Sick Gig Carpet Nem - Updated CURED!

terraincognita

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Alright,

Here's a fullllll backstory to my carpet Nem.

I got him on July 25th to the date.

He was in a tank that was about 1 month 2 weeks old. Before everyone goes (too early for a nem!) I disagree.

My params were stable, and I was keeping SPS.

Here's a photo from July 30th, 5 days later and he's still happy photo

IMG_7684.jpeg


Here's one from August 25th, IME he's still super happy here! :) (Bottom Left)

IMG_7919.jpeg


Alright, then I upgraded my tank to a 45.

I started the process around August 10th? I think, somewhere around there.

And He got put in around August 30th.

Again I know people say "too soon" and this time I do agree.... with the larger water volume I wasn't accounting for the increased time needed for a proper establishment despite my crazy "quick start" methods.


Okay so hold on though, So I shouldn't have moved him then, but I did, partly because in a smaller system less stable he did just fine!

Now fast forward about 1 month to today.

NOW My tank's stable, definitely IME stable as I'm getting SPS Growth and encrusting:

Okay wow, super ****** quality, but hopefully you smarties will be able to see the encrusting I'm talking about. This is all within 5 days of mounting this btw, so if it's growing that quick in 5 days, IDK that's a really good sign to me.

IMG_0069.jpeg



And finally Here's a FTS and my Nem. :( I'm so sad. This is the worst he's looked and I just can't do it anymore :(.

I did end up moving him from a super high flow spot to one that's medium/low, and he ended up attaching his foot to my magnet which is kind of convienient.

Because now I can easily move him or take him out.....

IMG_0067.jpeg


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Things I noticed, you see how his column now is like green? It's a DARK green in person and before it was always like beige.....

Idk what's up....

I'm willing to 100% accept that even though my SPS are happy my tank is still not stable enough, but I'd need someone with something about Nems or something to give me more reason as to why this is.

Or maybe he has a nem disease IDK?

Also doesn't make sense that he'd be happier in a 1 month old 13.5G Fluval

and less happy in my now almost 2 months old, JBJ 45 with way better equipment and IMO much stabler conditions.....

Anyway, any help would be awesome thanks.
 

Dom

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Posting recent actual water parameter numbers, would be helpful as it allows for targeted suggestions.

Also, what lights do you run and what is you lighting schedule?
 
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terraincognita

terraincognita

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@OrionN did help me in another thread a bit, mentioned not to feed at all so I also haven't been directly feeding as he said it would make him sicker. Only other thing I've done.

Sent a PM to him already few days back but I know he probably has a lot of notifications on this forum so didn't pester him.

Also there's a few photos here from nighttime just a couple weeks ago. He seemed to be puffing up at night when the lights were off?

This was in @OrionN's transplant post. I can't find it now.

Again if someone can explain more into why my water params aren't up to par for this guy,

That's 100% fine I'll donate him to any local reefer who can cure him.

But I just want more info, before I give up my pet because I can't keep him.

As a final note, I did use Tap water and an Overdose of Prime to initially fill this tank as I didn't want to wait 48 hours for my RODI to run straight to try to get 45G of freshwater.....

But I don't want that to be just the like "oh yeah that's probably it" or "we don't know might be that" lol :-( Cuz I'm sure there's more to it.

I've done probably 30G of water changes since it's been up. But Idk if that could in anyway have maybe something to do with it.
 

vetteguy53081

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Did you acclimate it to new tank as if it were just purchased? Also was there a variance between both tank levels ?
Ideal values are;
Moderate light and water flow
Temperature 77-79
Ph 8.1-8.3
Salinity 1.025

The ammonia, nitrate at zero seems odd. I would suggest taking a water sample to a trusted LFS and have them test water and verify the parameters and to compare with yours
 

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Your params are fine, and icp test would tell you lots more. A lot of people have issues when moving from an established tank to a new one. In theory it seems that everything would be fine as we are keeping the same rock and sand but in reality it just often doesn’t go the way we planned. I don’t know the science behind it, and I don’t think anyone will be able to point to something specific with the information we have. If you’d like to know an ICP test would be the next best step to find out. What is your ph? Mg? Salinity when you moved tanks the same? There’s so many factors
 
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terraincognita

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Did you acclimate it to new tank as if it were just purchased? Also was there a variance between both tank levels ?
Ideal values are;
Moderate light and water flow
Temperature 77-79
Ph 8.1-8.3
Salinity 1.025

The ammonia, nitrate at zero seems odd. I would suggest taking a water sample to a trusted LFS and have them test water and verify the parameters and to compare with yours

I did acclimate but not as much as I might've the first time, but I did try to acclimate everything.

It was really tiring, and I will admit near the end I might just "threw some stuff in"

BUT! I also was doing 2G water changes from my JBJ 45 into my Fluval 13.5 everyday for the last 4-5 days before I moved everything, so I imagined the waters would've kind of balanced out. My LFS recommended that.

Salinity is like 36.2PPT or 1.026 3/4, It's a little high, and I'll probably add a gallon or so of fresh to bring that down a bit. didn't realize, just took it.

I'll do the ICP test.... I ordered it.... I gotta do it.... LOL Got it 3 days ago, ughhhh okay fine.

IMG_0071.jpeg
 

vetteguy53081

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If any false readings especially salinity, the water you transferred could have already been an issue, hence suggestion about having a second opinion with LFS water test
 

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I accidentally raised my sg to 1.031 about a month ago due to a piece of faulty equipment. Had about 5 nems in there and they were fine, everything was except a damsel of all things lol.
 

