alot of fish dead this morning? @^&&$$@$^%^$%5

Jay Hemdal · Oct 9, 2020

david campbell said:
that's just it...all inverts are fine.
and yes everything should be dead that's why i wondering about the sailfin going all Michael Myers during the night. not once but twice now..
my dose was set at 2 mls once a day and I refilled my 500 ml bottle on 10-1-20 and this morning 7 days later it was empty.

yes my pump and liq is sitting above my sump on a shelve as it has been for a long time.
iodine is not normally considered a fish killer this is also why I'm confused. I have a lot of leathers so I chose to dose iodine. I can live without it going forward.-

IMO - the fish dying when all of the invertebrates are fine always points to a disease issue.
Jay

Miller535 · Oct 9, 2020

I also hope if you decide to do something different then you don't swear off corals all together. Maybe pull back to softies and some lps. I'd hate to see you give up over a few set backs.

Brew12 · Oct 9, 2020

Is it possible you have some recurring event that is causing low oxygen levels periodically?

I wouldn't be surprised if the Sailfin is at least partially responsible. A 150g tank is pretty small for them and yours is still growing. A stress event such as a disease or change in water chemistry may be what it takes to push him to being aggressive. I would consider this even more strongly if he is acting completely normal while the other fish stop doing well.

Regardless, I'm very sorry for your losses. It stinks.

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

UPDATE. Found my emporer on his side this morning once again struggling to breath, so odd, up an down. Lethargic not Lethargic, fish is fine one day and in bad shape the next morning... thats it.. I have pulled all the remaining fish out bought a larger tank for Qt and going to buy more fish. However im going to let my display sit fish empty for 4-6 weeks. To insure i kill any disease. Im not quiting. But I have not added fish for a very long time. And my food is highly loaded with vitamins. So do diseases just appear? This morning the emporer did look velvety and since he's been in qt he's once again rebounded. I mean what happend did the disease fairy just stop by. what the heck, but im going to rule out diseases by letting the tank sit empty. Well my little damsel is still in there but im not going to tear down the scaping to catch him that little qtr size fish. Or should i? Also, tang is still unaffected. But I pulled him out and put in QT just to be safe.

Brew12 · Oct 10, 2020

david campbell said:
UPDATE. Found my emporer on his side this morning once again struggling to breath, so odd, up an down. Lethargic not Lethargic, fish is fine one day and in bad shape the next morning... thats it.. I have pulled all the remaining fish out bought a larger tank for Qt and going to buy more fish. However im going to let my display sit fish empty for 4-6 weeks. To insure i kill any disease. Im not quiting. But I have not added fish for a very long time. And my food is highly loaded with vitamins. So do diseases just appear? This morning the emporer did look velvety and since he's been in qt he's once again rebounded. I mean what happend did the disease fairy just stop by. what the heck, but im going to rule out diseases by letting the tank sit empty. Well my little damsel is still in there but im not going to tear down the scaping to catch him that little qtr size fish. Or should i? Also, tang is still unaffected. But I pulled him out and put in QT just to be safe.

If you have even 1 fish in your DT, fish diseases can continue to reproduce and they will not be eradicated from the tank.

Tamberav · Oct 10, 2020

david campbell said:
UPDATE. Found my emporer on his side this morning once again struggling to breath, so odd, up an down. Lethargic not Lethargic, fish is fine one day and in bad shape the next morning... thats it.. I have pulled all the remaining fish out bought a larger tank for Qt and going to buy more fish. However im going to let my display sit fish empty for 4-6 weeks. To insure i kill any disease. Im not quiting. But I have not added fish for a very long time. And my food is highly loaded with vitamins. So do diseases just appear? This morning the emporer did look velvety and since he's been in qt he's once again rebounded. I mean what happend did the disease fairy just stop by. what the heck, but im going to rule out diseases by letting the tank sit empty. Well my little damsel is still in there but im not going to tear down the scaping to catch him that little qtr size fish. Or should i? Also, tang is still unaffected. But I pulled him out and put in QT just to be safe.

You can not leave the damsel or any disease can continue to reproduce. Minimum NO fish for 6 weeks for velvet. Also no cross contamination of hands or equipment or anything wet or you start over.

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

Well I guess it me, the damsel an a six pack tonight, nevertheless less why did a disease just appear (still nort sure it is a disease anyway) We have not added nothing to the tank for many months. Are damsels sailfin tangs an leerod wrasse immune to velvet? Cause they are still not affected in the least. My reasons for doing this task sit is to rule out disease not to confirm it was disease that caused the random deaths of some fish. An my oxygen level is at 435

Hugh Mann · Oct 10, 2020

Some fish are more resistant to diseases than others. When I had velvet they were dying in batches, days apart. Only two ever showed the spots, and that was two converted black mollies.

