Angel fish looking terrible. What can I treat in fowlr display?

[Subliminal]

Hey all, have a fowlr tank with the following fish:

emporer angel juvi
Panther grouper juvi
Stars and Stripes puffer juvi
Niger trigger juvi

the angel came in last and appears to be a little under the weather. I never plan on getting going reef in this particular tank (I guess obvious from fish choices) and going fallow here isn’t an option.

how should I treat?

thanks!

 

[hoffmeyerz]

That looks like a lot ICH to me but I'm sure one of the fish medics here can be more specific. Is the fish flashing, do the spots seem to change every few days? The only in DT method I'm aware of to treat ICH is hypo-salinity.

 

[fishguy242]

#fishmedic

 

[Subliminal]

He is flashing...had to look that up to see what it meant.

 

[Subliminal]

I know that I have to be careful with treatment because puffers have issues with medications. And I don't want to hurt my little puffer.

 

[hoffmeyerz]

Def wait for more info from the fish medics (they got tagged up above). Do you have an auto top off setup? You need to drop the sal down to 1.009 and it can't raise from that at all. I don't remember the recommended time to keep it there, something like 45 days I think...but if it rises at all it starts the clock over again. You then need to bring the salinity back up very slowly.
Good luck, it's a beautiful fish!

 

[Subliminal]

Def wait for more info from the fish medics (they got tagged up above). Do you have an auto top off setup? You need to drop the sal down to 1.009 and it can't raise from that at all. I don't remember the recommended time to keep it there, something like 45 days I think...but if it rises at all it starts the clock over again. You then need to bring the salinity back up very slowly.
Good luck, it's a beautiful fish!

Thank you. I do not have ATO on that tank yet...just set it up a few weeks ago.

 

[Sharkbait19]

Could you post a video (linked through YouTube)? Is the fish breathing fast at all?
It looks like Ich but I want to rule out velvet as that can be more difficult to trick.
Hyposalinity will work in a fowlr but only works for ich and certain flukes.
If fish can’t be moved to a qt, I personally would advice against copper only because it makes it impossible to ever get inverts and dosing can be tough as it is absorbed by rocks. Puffers will tolerate coppersafe fine though.

 

[Subliminal]

Could you post a video (linked through YouTube)? Is the fish breathing fast at all?
It looks like Ich but I want to rule out velvet as that can be more difficult to trick.
Hyposalinity will work in a fowlr but only works for ich and certain flukes.
If fish can’t be moved to a qt, I personally would advice against copper only because it makes it impossible to ever get inverts and dosing can be tough as it is absorbed by rocks. Puffers will tolerate coppersafe fine though.

thank you!

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hey all, have a fowlr tank with the following fish:

emporer angel juvi
Panther grouper juvi
Stars and Stripes puffer juvi
Niger trigger juvi

the angel came in last and appears to be a little under the weather. I never plan on getting going reef in this particular tank (I guess obvious from fish choices) and going fallow here isn’t an option.

how should I treat?

thanks!

This appears to be velvet and whether velvet or ich, the treatment will be similar treating in a quarantine tank and
as the disease progresses outwards from the gills, the cysts then become visible on the fins and body. Although these cysts may appear as tiny white dots the size of a grain of salt, like the first sign of Saltwater Ich or White Spot Disease, what sets Oodinium apart from other types of ich is that at this point the fish have the appearance of being coated with what looks like a whitish or tan to golden colored, velvet-like film, thus the name Velvet Disease.
Remove fish from main tank and give them a FW dip or bath and then place them into a QT with vigorous aeration provided. Treat the fish in the QT with a copper-based medication. Although many remedies contain the general name as ich or ick treatments, read the box to be sure it targets Oodinium. My choice is coppersafe or copper power at 2.25-2.5 therapuetic level at 80 degrees for a FULL 30 days monitored by a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna Brand (no api brand). Assure the medication you use states treats Oodinum.

 

[Subliminal]

This appears to be velvet and whether velvet or ich, the treatment will be similar treating in a quarantine tank and
as the disease progresses outwards from the gills, the cysts then become visible on the fins and body. Although these cysts may appear as tiny white dots the size of a grain of salt, like the first sign of Saltwater Ich or White Spot Disease, what sets Oodinium apart from other types of ich is that at this point the fish have the appearance of being coated with what looks like a whitish or tan to golden colored, velvet-like film, thus the name Velvet Disease.
Remove fish from main tank and give them a FW dip or bath and then place them into a QT with vigorous aeration provided. Treat the fish in the QT with a copper-based medication. Although many remedies contain the general name as ich or ick treatments, read the box to be sure it targets Oodinium. My choice is coppersafe or copper power at 2.25-2.5 therapuetic level at 80 degrees for a FULL 30 days monitored by a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna Brand (no api brand). Assure the medication you use states treats Oodinum.

I can’t quarantine all of these fish I don’t think. I’m out of tanks. And wouldn’t they all need to come out of the display for this as it would be in the tank?

I appreciate the advice but I’m unsure how to proceed with the recommendation.

 

[Sharkbait19]

What are all the fish in the tank?
It can be treated directly in the dt as long as you maintain copper levels. You won’t be able to keep inverts in the tank though unless all rock and sand were replaced.

 

[Subliminal]

@Sharkbait19
All juvi between 3-5 inches:

Emporer Angel
S&S Puffer
Panther Grouper
Niger Trigger

 

[vetteguy53081]

I can’t quarantine all of these fish I don’t think. I’m out of tanks. And wouldn’t they all need to come out of the display for this as it would be in the tank?

I appreciate the advice but I’m unsure how to proceed with the recommendation.

Option you have but with Slow results would be to treat the tank with Ruby Rally Pro.
How do the other fish look as they have to have been infected also. You are risking total loss by no quarantine and Is this tank by chance Fish ONLY ?

 

[Subliminal]

Option you have but with Slow results would be to treat the tank with Ruby Rally Pro.
How do the other fish look as they have to have been infected also. You are risking total loss by no quarantine and Is this tank by chance Fish ONLY ?

The other fish all look fine. It is FOWLR.

 

[vetteguy53081]

The other fish all look fine. It is FOWLR.

Well, you have option to treat in-tank but the bacteria in the live rock will get some impact from the copper
You can utilize a large rubbermaid like tub to accomplish the quarantine is is often utilized in a situation like this

 

[jft]

Remove all chemical media. Try 14 days of seachem Paraguard daily. Hope this will help.

 

[Sharkbait19]

@Sharkbait19
All juvi between 3-5 inches:

Emporer Angel
S&S Puffer
Panther Grouper
Niger Trigger

A 40B can work for the length of treatment, or a cheaper option would be the Rubbermaid/sterlite tub as mentioned.
Being fowlr, in tank treatment is possible.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Paraguard as noted by many is pretty much useless. A lot to be said on the bottle but does Not work literally. Its copper free and comprised of malachite green and polymers which may have effect on FW fish but with density of saltwater is again of no use.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

That angel has marine ich, and probably flukes as well. Treating it in-situ won't be possible if invertebrates are present. If they aren't, then you could go with hyposalinity.

Hyposalinity

Hyposalinity Jay Hemdal 2021 This term refers to a long-term bath treatment for marine fishes in which the salt content of the water is lowered and held below the point that certain parasites can survive. The salt level reached, and the time of the treatment are the two variables...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay