Any Closed Loop Gurus out there?

[ElussssvReefSD]

I’ve seen a few closed loop threads pop up on here from time to time, but haven’t been able to glean enough info on this topic to really feel confident about my design.

If you’ve had a lot of success using a closed loop as your primary method of achieving flow instead of a bunch of power heads, I would very much like to pick your brain.


I’ve included a link to my build thread in this post, so please check it out and drop into the convo here:

Monster Build - Tiny- The Wallet Destroyer (1000G)

Hey y'all, So, new city (Tampa FL), new post-rona life, and new house has created a new opportunity to utterly and completely destroy my financial future by designing and building an absolute monster of a room-divider tank. I had a previous custom build that I was working on, that was 86'd...

www.reef2reef.com

Thanks in advance!

 

[Scratch08]

Pick away...been running closed loops on various tanks over the years... currently running 2 varios 6's split to 4 - 1" outlets ...I do have 2 gyres in the tank at the moment that only run during my nutrient export mode on WaveEngine...otherwise it's all closed loop.

 

[ElussssvReefSD]

Pick away...been running closed loops on various tanks over the years... currently running 2 varios 6's split to 4 - 1" outlets ...I do have 2 gyres in the tank at the moment that only run during my nutrient export mode on WaveEngine...otherwise it's all closed loop.

Awesome!

So first question... with 6 outlets and 800-1000 gallons, how big of a pump do you think I’d need?

Second question... what’re your thoughts Re: Oceans Motions?

 

[Scratch08]

Awesome!

So first question... with 6 outlets and 800-1000 gallons, how big of a pump do you think I’d need?

Second question... what’re your thoughts Re: Oceans Motions?

800-1000 gals...is that your system total?
If so, you may do better with multiple pumps rather than one large one. This could also be beneficial when it comes time for pump maintenance, in that you Caan take one or two pumps offline and xlean/repair and still maintain decent flow in your tank. I would forgo the OM(see below) and get at minimum 3 dc controllable pumps and split them between your 6 outlets. Assuming you will have some sort of controller system with that water volume, in which case, you could use it to vary your pump speeds...I personally use the Hydros Wave Engine, and it is mostly flawless.
OM's are good, however I found it to also be a P.I.T.A...smallest amount of sand or detritus in it and say goodbye to the rotating drum inside, I also had magnets on the wet side become compromised, causing the magnet to burst through and become exposed to the water...which caused all sorts of issues, it now resides in a box in my storage room.
My 2 cents...

 

[DrZoidburg]

What about vectra's L1 or L2 they have a random type modes you can tune in. What other pumps in the system?

 

[ElussssvReefSD]

800-1000 gals...is that your system total?
If so, you may do better with multiple pumps rather than one large one. This could also be beneficial when it comes time for pump maintenance, in that you Caan take one or two pumps offline and xlean/repair and still maintain decent flow in your tank. I would forgo the OM(see below) and get at minimum 3 dc controllable pumps and split them between your 6 outlets. Assuming you will have some sort of controller system with that water volume, in which case, you could use it to vary your pump speeds...I personally use the Hydros Wave Engine, and it is mostly flawless.
OM's are good, however I found it to also be a P.I.T.A...smallest amount of sand or detritus in it and say goodbye to the rotating drum inside, I also had magnets on the wet side become compromised, causing the magnet to burst through and become exposed to the water...which caused all sorts of issues, it now resides in a box in my storage room.
My 2 cents...

Hmmm bummer about the OM. One of my primary goals with using it was not having to have multiple pumps, to try and cut down on complexity a bit.

Anything preventative that can be done to prevent those issues?

 

[ElussssvReefSD]

What about vectra's L1 or L2 they have a random type modes you can tune in. What other pumps in the system?

I‘ll be using dual vectras for the returns from the sump. Also some gyres on the back wall.