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IMO you can argue all you want that maturity and all doesn't play a role but I disagree a whole lot. Just because things are looking great it doesn't mean anything, a new tank will always look great at first, it's a matter of maintaining values long term that will give you success. Honestly, I think it's irresponsible to have put that kind of nem in such a young system, I mean what's a month and 2 weeks, what's 20 days in the big picture of it all? Proper cycling of a tank should be at least 3 months and honestly even longer nowadays with the sterility of dry rock and all.

Sorry if this comes off as rude but this is just my opinion
 
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terraincognita

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If any false readings especially salinity, the water you transferred could have already been an issue, hence suggestion about having a second opinion with LFS water test

While I like my LFS's. I'm a super smart guy with a really high IQ. and I don't necessarily trust their testing more than mine.... I dont have any marine biologist or chemist in my LFS. Just some big dudes with happy faces :) lol.

I'm gonna do an ICP for more accurate results.
 
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terraincognita

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IMO you can argue all you want that maturity and all doesn't play a role but I disagree a whole lot. Just because things are looking great it doesn't mean anything, a new tank will always look great at first, it's a matter of maintaining values long term that will give you success. Honestly, I think it's irresponsible to have put that kind of nem in such a young system, I mean what's a month and 2 weeks, what's 20 days in the big picture of it all? Proper cycling of a tank should be at least 3 months and honestly even longer nowadays with the sterility of dry rock and all.

Sorry if this comes off as rude but this is just my opinion
I used about 80% wet rock from LFS's tanks and all live sand.

I can get into my entire cycling procedure here if everyone wants

But I've started about 12 tanks in my life, and I've gotten down the starting of the tanks to a pretty neat drill. This is the only time I've had problems with a Nem like this, but this is also my first carpet, all other Nems were BTA's.

I understand your point I do. But I'd want to understand more about what is happening in the water other than basic params over the course of 1-2 years thats not the same in younger tanks once they push past the Nitrification cycle.

The Cycle timing is all arbitrary. You can't put a timer on nature doing it's thing.

Some dogs grow quick, some grow slow, some bacteria multiplies like weeds, others of the same exact strain under different conditions don't.

There's a lot behind it more than just time IME. But again, I'd just like someone to give more info on possibly MAYBE what?

I can agree there may be some water quality point I'm 1,000,000% missing and I'm totally open to that, but just would want more insight into what before I just say "you're right I'm wrong but no one knows why" kind of.

Lastly all of my tanks DO go through an "ugly phase" in their cycle.

I had GHA and Cyano break out in this tank like a *****, it's just all gone now, it only lasted about 1 week.

The only thing I didn't do this time was use all prepared RODI Salt, from the store/my own mix.... I used tap and prime :( Idk maybe that's it... honestly...
 

Dolphins18

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I used about 80% wet rock from LFS's tanks and all live sand.

I can get into my entire cycling procedure here if everyone wants

But I've started about 12 tanks in my life, and I've gotten down the starting of the tanks to a pretty neat drill. This is the only time I've had problems with a Nem like this, but this is also my first carpet, all other Nems were BTA's.

I understand your point I do. But I'd want to understand more about what is happening in the water other than basic params over the course of 1-2 years thats not the same in younger tanks once they push past the Nitrification cycle.

The Cycle timing is all arbitrary. You can't put a timer on nature doing it's thing.

Some dogs grow quick, some grow slow, some bacteria multiplies like weeds, others of the same exact strain under different conditions don't.

There's a lot behind it more than just time IME. But again, I'd just like someone to give more info on possibly MAYBE what?

I can agree there may be some water quality point I'm 1,000,000% missing and I'm totally open to that, but just would want more insight into what before I just say "you're right I'm wrong but no one knows why" kind of.

Lastly all of my tanks DO go through an "ugly phase" in their cycle.

I had GHA and Cyano break out in this tank like a *****, it's just all gone now, it only lasted about 1 week.

The only thing I didn't do this time was use all prepared RODI Salt, from the store/my own mix.... I used tap and prime :( Idk maybe that's it... honestly...
You on city water? That’d be my guess right there. Get an icp on your tap water too. Prime is only good for neutralizing chlorine and chloramine from tap water there’s lots else in tap water.
 

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I just feel like your tank is still cycling, whether you may think it is or it isn't, just look at the algae on your sand bed as a clue. And yes you can't put a precise number on a natural process but I think that's why the general consensus on cycling a tank is about 3 months. 2-8 weeks is the length it may take but really after 3 months you can say you did your due diligence and allowed the natural process to occur properly.

And I agree that I am not offering a trying truly objective but bacterial balance isn't something that we truly and fully understand just yet.
 
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terraincognita

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I just feel like your tank is still cycling, whether you may think it is or it isn't, just look at the algae on your sand bed as a clue. And yes you can't put a precise number on a natural process but I think that's why the general consensus on cycling a tank is about 3 months. 2-8 weeks is the length it may take but really after 3 months you can say you did your due diligence and allowed the natural process to occur properly.


still cycling doesn’t make sense........

that’s not how a nitrification cycle works...

Re: too new or not mature though for a reason beyond the nitrification cycle I can understand. could be man. I'm open to it. I am sincerely. I'm not trying to say I know everything. But it wouldn’t be just the nitrification cycle, it’d be something more advanced.

One thing I realize I'm not accounting for as well is the entire surface area of the tank glass, pumps, etc Biofilms that grow, over time, and I'm sure other microscopic events that take place.

Re: the Algae on my sand, it may be a little bit sure, but I also haven't cleaned my gravel the entire time... and also I've seen 5 year old more mature tanks with worse algae on sand.... So i don't get that point?

My question then however would be how and why are those effecting my nem?
 

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