That being said, if nothing wet has entered or come near your tank in months, I don't see how it could be a disease, even if all signs point towards it. I don't think it's possible for something like velvet to lay dormant, or can it?

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

What about voltage?

Viking_Reefing · Oct 10, 2020

I must say that this sounds like something that would happen if your oxygen crashed for whatever reason.
It seems odd that a disease would present itself in such a catastrophic way months after adding the last fish.

Tamberav · Oct 10, 2020

Hugh Mann said:
Some fish are more resistant to diseases than others. When I had velvet they were dying in batches, days apart. Only two ever showed the spots, and that was two converted black mollies.

That being said, if nothing wet has entered or come near your tank in months, I don't see how it could be a disease, even if all signs point towards it. I don't think it's possible for something like velvet to lay dormant, or can it?

It can. Less likely than ich but it sure can.

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

Well I've got both hospital tanks running now. All survivors in, along with all new ones i bought today. The plan is to do a mass intro into the dt in about a month,, hoping that reduces the my territory issue..Im also going to put a crap ton of carbon and carbon pads in my sump an test for stray voltage along with 2 massive WC over the next month 70 or larger.. its all i can come up with. I will say that the dt seems to be full of dust in appearance, not that crystal clear look im use to an im running ozone an doing a water 2 large WC's.Whats even more confusing in my emporer. This morning he was once again on deaths bed, but this evening once again he's right as rain in the hospital tank. Its like nothing was ever wrong. I love and hate this hobby. I had my C C STAR get ground up in my return pump about a week or so ago I've read they hold toxins. An all 3 of my LFS test my water an all said your good to go.

vetteguy53081 · Oct 10, 2020

very good on a couple of things mentioned and I commend you:

- Going Fowler
- Setting up a QT tank
- Not giving up

I would suggest an ICP test also to confirm anything that may be off ar any false readings will be revealed.

Brew12 · Oct 10, 2020

The one thing that baffles me is that you said you did a large water change and fish recovered. That doesn't seem like a disease issue based on that. I know your oxygen is good now, but have you ever tested it when you have seen problems with your fish?
I do like the idea of running a lot of carbon. I think that is wise at this point.

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

I agree on the wc not disease cause almost dead then a wc = return to normL then next morning back to death bed.
have never tracked the orp levels until 2 months ago when I went to ozone. I have the Milwaukee control set to turn on my generator if orp falls below 350. An it now hovers around 450.

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

I found a solution. And thanks for the support I love this hobby and my fish. There no going back

Brew12 · Oct 10, 2020

david campbell said:
I agree on the wc not disease cause almost dead then a wc = return to normL then next morning back to death bed.
have never tracked the orp levels until 2 months ago when I went to ozone. I have the Milwaukee control set to turn on my generator if orp falls below 350. An it now hovers around 450.

Wow, that is a very high ORP. Mine is normally under 300. I have no idea how ORP and oxygen content are related, if they are. That is advanced beyond my level. Did you have any problems before putting the ozone online?

ddc0715 · Oct 10, 2020

No problems before ozone installed about two months ago. Bare with me here... most research about ozone said to run a hard line outside into a air dryer then into the ozone generator then into the skimmer, also to block off all other air ports on the skimmer. I did this. And this caused my skimmer water column to be almost at the top to skim.. so I just now uncovered one of my additional air ports and the skimmer is now foaming like normal. Is it possible I was suffocating my tank? Not sure why because it was still pulling in air right

Brew12 · Oct 11, 2020

david campbell said:
No problems before ozone installed about two months ago. Bare with me here... most research about ozone said to run a hard line outside into a air dryer then into the ozone generator then into the skimmer, also to block off all other air ports on the skimmer. I did this. And this caused my skimmer water column to be almost at the top to skim.. so I just now uncovered one of my additional air ports and the skimmer is now foaming like normal. Is it possible I was suffocating my tank? Not sure why because it was still pulling in air right

Sorry, I'm not an ozone user, so I'm not sure what the possible impact of this would be. I'd say it is at least possible that you were starving your tank of oxygen. It may only have been during certain times or events in the tank where oxygen demand went up.

Miller535 · Oct 12, 2020

It sounds like you have a few things going on. I can not say if you have a disease or not. I have heard so many times people say things like you, that they havent added anything in so long, why a disease now. But the thing with fish disease is if it is in your tank and you are on top of water quality and feeding quality fish food, often times there immune systems are strong enough to fight it off to the point where YOU can now visibly see it but it is not there. Humblefish had a post years ago talking about this. He called it ich management vs ich eradication. It it he said you could manage it, but know that a stressful event can suppress their immune systems, and they end up full on sick. A stressful event can be a new fish added, water quality getting away from you, a major overdose like you had with the idone, or various other things. If you did not qt and medicate all of your fish in qt when you got them, and of them can cause diseases to outbreak in your tank, even years later.