Bacteria in a bottle, Myth or Fact

[JaimeAdams]

@kevinl

 

[Dr. Reef]

Update
All 6 tanks are cleaned up and ready to be put together for round 2. I will post pics and updates tomorrow as I get them setup/running again.

 

[cromag27]

Update
All 6 tanks are cleaned up and ready to be put together for round 2. I will post pics and updates tomorrow as I get them setup/running again.

which study are you doing next

 

[brandon429]

The suspension cycling one for fritz is coming / speed of deposition coming up

 

[Bos]

Update
All 6 tanks are cleaned up and ready to be put together for round 2. I will post pics and updates tomorrow as I get them setup/running again.

Any thoughts on a side test of Nitrite to Nitrate for the most 'successful' brands?

Besides ammonia, nitrites are pretty bad too for livestock, how long would it take for brands like Biospira, Turbostart 900, Dr Tims, Prodibio Biodigest to reduce the 2ppm ammonia to zero THEN the nitrites to 0 too?

 

[Dr. Reef]

which study are you doing next

Repeating the main 4 brands for round 2 and then round 3 for best of 3 results. Bio spira, microbelift, ATM colony and Fluval cycle.

Side study Fritz Turbostart cold vs room temp left out at 5 weeks now.

Suspension cycling like @brandon429 had asked for. Once fritz tank and bio spira tank are cycled, my guess 3-4 days, will do 100% water change and redose 0.5ppm ammonia.

 

[Dr. Reef]

Any thoughts on a side test of Nitrite to Nitrate for the most 'successful' brands?

Besides ammonia, nitrites are pretty bad too for livestock, how long would it take for brands like Biospira, Turbostart 900, Dr Tims, Prodibio Biodigest to reduce the 2ppm ammonia to zero THEN the nitrites to 0 too?

In my first group Fritz Turbostart 900 was able to bring 8ppm ammonia to 0 in 3 days. Showed nitrite spike (0.5ppm) which was also gone within a day and at day 4 I have 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite and 50-80ppm nitrate.

I can put some other brands to test on it as well but just to clarify NITRITE are NOT dangerous in saltwater.
In a study a group of clownfish were subjected to nitrite as high as 300 ppm with only 25% casualties.
In my home study I have subjected multiple species of saltwater fish to nitrite levels of 1-5ppm with no ill effects.

To your question:
If the product is a true nitrifier bacteria then nitrite will show a minor to no spike and directly goto nitrates.

 

[Victoria M]

Repeating the main 4 brands for round 2 and then round 3 for best of 3 results. Bio spira, microbelift, ATM colony and Fluval cycle.

Side study Fritz Turbostart cold vs room temp left out at 5 weeks now.

Suspension cycling like @brandon429 had asked for. Once fritz tank and bio spira tank are cycled, my guess 3-4 days, will do 100% water change and redose 0.5ppm ammonia.

Ok, fine but we hafta to change the phrase suspension cycling and sped of deposition. There Has to better or already in use phrases. Such as ... Speed of deposition = surface colonization. No offense Brandon.

 

[MnFish1]

Ok, fine but we hafta to change the phrase suspension cycling and sped of deposition. There Has to better or already in use phrases. Such as ... Speed of deposition = surface colonization. No offense Brandon.

OK so this makes no sense - no offense @Victoria M

 

[Victoria M]

OK so this makes no sense - no offense @Victoria M

Because I do not enjoy the terms that Brandon uses to describe certain aspects or stages of the nitrogen cycle as he understands and explains it. And I have teased him about it. ;Wacky

 

[brandon429]

I'm trying to see how many prediction aspects the microbiology of cycling thread got right or wrong, three years after inception before any of this fine testing
term it anything ha-glad to see the outcome either way. 4 days blows mind/10-12 about right. If it's four I'll be happy to get closure. We want to know all aspects of cycling, what's predictable etc. Pie piece coming soon for this rare aspect

 

[Victoria M]

. Pie piece coming soon for this rare aspect

See? Right there? What the heck does that mean? What are you talking about? ;Wacky

 

[brandon429]

Edit, not worth it.
Can't wait to see outcome of test Dr. Reef.

 

[Victoria M]

Translation: people who were using, discussing and terming this physiology long before you and Cro took it upon yourselves to hall monitor everything, without work threads, from the sidelines, see it as a piece of a missing pie.

The whole pie is what bacteria do in our tanks, predictably. Nobody agrees on this current piece of the pie until DR posts some neat testing.

