Best lighting on the market? Is there one?

[A. grandis]

I did t realize Icecap under performed so much compared tM80. When I ordered my new fixture Cayman Sun, ice cap was all that was available. Looking at the Hamilton websiteM80 is out of stock. Are they no longer manufactured?

I've been telling people how important is to follow the manufacturer's recommendation for ballasts, specially for German bulbs. If you have a bulb that is supposed to be used with M80, like the 250W Radium, for example, and you want to get the optimal out of your lamp, you should get the M80s, yes. Using the electronic ballast on super lumens will still provide plenty juice for the tank, using less electricity, but the lamp's life, spectrum and performance will be somehow influenced by the ballast. jda has been wisely saying that for a long time too! He has a lot of experience with different halide bulbs and many friends using them! Choose your bulb and check what ballast the manufacturer recommends for that particular bulb.
Electronic selectable ballasts are great to be able to switch wattage though. I use Hamilton bulbs on my Luxcore selectable ballast. Generally speaking Hamilton bulbs are great option and will grow and color the corals really good. They are fairly inexpensive and work great for me. Their 14K is just amazing!! I love all the halide bulbs! They all have something special for different applications.

I believe @Hamilton Tech will restock everything.
There is way too many people buying halide equipment right now.
The COVID is what is making it difficult for them to restock. That is the prove of the demand. Send them an email. The more people letting them know they are waiting for the restock, the better. I think they should have a notification system on the site so people would know when things will be available.

 

[oreo54]

Doesn't hurt that they seem to be " the only" seller of m80 ballasts.

You can try and find some used ones, but for new, Hamilton is all that I know of.

Where to find M80 Metal Halide ballasts?

Hi all, I was wondering if someone could help me locate M80 ballasts for Metal Halide. I know Hamilton still sells them however they're $149. If that's the only option that's fine but I thought I would ask. It seems like these ballasts should be available elsewhere and when I Google for them I...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[A. grandis]

My profuse apologies to the OP if I put this thread into a bit of a power drift going around this curve,

I understand the angst topics like this can cause. I don't even have a pickup truck. I do, however, have a Harley. It serves my purposes well, too. I also built some Suzukis in the past, a GS-1000 and a GS-750E (from scratch, a road rocket...). I still like my Harley, now that I remember that I'm still mortal. I also like my '76 Kubota L245DT, but I live on a small farm so it comes in mighty handy.
Some folks mistake these threads as a big-bucks bass tournament and drop the lures off the back of the boat, if you "catch" my "drift".
I read, and even understand some things about physics (although the new stuff on travel faster than light speed is just now sinking in...) and photons being photons (h/t to Dana!) and the reactions some aquatic lifeforms have to some of these photon-thingies. Lotsa research papers out there to read and not nearly enough time...
I'm on the forum to get ideas from other reefkeepers and hopefully provide some insight into what went into my decision matrix for my current reef while preventing some problems for folks here that haven't been keeping aquatic critters for a number of, uh, um, decades, to pick up a few ideas themselves for success.

Background: This 300 gallon reef is a 360' walk around viewable from all sides. The reef itself is built from the visible back left corner to the right front corner, with another pillar on the back right corner. Lots of caves and arches formed by rock and coral. When making decisions about things like lighting, filtration, food, cooling, heating, and all that, we should make the decisions on our individual circumstances and requirements.

The view from the left end:

I needed a lighting solution that provided the following, and it took me a while to get there:
1. Could provide enough light to support acropora under 27" of water without overpowering the planned top of the reef, but down the entire length of the reef as well. So I needed kind of a uniform PAR all the down, within, say 100-150 PAR.
2. Able to keep the temperature in the living within reasonable limits without buying the executive staff of the local power company a fleet of new limousines (they have a enough already, frankly) with my summer air conditioning bill. This also goes in the category of maintaining a good relationship with my significant other.
3. Able to run off of an average 15amp circuit in the house, something the six(!) 250W metal halides (@2amp per ballast) I converted from had difficulty doing if anything else was plugged into the circuit and switched on.
4. Gotta look pretty good - highly subjective from somebody that spent a major portion of their life floating with a mask and snorkel...
So, I began my LED journey. I went through a few iterations and even some DIY to get to what I wanted, and ended up with an array of moderately inexpensive ViparSpectra to provide the smooth, broad coverage meeting minimal lighting requirements 27" down. I removed the stock lenses and affixed a dispersion panel (95% transmissivity) to increase the light spread. I'm running at about 250 PAR across the entire bottom of the aquarium at about 50% across blue and white channels. The top of the reef sees about 350-400 PAR across the length and width.
The array supports zooxanthellae down there, and the coral grows quickly and well -