See my build thread here:

Monster Build - Tiny- The Wallet Destroyer (1000G)

Hey y'all, So, new city (Tampa FL), new post-rona life, and new house has created a new opportunity to utterly and completely destroy my financial future by designing and building an absolute monster of a room-divider tank. I had a previous custom build that I was working on, that was 86'd...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[tyryfin]

Running a closed loop on a 675 gallon tank using a Red Dragon® 3 pump connected to (2) 1.5" Sea Swirls and (2) 1" Sea Swirls, runs great

 

[Smarkow]

Pick away...been running closed loops on various tanks over the years... currently running 2 varios 6's split to 4 - 1" outlets ...I do have 2 gyres in the tank at the moment that only run during my nutrient export mode on WaveEngine...otherwise it's all closed loop.

What settings do you use on your Varios pumps? And by wave engine are you referring to the coralvue product that links different types of pumps? Just curious how you’ve set it all up, thanks for sharing

 

[ElussssvReefSD]

Running a closed loop on a 675 gallon tank using a Red Dragon® 3 pump connected to (2) 1.5" Sea Swirls and (2) 1" Sea Swirls, runs great

I thought about all sea swirls, worried about lower half of tank and they’d look visually without a canopy though. Any dead spots?

 

[tyryfin]

I thought about all sea swirls, worried about lower half of tank and they’d look visually without a canopy though. Any dead spots?

tank is 36” deep so I also run (2) MP 60‘s for the lower half of the tank. There is also (2) 1.5” returns running on (2) more Red Dragon 3 from the sump. So if one would fail I would still have flow from the sump to the tank. The Dragon’s are also running the skimmer, UV, chiller and other various equip.

 

[Scratch08]

What settings do you use on your Varios pumps? And by wave engine are you referring to the coralvue product that links different types of pumps? Just curious how you’ve set it all up, thanks for sharing

Yes, using the Coralvue Wave Engine to run the Varios pumps...I'm using the 0-10vdc outputs to control the Closed loop pumps, the gyres are on the direct drive ports of the wave engine along with my return pumps, have 2 return pumps (varios 4's) connected, if one goes down (knock on wood, hasn't happened yet), the other will maintain flow through the sump. Working on setting them up to alternate pumps each week...little tricky though. Have set up multiple flow presets to vary the flow in my tank throughout the day. It's actually pretty simple to set up, and so far, I've had real good interactions with Carlos at Coralvue on more complex questions I've had about the system...by trade I'm a Honeywell building automation programmer, so I tend to come up with scenarios/ideas that most hobbyist wouldn't necessarily think of...and I keep hoping to get a backdoor into the programming so I can manipulate it more...however, for everyday regular hobby use, it's a great product

 

[Smarkow]

Yes, using the Coralvue Wave Engine to run the Varios pumps...I'm using the 0-10vdc outputs to control the Closed loop pumps, the gyres are on the direct drive ports of the wave engine along with my return pumps, have 2 return pumps (varios 4's) connected, if one goes down (knock on wood, hasn't happened yet), the other will maintain flow through the sump. Working on setting them up to alternate pumps each week...little tricky though. Have set up multiple flow presets to vary the flow in my tank throughout the day. It's actually pretty simple to set up, and so far, I've had real good interactions with Carlos at Coralvue on more complex questions I've had about the system...by trade I'm a Honeywell building automation programmer, so I tend to come up with scenarios/ideas that most hobbyist wouldn't necessarily think of...and I keep hoping to get a backdoor into the programming so I can manipulate it more...however, for everyday regular hobby use, it's a great product

Could you set up your two return pumps to ramp up/down throughout the day? Would have the same effect as a week on/off. Thanks for the explanation, I was not aware of these coralvue products until today. I’ve used the icecaps to alternate my gyres but the icecaps have become finicky after a couple years, now they need a weekly reset.

 

[Scratch08]

Could you set up your two return pumps to ramp up/down throughout the day? Would have the same effect as a week on/off. Thanks for the explanation, I was not aware of these coralvue products until today. I’ve used the icecaps to alternate my gyres but the icecaps have become finicky after a couple years, now they need a weekly reset.

Yes, I can add triggers to it it so that one pump runs during X_time period, and the other would start on the next trigger and run through that time period.

