I guess I'm just a halide/T5 kinda guy until I can proof anything scientifically. Hehe.

Please don't forget to post the pics with halides...;)
Grandis.
So here are a few pictures of my MH tank - this is a Deep Blue 80 that at the time most of these were shot was a year - year and a half old - no particular order chronologically. Not overly impressive in themselves - all the sps grown from nubs - but enough to speak to the overall vitality of the tank. Somewhere I have more pictures that show the tank just before being broken down and if you would like Ill dig around for them - there is a pretty impressive collection of montie frags in that batch (frag rack in the LED tank) so I may dig around for them anyway. In July of last year the tank was broke down to make room for a 525 build that has been dragging out for ever for various reasons. I also included a picture of my dog for your viewing please and a few shots after the dog of a small 20 I have under T5s.
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A. grandis

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Love all the shots!
How did you know I love dogs? Man, I keep looking when I see some of the avatars with dog pictures. LOL!
I can't have a dog cause my condo rules. I look around for dogs around on the street. My kids go crazy with this. The dogs seem to know who likes them too. Hehe...

That fixture is the best, isn't it?
Some say the Spectra runs hot. How did you deal with the heat.
That IS the "holy grail" of the fixtures IMHO.
Sure, get more pictures posted, if you can. :)
What bulbs and ballasts you had running with the Spectra?
Grandis.
 

Centerline

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Love all the shots!
How did you know I love dogs? Man, I keep looking when I see some of the avatars with dog pictures. LOL!
I can't have a dog cause my condo rules. I look around for dogs around on the street. My kids go crazy with this. The dogs seem to know who likes them too. Hehe...

That fixture is the best, isn't it?
Some say the Spectra runs hot. How did you deal with the heat.
That IS the "holy grail" of the fixtures IMHO.
Sure, get more pictures posted, if you can. :)
What bulbs and ballasts you had running with the Spectra?
Grandis.
The fixture is the best so far as fixtures go though you can get a better bang for your buck with quality pendants such as the Caymen Sthun and the Lumin reflectors (if you can find them).
The Spectra runs no hotter than any other MH fixture as far as I can tell and Ive ran a bunch of MH gear over the years.
For heat - if your planning on running MH plan on running a chiller, or plan on killing your tank sooner or later.
I have ran both M80s and Electronic. I really cant tell much difference except in shading. I did however just score a new set of Hamilton M80s.
My bulb of choice would be a Radium with the Giesemann 21k Megachrome in second place - lots of other great bulbs out there though.
 

A. grandis

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The fixture is the best so far as fixtures go though you can get a better bang for your buck with quality pendants such as the Caymen Sthun and the Lumin reflectors (if you can find them).
The Spectra runs no hotter than any other MH fixture as far as I can tell and Ive ran a bunch of MH gear over the years.
For heat - if your planning on running MH plan on running a chiller, or plan on killing your tank sooner or later.
I have ran both M80s and Electronic. I really cant tell much difference except in shading. I did however just score a new set of Hamilton M80s.
My bulb of choice would be a Radium with the Giesemann 21k Megachrome in second place - lots of other great bulbs out there though.
I scored a dual BlueWave M80 a while ago and it looks very good.
I have to replace the switch though.
I had PFOs (fixtures and ballast) back in the day and would get the Spectra now with a LuxCore or the BlueWave running, if I decide to set up a new system.
I imagine the heat from the Spectra would be just like other fixtures. Thanks for confirming that! Fans between the fixture and the water surface should do a great job dissipating the heat too. I know how nice would be to get some of the old pendants too, but the combination with the T5s would allow me to run the halides less hours during the summer months 'cause my house gets too hot sometimes. Yeah, chiller is the way to go even with my T5s here. Better be safe than sorry. My chiller runs mostly afternoon time.
Would run Radiums for 250W bulbs, or Ushios for 175W bulbs, whatever would be the best for the size tank.
Thanks very much! Post more pictures if you find them..;)
Grandis.
 

A. grandis

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Rock On!
Just a quick note. I hunted forever for a sfiligoi MH/T5 light back in the day to get away from my PFO MH/T12 fixture. That was what I called the "The best lighting fixture Pendant" I had ever seen. Unfortunately I never got the chance to purchase one and see what they looked like.
Found the other video I wanted to show you:

Grandis.
 

Roy 9121

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It's not me saying it. It's Business Insider, CNN, FOX, Forbes, Car and Driver, Wikipedia, NADA guides, USA Today, Consumer Reports, AutoTrader and a few thousand other sites.

But you never know. I guess it's possible that the whole world could be wrong. Anything's Possible.

The chances are about the same as proving Einstein's Theory of Relativity Wrong though.

20180206_172135.jpg
You don't seem to get it. Gm has 2 truck name plates, GMC and chevy. They both sell the same truck, the Silverado/Serria. Combined, they sell more then Ford does. But, you know what? It's not important.
 

Centerline

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I scored a dual BlueWave M80 a while ago and it looks very good.
I have to replace the switch though.
I had PFOs (fixtures and ballast) back in the day and would get the Spectra now with a LuxCore or the BlueWave running, if I decide to set up a new system.
I imagine the heat from the Spectra would be just like other fixtures. Thanks for confirming that! Fans between the fixture and the water surface should do a great job dissipating the heat too. I know how nice would be to get some of the old pendants too, but the combination with the T5s would allow me to run the halides less hours during the summer months 'cause my house gets too hot sometimes. Yeah, chiller is the way to go even with my T5s here. Better be safe than sorry. My chiller runs mostly afternoon time.
Would run Radiums for 250W bulbs, or Ushios for 175W bulbs, whatever would be the best for the size tank.
Thanks very much! Post more pictures if you find them..;)
Grandis.
Honestly I think you could get away with running MHs for about 4 hours a day. I'm assuming a 4 hour ramp up and down with T5s - I really like a longer viewing time though it may not be best for growth. That said I had a 180 packed full of SPS that I ran 8 - 80 watt T5 for 12 hours a day and 3 DE 250s for 5 hours. No problems aside from heat.
 

A. grandis

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Honestly I think you could get away with running MHs for about 4 hours a day. I'm assuming a 4 hour ramp up and down with T5s - I really like a longer viewing time though it may not be best for growth. That said I had a 180 packed full of SPS that I ran 8 - 80 watt T5 for 12 hours a day and 3 DE 250s for 5 hours. No problems aside from heat.
Right now I run my T5s for 9 hours a day total and that is plenty for what I have in there.
On the spot for growth and colors for that particular tank.
Yes, my halides will probably be on for only 3 to 5 hours a day after tank is mature and the T5s will be in the 9 hours photoperiod.
Gotta love halides, man! I just kicked the bucket and eat some fried fish. Don't tell my doctor, please! Hehe... Still love your avatar!
Grandis.
 
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