I supplement these with an array of six Kessil A360WEs - a more expensive option, but this covered two bases. They made things "look good" by providing that extra kick of point-source lighting that produces the "glitter lines" under water. They also add another 150 or so PAR during the "high noon" part of the day, about five hours mid-day an extra dose of photons is chucked into the vat. I think many of my longer-limbed acros really appreciate this and tend to stretch out a bit more toward the surface. The shorter-branched varieties tend to pull in their outer polyps to lower the surface area exposed.

I hope this helps the OP a bit in their decision, or perhaps anyone else that doesn't doze off while reading it.

Cheers,
Ray

That's what I tell all my friends and everyone here... if that is the result you want, and the best light that will fit your needs/desires, keep your LEDs! They grow corals "just fine".

 

[Vette67]

I've been telling people how important is to follow the manufacturer's recommendation for ballasts, specially for German bulbs. If you have a bulb that is supposed to be used with M80, like the 250W Radium, for example, and you want to get the optimal out of your lamp, you should get the M80s, yes. Using the electronic ballast on super lumens will still provide plenty juice for the tank, using less electricity, but the lamp's life, spectrum and performance will be somehow influenced by the ballast. jda has been wisely saying that for a long time too! He has a lot of experience with different halide bulbs and many friends using them! Choose your bulb and check what ballast the manufacturer recommends for that particular bulb.
Electronic selectable ballasts are great to be able to switch wattage though. I use Hamilton bulbs on my Luxcore selectable ballast. Generally speaking Hamilton bulbs are great option and will grow and color the corals really good. They are fairly inexpensive and work great for me. Their 14K is just amazing!! I love all the halide bulbs! They all have something special for different applications.

I believe @Hamilton Tech will restock everything.
There is way too many people buying halide equipment right now.
The COVID is what is making it difficult for them to restock. That is the prove of the demand. Send them an email. The more people letting them know they are waiting for the restock, the better. I think they should have a notification system on the site so people would know when things will be available.

Holy crap. I guess I’ll glad I got my M-80’s when I did a month and a half ago...

 

[A. grandis]

Holy crap. I guess I’ll glad I got my M-80’s when I did a month and a half ago...

Depends on what bulb and wattage.

 

[rgulrich]

That's what I tell all my friends and everyone here... if that is the result you want, and the best light that will fit your needs/desires, keep your LEDs! They grow corals "just fine".

I'm sorry, I must have misread your posts then. This LED array actually grows acropora and a wide variety of other photosynthetic coral and other critters much better than the six 250W metal halide I removed nearly seven years ago. So yep, they are "just fine" in your words. They're still in my garage as I couldn't find any buyers in the greater metro Baltimore-DC region, and it still just doesn't feel right to take the solid state ballasts and whatnot to electronics recycling at the landfill knowing what I paid for them. The bulbs still need to go to hazardous waste (yeh, the old mercury thing). And heck, one of my buddies needed a ballast last month to experiment with in his collection of frag systems, so at least one has been put back into temporary service.
So perhaps it is the presentation - I'm not "pushing" LEDs, fluorescent (T5, T8, or T12 or even power compact), Metal Halide, High Pressure Sodium, Halogen Quartz, or any combination thereof, even though I've been using all of these in one form or another since the early 80's in reefing and even longer in marine and freshwater fish and invertebrate husbandry. It's fine to have opinions, it's great when they're backed by actual research (the kind based on scientific method and peer reviewed), and even better yet when you've had the opportunity and the where with all - and taken it - to experiment and relay your opinion as your own. If you want to reference the research, such as when symbiotic iridocytes in Tridacnids form guanine crystals to alter the frequency of UV light entering their tissue to better utilize it for photosynthesis, you can provide the citation (Iridocytes Mediate Photonic Cooperation Between Giant Clams (Tridacninae) and Their Photosynthetic Symbionts, ORIGINAL RESEARCH ARTICLE, Front. Mar. Sci., 19 June 2020 | https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2020.00465) and everyone can understand where you are coming from. When you have to "appeal to authority" and it's not based on the scientific method, it feels like you're no longer participating in a discussion, but rather like you're trying to sell a product.
Cheers,
Ray

 

[BlackGoldReefs]

Have you checked out the pop bloom LEDs? It’s the most par for the $$ .
I love mine!!

