Ammonia and Nitrite no change after 13 days…fishless???

[TIDE09]

I cycled tanks and a 1000+ gallon pond before without any issues and understand it takes some time, however I find it concerning that I see no change at 13 days. Tank was wet on 8/13. RO water, used Prime to make sure everything was good. Caribisea live sand and dry rock. Added ammonia to 3.6ppm and Fritz. 1 week in, ammonia is still at 3.6ppm and nitrite was at 1.9ppm.

1 week goes by, no change. I added BIO-Spira. Maybe I got a bad batch of Fritz, who knows.

I am at day 13 and ammonia and nitrite is still at 3.6ppm and 1.9ppm. Testing every 3 days (Mon, Wed, Fri) Hanna Checkers.

Temp was between 81 - 87 (now), pH consistant at 7.9, salinity 1.027 - 1.025, and the water is aerated from the VCA return.

I for sure thought I see something changing within 13 days.

Might do a water change and redose ammonia to 2ppm. I do have some leftover shrimp in the refridge that is temping me as well.

Edit: NitrAte is at 20ppm now?? Using API test kit for this parameter.

 

[Lavey29]

Why are you running so hot? I wouldn't do a water change yet. Add some nitrifying bacteria and then only test for nitrate. There is no reason to test nitrite.

 

[TIDE09]

I bumped the temp up a few days ago to help the cycle since I wasn’t seeing anything change. I just did a nitrAte test and it shows 20ppm (API saltwater test kit)?? Now I am even more confused as to what is going on.

 

[Dalalen]

It took my tank 60 plus days to cycle fully and that's with the sterile method. I remember not seeing nitrite until around 30 days. You might not see anything for a good month or two.

Did you add any liverock or sand with bacteria? Also try to keep your temperature more stable. Like less than 1 degree swings.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

I thought Instant ocean makes bio - spra. It could of been missed stored in the heat or something. Why don't you get a different bottle of something else dr tims or turbo starter fritz. Pour in sit and wait patients is important in this hobby. Cycles can be take 5 days to 2 months it just depends sometimes. I wouldn't worry till the 4th week.

If you want get an ammonia test kit from a different brand because API is kind of a ball park estimate rather then the most accurate but don't do to many things at once. I know your excited and trust me worrying about a cycle is not worth it. Just sit and let it happen and do research on your 6 month 1 year and 2 year goals and stocking list.

 

[TIDE09]

It took my tank 60 plus days to cycle fully and that's with the sterile method. I remember not seeing nitrite until around 30 days. You might not see anything for a good month or two.

Did you add any liverock or sand with bacteria? Also try to keep your temperature more stable. Like less than 1 degree swings.

But I am seeing nitrIte now? Thought for sure that once I see nitrIte i’d see ammonia start to drop And nitrIte rise.

No liverock, sand was caribsea so I guess it would be considered “live”.

I thought Instant ocean makes bio - spra. It could of been missed stored in the heat or something. Why don't you get a different bottle of something else dr tims or turbo starter fritz. Pour in sit and wait patients is important in this hobby. Cycles can be take 5 days to 2 months it just depends sometimes. I wouldn't worry till the 4th week.

If you want get an ammonia test kit from a different brand because API is kind of a ball park estimate rather then the most accurate but don't do to many things at once. I know your excited and trust me worrying about a cycle is not worth it. Just sit and let it happen and do research on your 6 month 1 year and 2 year goals and stocking list.

Fritz Turbo Start was frist, then added bio-spra because I thought the same. Ammonia test is from Hanna.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

Wait another week before touching it then. Really make sure to clean that Hannah checker tube finger prints can add higher levels. Post back in a week if by end of week 3 nothing happens we can talk about next steps but I would ride it out.

 

[TIDE09]

Wait another week before touching it then. Really make sure to clean that Hannah checker tube finger prints can add higher levels. Post back in a week if by end of week 3 nothing happens we can talk about next steps but I would ride it out.

I clean it prior to the control and test with a microfiber. I’ll ride it out. In the mean time i’ll look into my CUC and corals.

 

[TIDE09]

Today, did a check on the system. Pleasantly surprised that my NitrIte dropped from 1.9ppm to .5ppm. However, Ammonia is the same at 3ppm…or so I thought. I checked the range on the Hanna Ammonia checker and that max is 3.0ppm. So this is making sense now, I overdosed Ammonia from the start. By how much? Not sure.

Broke out the ol trusty API test kit - .5ppm from what I can see. Well that is odd, wasn’t dark at all compared to the 2ppm, 4ppm, or 8ppm color chart.

So I took some RO water in my ATO reservoir to the Hanna checker, 0.2ppm so verified that is working. But am I auto dosing ammonia water causing the ammonia to stay a constant 3ppm?

I would think that as NitrIte appears that Ammonia would drop since it is being converted to NitrIte.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

Do you mean RODI water or RO water where are you getting your water. If your replacing 3 ppm water with .25ppm your actually diluting it rather then adding to it.

