Algae Scrubbers/Refugium's too efficient for my own good, is it right for me, and do I need one?

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tippin.turtle

tippin.turtle

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Realizing there are many ways to skin the same cat and that there is always more than one solution to a problem. I'm choosing bio pellets because there is an upside that macro algae's fail to provide and that's an additional source of coral nutrition; mainly a vehicle for transport of phosphate via bacteria.
This is my tank and the corals within in it and NO "macro algae's" are being used as a form of nutrient control.

 
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stephj03

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It turned one year old three days ago on the 13th

Have you had a reef tank longer than a yr before?

I think you're getting mixed feedback here bc you've taken a really strong position on a premise that doesn't completely jive well with the progression of the hobby over the last 20yrs or so.

And at the same time, some of the strengths and weaknesses of the different approaches/tools that you bring up seem to be improperly matched to one tool vs another.
 

stephj03

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Refugiums have been a simple, effective and self regulating tool for much longer than carbon dosing, especially in the context of biopellets.

Pellets made a huge splash in the hobby around 2009 as an add on to carbon dosing but waned in popularity, and a lot of ppl have now returned to fuges.

If you search through the old threads on it, you'll find that a lot of noobs had difficulty dosing properly and had issues with carbon dosing and rapid nutrient drops.

Just search NoPox issue and you'll see a ton of them.
 
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tippin.turtle

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That’s a lot of stuff for such a young tank.
It's running great and for the record no Macro Algae's have been harmed during the process...lol! :p
I do get annoyed at times with those who believe I'm "full of it" when clearly I have evidence of some
degree of success without following the conventional wisdom of present day reefing philosophy.
I just think reefers are trading up for an inferior approach(macro algae) to what I view is being left in the dust bend
of reefing history(bio pellets) without careful consideration.
 

stephj03

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You should absolutely stick with what you have setup bc the results speak for themselves.

But unfortunately for a lot of noobs, it's common for carbon dosing with pellets to unfold as a complicated, failure prone method that can overpower a normal nutrient/microbiome maturation by pushing it too fast.
 
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tippin.turtle

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Have you had a reef tank longer than a yr before?

I think you're getting mixed feedback here bc you've taken a really strong position on a premise that doesn't completely jive well with the progression of the hobby over the last 20yrs or so.

And at the same time, some of the strengths and weaknesses of the different approaches/tools that you bring up seem to be improperly matched to one tool vs another.
Yes, I have had reef tanks in the past. This is my first bare bottom tank. Really more interested in propagation aspect of the hobby at this juncture than I am in a "display" tank.
As for improper matching, I'm not sure in what respect? Perhaps carbon dosing and utilization of bio pellets is confusing to some but it is the same.
 

stephj03

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Some who have invested time and money will cling to the advocacy of a refugium's use and will not hear of an relatively older more effective practice.


Naw man,. The line above was the one that first stuck out to me as improperly matched.

But then I went back and re-read and you've got a bunch of them all through your posts.
 

stephj03

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When I first read that line I quoted above, I thought "wow, most hobbyists I know would have said this about carbon dosing".

A lot of your main points here come across that way
 
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You should absolutely stick with what you have setup bc the results speak for themselves.

But unfortunately for a lot of noobs, it's common for carbon dosing with pellets to unfold as a complicated, failure prone method that can overpower a normal nutrient/microbiome maturation by pushing it too fast.
I agree with you. As a new reefer I too had difficulty with bio pellets. Too much too fast. I will admit I was apprehensive to try them again but I realized from my previous experience that greater care on my part was required. I like them and find it so much easier than maintaining a refugium and all the hassles associated with them. Another part of me questions if its merely a marketing ploy by industry leaders to increase revenues. Larger sumps require more acrylic, fancy grow lights, additives to battle fluctuations in phosphates/nitrates, etc. :D
 

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A lot of the things you find as strengths for a given tool are commonly thought if as weaknesses by those that extensively use those tools.

And the same for a lot if the weaknesses. A lot if them are commonly seen as the opposite of your read on them.

I dig it though, little bit of contrarian is always good to keep everyone thinking and honest about their toolbox.
 
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Naw man,. The line above was the one that first stuck out to me as improperly matched.

But then I went back and re-read and you've got a bunch of them all through your posts.
Interesting. Well anytime one spends money on something the believe is the "best practice" it will be extremely difficult to convince them otherwise as they are "invested".
Well I'm trying to maintain my position through out but it can be difficult when responding to others. I'll keep trying...lol:D
 

stephj03

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I agree with you. As a new reefer I too had difficulty with bio pellets. Too much too fast. I will admit I was apprehensive to try them again but I realized from my previous experience that greater care on my part was required. I like them and find it so much easier than maintaining a refugium and all the hassles associated with them. Another part of me questions if its merely a marketing ploy by industry leaders to increase revenues. Larger sumps require more acrylic, fancy grow lights, additives to battle fluctuations in phosphates/nitrates, etc. :D


Idk about that. I could say the same thing about the pellets, reactor, feed pump, carbon source I wouldn't have otherwise bought....

It's no secret that a lot if the "scientific" data behind carbon dosing/pellets is carried out/marketed by mfg of the above products.

There is a nearly insignificant amount of interest in the peer review marine scientific community about the effect of carbon dosing in nature.


Now, interest in management of nutrients by macroalgals in the wild is another story.
 

stephj03

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The reason you see fuges coming back is bc they are an old school, fundamentally sound workhorse type tool.

Ppl ditched them for plenum and then went back
Then ditched them for DSB and went back
Then ditched them for bare bottom and went back
Then same with Zeo
Then same with carbon dosing
Then same with ultra low residuals

And now things are swinging back now that ppl are thinking more about nutrient throughput than residuals.

No matter what the fad, the fuge will be waiting for us when that fad dissapoints the avg reefer

And ppl will swing back to it bc it gives them minimal failure points, gradual self-regulating nutrient depletion, Easy to read performance feedback and minimal entry cost
 
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I see your point. I have a manifold with several ports and a secondary pump on my reef tank hard plumbed should I need it if the primary should fail. Something you think about knowing how expensive livestock can be. I have many tools at my disposal should I need them. Wisdom perhaps gained from experience.
Carbon dosing is not an issue in nature as the micro fauna is absurdly more vast and extensive than what is found in a typical reef aquarium. Anything that leverages a greater population of beneficial bacteria in your aquarium is adventitious, a bio pellet reactor or any form of carbon dosing accomplishes that goal. A refugium on the other hand does not.
 

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Algae have been using nutrients for 1.6 billion years. LOL. and it’s sugar exudates and photosynthetically derived D.O.M feeding bacteria and micro fauna for just as long.
I agree about the fuge lights, a £12, 30watt, 5000kelvin led floodlight from DIY outlets works very well, I ditched my blurple light.
 
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