No I have not but it’s worth a look. Radions will set me back just under 1300.00

 

[A. grandis]

I'm sorry, I must have misread your posts then. This LED array actually grows acropora and a wide variety of other photosynthetic coral and other critters much better than the six 250W metal halide I removed nearly seven years ago. So yep, they are "just fine" in your words. They're still in my garage as I couldn't find any buyers in the greater metro Baltimore-DC region, and it still just doesn't feel right to take the solid state ballasts and whatnot to electronics recycling at the landfill knowing what I paid for them. The bulbs still need to go to hazardous waste (yeh, the old mercury thing). And heck, one of my buddies needed a ballast last month to experiment with in his collection of frag systems, so at least one has been put back into temporary service.
So perhaps it is the presentation - I'm not "pushing" LEDs, fluorescent (T5, T8, or T12 or even power compact), Metal Halide, High Pressure Sodium, Halogen Quartz, or any combination thereof, even though I've been using all of these in one form or another since the early 80's in reefing and even longer in marine and freshwater fish and invertebrate husbandry. It's fine to have opinions, it's great when they're backed by actual research (the kind based on scientific method and peer reviewed), and even better yet when you've had the opportunity and the where with all - and taken it - to experiment and relay your opinion as your own. If you want to reference the research, such as when symbiotic iridocytes in Tridacnids form guanine crystals to alter the frequency of UV light entering their tissue to better utilize it for photosynthesis, you can provide the citation (Iridocytes Mediate Photonic Cooperation Between Giant Clams (Tridacninae) and Their Photosynthetic Symbionts, ORIGINAL RESEARCH ARTICLE, Front. Mar. Sci., 19 June 2020 | https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2020.00465) and everyone can understand where you are coming from. When you have to "appeal to authority" and it's not based on the scientific method, it feels like you're no longer participating in a discussion, but rather like you're trying to sell a product.
Cheers,
Ray

Do you want me to lie to you? To tell you that I think LEDs grow corals faster than halides? That LEDs give true pigments better than halides?

My experiences and many others, including the majority of serious coral farmers around the globe, and Dr. Sanjay Joshi himself, is that halides grow corals faster than ANY other type of artificial light!
Mr. Paletta, a LED fan, said once that the ONLY bulb that grew corals profusely and with the best coloration was the Iwasaki. Go tell them your LEDs grow better corals and show them the papers then. LOL!!! I agree 100% and I published that here before Mr. Paletta said that. Sorry, I can't do what you want me to do, man!

Respectfully: I don't care if ANY paper proves anything that goes against the results we see. It's just a paper! Papers are isolated researches like puzzles to contribute to more researches. By the way I love science!!!!!

Let me tell you this: It is MY OPINION that HALIDES + T5s are the best combo of all artificial lights for any reef tank! Is that good now? LOL!!!

Whoever is hurt by my opinion is because deep in your heart you know I'm right!!!! LOL!! Whatever...

 

[neonreef3d]

No I have not but it’s worth a look. Radions will set me back just under 1300.00

forget about radions. I have seen the G5 xr15 and 30 in person, and they are not impressive at all, this Dsuny t50 is fairly priced, and if I was offered the xr15 for the same price, i would not get the radion, but their pumps are ok, but a bit pricy for having china made parts inside.

 

[HomebroodExotics]

Do you want me to lie to you? To tell you that I think LEDs grow corals faster than halides? That LEDs give true pigments better than halides?

My experiences and many others, including the majority of serious coral farmers around the globe, and Dr. Sanjay Joshi himself, is that halides grow corals faster than ANY other type of artificial light!
Mr. Paletta, a LED fan, said once that the ONLY bulb that grew corals profusely and with the best coloration was the Iwasaki. Go tell them your LEDs grow better corals and show them the papers then. LOL!!! I agree 100% and I published that here before Mr. Paletta said that. Sorry, I can't do what you want me to do, man!

Respectfully: I don't care if ANY paper proves anything that goes against the results we see. It's just a paper! Papers are isolated researches like puzzles to contribute to more researches. By the way I love science!!!!!

Let me tell you this: It is MY OPINION that HALIDES + T5s are the best combo of all artificial lights for any reef tank! Is that good now? LOL!!!

Whoever is hurt by my opinion is because deep in your heart you know I'm right!!!! LOL!! Whatever...

And what kind of lights does Dr. Sanjay use now?