Ah ha. That is better. Now I get it. I am not being a smarty pants hall monitor! See? you are using words and phrases you made up and can not understand why other folks can not figure out what the heck you are talking about. And did you mean to say piece of missing pie or did you mean missing piece of the pie? Still a very obscure reference. And did you mean to imply that the smart people are having an adult conversation that the stupid people should refrain from joining? It kinda sounds like it.
This is not a research study in which to test a theoretical framework of bacteria. It was a hobbyist level, albeit a well done hobbyist level test, to prove or disprove if manufactured bottled bacteria safely cycle an aquarium.

 

[brandon429]

We met that test, and his setup is easily tweaked for more info. This side observation doesn’t harm or derail his setup. It’s one water change, easy.

I’m glad your initial advice to not test, or to even consider if there was a lag period at all wasn’t weighted. If Mikey hadn’t posted I’m not sure anyone would agree that deposition isn’t instant or at least equal to the time it takes the dosed items to neutralize some ammonia.


As I read it, others are interested to see the outcome as well...to learn about bacteria, as that’s whats coming up, simply more info. I never could figure out why you went off trying to derail that knowledge-repeat advising Dr Reef away from making the test. I thought for a while he wouldn’t, that you succeeded in stopping us knowing that aspect of bottle bac and surface area.


I’m in it only to learn about bac...if you had shown me an aspect of microbiology I hadn’t considered prior-the last thing I’d be doing is debating the terms of the action I hadn’t known. We are in this for different reasons, you and I.

 

[Victoria M]

We met that test, and his setup is easily tweaked for more info. This side observation doesn’t harm or derail his setup. It’s one water change, easy.

I’m glad your initial advice to not test, or to even consider if there was a lag period at all wasn’t weighted. If Mikey hadn’t posted I’m not sure anyone would agree that deposition isn’t instant or at least equal to the time it takes the dosed items to neutralize some ammonia.


As I read it, others are interested to see the outcome as well...to learn about bacteria, as that’s whats coming up, simply more info. I never could figure out why you went off trying to derail that knowledge-repeat advising Dr Reef away from making the test. I thought for a while he wouldn’t, that you succeeded in stopping us knowing that aspect of bottle bac and surface area.


I’m in it only to learn about bac...if you had shown me an aspect of microbiology I hadn’t considered prior-the last thing I’d be doing is debating the terms of the action I hadn’t known prior. We are in this for different reasons, you and I.

Brandon, I did not try to derail any testing. My apologies if I made you feel that way. That truly was not my intent. .

 

[brandon429]

my intent is not to be harsh and to correctly interpret nontyped cues in post exchanges, work in progress

cliffhanger for this page / what @kevinl has to say about bacteria and depositional times. Since post #1481/Jaime’s referral I’ve been wondering


Any predictions K on the timeframes we might expect before Dr Reefs runs the side test

 

[cbleehk]

just started following the thread last week and been catching up. @Dr. Reef Thank you so much for doing this because there is limited resources on how things compare.

I'm from Hong Kong so those brands are not available. If there are plans to test other brands, I'd love to see how the following brands compare:
- prodibio biodigest
- equo bacterya
- brightwell MB7

 

[Dr. Reef]

just started following the thread last week and been catching up. @Dr. Reef Thank you so much for doing this because there is limited resources on how things compare.

I'm from Hong Kong so those brands are not available. If there are plans to test other brands, I'd love to see how the following brands compare:
- prodibio biodigest
- equo bacterya
- brightwell MB7

Thank you for your kind remarks. That is the same reason why i started this study because there is not much out there in one place and i dont think there has ever been a study conducted in detail like this. anyways i appreciate your kind words.
To your question about the 3 products.
Prodibio was tested in the first group 3 times and it failed to drop 8ppm, 2ppm and 1 ppm ammonia tested few times.
I havent tested it but i have a feeling it carries heterotorph bacteria and it might work if there was carbon source in the tank. I tested this theory on my group 2 products and after stalling the ammonia at 1 ppm for 5 days i added fish food and it dropped to 0.5ppm within 24 hrs.
I will put this to test with prodibio and seachem stability when i get done with this round of studies.

Regarding Equo bacterya and brightwell mb7 i can definitely test them on group 3. if i can obtain them here in USA.


Edit: I checked and equo bacterya is not available in US. Please let me know if you can purchase it and ship it to me, I am willing to pay for bacteria and shipping cost.

 

[MnFish1]

Because I do not enjoy the terms that Brandon uses to describe certain aspects or stages of the nitrogen cycle as he understands and explains it. And I have teased him about it. ;Wacky

Lol no I got that I didn’t understand the word sped in your post I read it too quickly