 

[tankstudy]

When using bottled bacteria you do not want to overdose on the ammonia. Also you don't want to dose and test for ammonia, as the test will not be accurate most of the time. That's why it's important you get a known concentration of ammonia to dose the system. If you have a large amount of initial bacteria, nitrite will skyrocket and at a certain number, bacterial growth and consumption of ammonia slow drastically, almost to a halt. The trouble shoot for this is issue to do a water change to bring nitrite down below usually ~5 ppm or literally wait till the bacteria do it, which could be A VERY LONG time as consumption is slowed drastically.

It's best to start with 1.0 ppm ammonia or less and letting the system consume all of that first to 0 ppm ammonia. After it can consume 1.0 ppm ammonia in 24 hours, you can ramp up the dosage to 2.0 ppm ammonia to build even more bacteria. Some hobbyists will push all the way to 4.0 ppm as they plan to stock a lot of fish and corals at once.

This is a common issue in bottled bacteria startups. Too much ammonia on the opener and the overwhelming high levels of nitrite inhibit further development of the bacteria, therefore slowing things down drastically.

 

[TIDE09]

Do you mean RODI water or RO water where are you getting your water. If your replacing 3 ppm water with .25ppm your actually diluting it rather then adding to it.

RODI water is what I am using for my ATO. The RODI water in the reservoir is .2ppm

When using bottled bacteria you do not want to overdose on the ammonia. Also you don't want to dose and test for ammonia, as the test will not be accurate most of the time. That's why it's important you get a known concentration of ammonia to dose the system. If you have a large amount of initial bacteria, nitrite will skyrocket and at a certain number, bacterial growth and consumption of ammonia slow drastically, almost to a halt. The trouble shoot for this is issue to do a water change to bring nitrite down below usually ~5 ppm or literally wait till the bacteria do it, which could be A VERY LONG time as consumption is slowed drastically.

It's best to start with 1.0 ppm ammonia or less and letting the system consume all of that first to 0 ppm ammonia. After it can consume 1.0 ppm ammonia in 24 hours, you can ramp up the dosage to 2.0 ppm ammonia to build even more bacteria. Some hobbyists will push all the way to 4.0 ppm as they plan to stock a lot of fish and corals at once.

This is a common issue in bottled bacteria startups. Too much ammonia on the opener and the overwhelming high levels of nitrite inhibit further development of the bacteria, therefore slowing things down drastically.

Yea think I overdosed it somehow. I followed the direction on the bottle. Going to start doing 20% water changes to see what that gets me.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

In this hobby I always start with a half dose of the instructed amount and see how it does for a little bit before increasing the amount. Usually once you get to corals you don't see the effect for a couple weeks and the amount you did 2 weeks ago was probably the correct dose. Only exception is medicine to treat fish.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

Also your RODI unit should get you to zero levels if done correctly is it a brand new unit and was everything hooked up correctly with the correct pressure?

 

[TIDE09]

Noted. I'll do 20% water change tonight to remove the ammonia and go from there.

The RODI water that I use is not from my own system, so I can't say for sure. I'm going to invest in a system for my house in the near future

 

[brandon429]

Tide

You dosed ammonia controllers at the start, those foul your test kits, you're basing cycle status on a fouled reading.


Post a full tank shot of your setup I'll point out a detail in the pic regarding rocks and placement

And fritz has already been charted by others, as well as the extra bac you added, we know their completion dates. You're long past and thankfully amquel or prime didn't kill filter bacteria. You are misreading the real levels and your cycle is done. Please add fish and update us with a new pic showing the fish

B

Then I'll use you thread for an example of a fixed cycle on page 34 of our giant fix a cycle thread.

 

[brandon429]

Why would I advise add fish to a concerned cycler?

- false reading
- adding ammonia controller at the start, which nobody recommends in our forums though a pet store party might recommend (a sale)
- fritz has already been tracked for working dates when a misread isn't in play. It is, here.
- you added other bac we've already tracked
- use of prime doesn't kill bac
- fritz works the same day you add it
- your scape has rocks in the center circulation mass and they are high surface area vs smooth round stones, you're cycled. Add fish, show pics

 

[TIDE09]

 

[brandon429]

I'm positive it will carry fish. Have your salinity set to about 1.024 and then just put them in, don't do a ten min float etc these aren't lethal conditions in nano tanks given this long after bac has had time to work. I see more stresses from acclimation issues than we ever ever see for a fish dying due to a failed cycle, Ive never seen that occur.

Its rumored to the point we believe it happens daily, but literally try and find 1 read on the web anytime recently of someone putting fish into a bottle bac cycle and the fish didn't live. I know of 0 instances.

*technically you need to know that Jay's fish disease forum advises doing careful disease preps, in this case adding strictly pre quarantined fish vs pet store fish without preps (bc they put disease into the tank)

depending on your fish disease controls you'd regulate fish input but the actual cycle itself is ok. Do about a 50% water change before adding for reasons of algae, and current waste in the system + more coming, not because there's bad ammonia in the water now/misread.

 

[TIDE09]

10-4. Still working on getting quarantined fish so i'm a few weeks out before adding. I would like to start a clean up crew awhile tho and some corals.