 

[Dunc]

So I have a friend who’s about to drop 1,400 on a t5 light fixture with 2 Kessil A360X. I feel like that’s soooo much for money for just those 3 things. He says that’s what’s the best in the market.

I’m just wondering if he was lead the wrong way? Are there better lights for the same price or less? Is he making the best choice? I gotta look out for my fellow reefer so I’m wondering what you all think.

Is there something better? What’s your all’s perspective. He mainly has zoas and mushrooms. Some encrusting corals. Oh and a few anemones. For a 125g long tank

I don’t know if this light combo is best for what he’s trying to achieve, but he is definitely buying quality. Kessil and Radion are best LEDs currently available for purchase. Seems like I watched a BRS video that said the T5’s soften the Kessils and make a great combo.

 

[neonreef3d]

Do you want me to lie to you? To tell you that I think LEDs grow corals faster than halides? That LEDs give true pigments better than halides?

My experiences and many others, including the majority of serious coral farmers around the globe, and Dr. Sanjay Joshi himself, is that halides grow corals faster than ANY other type of artificial light!
Mr. Paletta, a LED fan, said once that the ONLY bulb that grew corals profusely and with the best coloration was the Iwasaki. Go tell them your LEDs grow better corals and show them the papers then. LOL!!! I agree 100% and I published that here before Mr. Paletta said that. Sorry, I can't do what you want me to do, man!

Respectfully: I don't care if ANY paper proves anything that goes against the results we see. It's just a paper! Papers are isolated researches like puzzles to contribute to more researches. By the way I love science!!!!!

Let me tell you this: It is MY OPINION that HALIDES + T5s are the best combo of all artificial lights for any reef tank! Is that good now? LOL!!!

Whoever is hurt by my opinion is because deep in your heart you know I'm right!!!! LOL!! Whatever...

you are 100% correct on that statement as the latest research shows, but with enough LEDs over your tank, you can replicate the same effect;; puck style LEDS are old, and you need uniformity and even spread, thus the T5...


anywho, look into the Dsuny T75 popbloom on ebay or amazon, enough of those over your tank will give you the same effect. and wont break your pocket either,,,

these are the most under rated leds....

 

[LegendaryCG]

I know nothing about this topic but I wanted to post anyway.

 

[A. grandis]

And what kind of lights does Dr. Sanjay use now?

I believe 8 to 10 Radion G4s.

 

[A. grandis]

I know nothing about this topic but I wanted to post anyway.

You are welcome here anyway, man! If you have a dog please post a picture of that dog. LOL!!!!

 

[LegendaryCG]

You are welcome here anyway, man! If you have a dog please post a picture of that dog. LOL!!!!

This is Skittles and he wants to know why all the swimmy things get his yummy nori.

 

[OREGONIC]

A lot of it is preference, there are many lights proven to grow coral. I personally stared with AI 26hd’s, I then added t5s for more coverage. When I setup my newer tank I went with a Kessil ap9x and 2 Orphek OR3s to increase the spread. I have since removed the Orpheks and added a second ap9x. I personally love the look Kessils provide, great color and great shimmer.

 

[A. grandis]

you are 100% correct on that statement as the latest research shows, but with enough LEDs over your tank, you can replicate the same effect;; puck style LEDS are old, and you need uniformity and even spread, thus the T5...


anywho, look into the Dsuny T75 popbloom on ebay or amazon, enough of those over your tank will give you the same effect. and wont break your pocket either,,,

these are the most under rated leds....

I totally agree and actually recommend to many of my LED friends to get the whole surface area of their tanks filled with diodes, if they want to choose LEDs. Another very important think using LEDs is to have a diffuser!! BUT... that is to mimic the T5s. Might as well just get an ATI already for much less money and we don't need to worry bout anything else in the near future (decade, at least!), besides changing bulbs. Many of those friends think that too. It doesn't make any sense to get LEDs in the first place if you want to mimic T5s. Besides, T5s will give a bit of real UV and the light will be much more uniform.
That's my opinion on those type of LEDs.

 

[A. grandis]

This is Skittles and he wants to know why all the swimmy things get his yummy nori.

Lovely!!! Thank you so much for the pic!!
Please give it a treat for me, would you??
If anyone else have dogs, please post.
This is supposed to be a fun thread!! Helps to relax.

 

[Dunc]

Lovely!!! Thank you so much for the pic!!
Please give it a treat for me, would you??
If anyone else have dogs, please post.
This is supposed to be a fun thread!! Helps to relax.

Bubbie, but she passed last year