 

[Smarkow]

Yes, I can add triggers to it it so that one pump runs during X_time period, and the other would start on the next trigger and run through that time period.

Nice!
I set up my 2x gyres to follow this pattern. I was thinking of using some sort of DC pump (I’ve used sicce, Cor, vectra but maybe I should look into Varios as well?). I think with my next build I’ll set the closed loops up to run a pattern like this. But now I’m thinking doing the coralvue product. Their stuff is always top notch.

 

[TUSI]

I’ve seen a few closed loop threads pop up on here from time to time, but haven’t been able to glean enough info on this topic to really feel confident about my design.

If you’ve had a lot of success using a closed loop as your primary method of achieving flow instead of a bunch of power heads, I would very much like to pick your brain.


I’ve included a link to my build thread in this post, so please check it out and drop into the convo here:

Monster Build - Tiny- The Wallet Destroyer (1000G)

Hey y'all, So, new city (Tampa FL), new post-rona life, and new house has created a new opportunity to utterly and completely destroy my financial future by designing and building an absolute monster of a room-divider tank. I had a previous custom build that I was working on, that was 86'd...

www.reef2reef.com

Thanks in advance!

May I ask what type of corals you want to keep in your system. When I did mine I was into lps corals and I piped the closed loop accordingly which worked perfect with one pump that I just replaced after 14 yrs without ever servicing it. Yes hard to believe it was a reefloo dart with a wave maker attached on the outlet. But as yrs went by wanted to switch to sps and my closed loop was not enough cause it was not designed for it.
so with that being said my recommendation is to decide on what coral you want to keep and then pipe it accordingly by have hidden heads high and low. The idea of two pumps is definitely a great idea cause you can use one low and one high. As far a the swirls and movement of water you can do it with ramping pumps up and down. Those did not exist when I did mine so I did a wave maker which does not work to well with to much flow and pressure.

 

[ElussssvReefSD]

May I ask what type of corals you want to keep in your system. When I did mine I was into lps corals and I piped the closed loop accordingly which worked perfect with one pump that I just replaced after 14 yrs without ever servicing it. Yes hard to believe it was a reefloo dart with a wave maker attached on the outlet. But as yrs went by wanted to switch to sps and my closed loop was not enough cause it was not designed for it.
so with that being said my recommendation is to decide on what coral you want to keep and then pipe it accordingly by have hidden heads high and low. The idea of two pumps is definitely a great idea cause you can use one low and one high. As far a the swirls and movement of water you can do it with ramping pumps up and down. Those did not exist when I did mine so I did a wave maker which does not work to well with to much flow and pressure.

It’s been over a decade since I’ve kept a reef tank, so wanted to start out slow, but ultimately SPS.

 

[TUSI]

It’s been over a decade since I’ve kept a reef tank, so wanted to start out slow, but ultimately SPS.

Will be hard to do with closed loop. You got to really think it through With your aquascape in mind so you place the piping in it with specific flow pattern for sps. It’s a challenge but achievable

 

[ElussssvReefSD]

I hear your point.

So, I am thinking of the cl returns placed on the side panels for horizontal cross-flow, a sea swirl in each corner from the sump return providing alternating diagonal flow, and gyres placed on the back panel in the middle pushing water across the surface towards the front viewing panel and then pulling back through the aquascape.

I figure at 10 ft across, with the combination of a powerful cl pump, and the gyres/sea swirls, that I’d be taking care of all dead spots.

What do you think?

 

[TUSI]

I hear your point.

So, I am thinking of the cl returns placed on the side panels for horizontal cross-flow, a sea swirl in each corner from the sump return providing alternating diagonal flow, and gyres placed on the back panel in the middle pushing water across the surface towards the front viewing panel and then pulling back through the aquascape.

I figure at 10 ft across, with the combination of a powerful cl pump, and the gyres/sea swirls, that I’d be taking care of all dead spots.

What do you think?

Yes that should do it. Did not know you were putting other flow sources. Thought you wanted to do it only by closed loop.
We’re are you getting the water for the closed loop pump for the sea swirls ?