Bio Pellet Reactors, Purple Non Sulphur Bacteria, Protein Skimmers

[Gogol_frag]

Hi y'all,

I want to lower the nitrates in my 1 month old, 170G sumpless reef, which are still consistently showing up as 10-15 ppm. As such, I am getting a bio-pellet reactor. Being a biopellet noob, I have the following questions, and was wondering if y'all have any experience in the matter:

1. Has anyone tried the following reactor, and have any tips for me - Accel Aquatics FR-100?
2. Did you try the following pellets, and/or have any tips for me - Dr. Tim's NP Active Pearls?
3. Do you have any experience in seeding the BioPellets with Purple Non Sulphur Bacteria (which are thought to be food for SPS/LPS like the following product - PNS Pro Bio?
4. Have any of you run a BioPellet reactor but not actively skimmed off the output? - Since the PNS Pro Bio bacteria can be eaten by corals, I was thinking of not overactively skimking them, and maintain my regular skimming routine (14 hours during a 24 hour day, or 35 minutes per hour)

Also, any general advice about running biopellet reactors will be greatly appreciated. Thank you gals and guys!

Just to complete the picture - the pump that I will be using with the reactor is Jebao DCP Sine Wave 3500, and my skimmer is Deltec MCE 601.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Hmm.
Lets see. Yes ive used those pellets. I liked them and bought several times.
The reactor no.
I looked at it and thought about it but it was too tall i think at 40 some odd inches tall.
Seeding bio.pellets with bottle stuff no ive never done that. U can soak the pellets in tank water over time say 12-24hrs or more if u feel it will "seed" them but they are just a bio degradable carbon source for beneficial bacteria to eat and thrive off of. Its basically bolstering your natural process in the tank... i soak mine in regular rodi just to try and get some of the floaters to not float.
The next day u will want to shut the flow off and restart it to drop all the floaters...
I turn the flow up on mine every now and again to flush the pellets and remove any bio film or idol pellet stagnent gunk.
Some run theirs so low it creates a bio film on the surface of the pellets. I do not. I run a good tumble. No film.
I have always skimmed 24/7 the output of the pellet reactors. I am not willing to allow the sludge water to build up in my tank over time. You will get cloudy water at 1st. Rinse the pellets but u will get cloudy water. Ppl report their corals not doing well during this but it will clear over time as the reactor develops.
You will see skimmer output increase. Nasty. Lol.

Theres a reason you dont want to run the skimmer 24/7? You can turn the water height maybe a little and let it ride out?
D

 

[Gogol_frag]

Hmm.
Lets see. Yes ive used those pellets. I liked them and bought several times.
The reactor no.
I looked at it and thought about it but it was too tall i think at 40 some odd inches tall.
Seeding bio.pellets with bottle stuff no ive never done that. U can soak the pellets in tank water over time say 12-24hrs or more if u feel it will "seed" them but they are just a bio degradable carbon source for beneficial bacteria to eat and thrive off of. Its basically bolstering your natural process in the tank... i soak mine in regular rodi just to try and get some of the floaters to not float.
The next day u will want to shut the flow off and restart it to drop all the floaters...
I turn the flow up on mine every now and again to flush the pellets and remove any bio film or idol pellet stagnent gunk.
Some run theirs so low it creates a bio film on the surface of the pellets. I do not. I run a good tumble. No film.
I have always skimmed 24/7 the output of the pellet reactors. I am not willing to allow the sludge water to build up in my tank over time. You will get cloudy water at 1st. Rinse the pellets but u will get cloudy water. Ppl report their corals not doing well during this but it will clear over time as the reactor develops.
You will see skimmer output increase. Nasty. Lol.

Theres a reason you dont want to run the skimmer 24/7? You can turn the water height maybe a little and let it ride out?
D

Thanks for the tips MonkeyC . Greatly appreciated. Follow-up question - did you observe a reduction in pH due to the activities within your bio-pellet reactor?

W.r.t my skimmer schedule - I dose all manners of stuff every hour - kalkwasser, alkalinity, phytoplanktons, rotifers and copepods. So, I keep the mechanical filtration off for 5 minutes prior and 20 minutes after each dosing. That's the reason my skimmer is on for only 35 minutes during each hour.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

I did not monitor the ph before and after as my main concern when i started using bio pellets was water clarity and not coral.growth. i had great coral growth and such at the time and i still had good coral growth after fwiw if that says anything.
Ur skimmer runs during the night or when lights are off?

If your tank is medium to heavy stocked with sps and lps corals. I reccomend starting off with 1/4 of the directed media usage and building up. When the reactor gets going. It wont take long for the new pellet additions to sync and it might detear some of the cloudyness initially.
Which i believe is just the dust debris from manufacturing and maybe some bacterial bloom.
D

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

An older.video of when i 1st set it up and more recently.
My older reactors when i 1st started pellets were like funnels at the bottoms with screens and ball valves and jank. Lol. This is my 1st real pellet reactor.
D

 

[Gogol_frag]

Thanks you so much MonkeyC for sharing these tips! I can't thank you enough.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Np! Larger aquariums use bio reactors or bio drum reactors. Tenji aquariums install ect.
No reason we cant duplicate this on a smaller scale for home aquariums.
Glad ur doing this.
D

 

[blasterman]

The pellets are a form of starch. Basically bacteria food but in solid, slow acting form.

I've never bothered with a reactor. Ive just poured the pellets in a media bag and tossed them in my sump or even back filter. They take a few weeks to ramp up as they colonize but when they get going they can really eat nitrate. Often they do too good a job and I have to cut back. Never seen a change in pH etc. Just my nitrate test going from red to pink over a month or less. Ive actually zeroed out nitrate with bio pellets if I wasn't paying attention.

 

[Gogol_frag]

Np! Larger aquariums use bio reactors or bio drum reactors. Tenji aquariums install ect.
No reason we cant duplicate this on a smaller scale for home aquariums.
Glad ur doing this.
D

Yeah monkeyC my reasons for adding a reactor is the same as yours - improving waterquality / maintaining water quality in spite of heavy feeding.

 

[Gogol_frag]

The pellets are a form of starch. Basically bacteria food but in solid, slow acting form.

I've never bothered with a reactor. Ive just poured the pellets in a media bag and tossed them in my sump or even back filter. They take a few weeks to ramp up as they colonize but when they get going they can really eat nitrate. Often they do too good a job and I have to cut back.

Thanks blasterman! I thought of that trying the media bag as well. My pellets arrive tomorrow and the reactor a couple of days later. So, I guess i will try the media bag route as well, and observe outcomes.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

They are meant to be tumbled not suspended in water to clump together. They work much better if they are rubbed against each other.
D

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Heres my amount on a 16oz bag on 160-180g volume

 

[Deep]

The pellets are a form of starch. Basically bacteria food but in solid, slow acting form.

I've never bothered with a reactor. Ive just poured the pellets in a media bag and tossed them in my sump or even back filter. They take a few weeks to ramp up as they colonize but when they get going they can really eat nitrate. Often they do too good a job and I have to cut back. Never seen a change in pH etc. Just my nitrate test going from red to pink over a month or less. Ive actually zeroed out nitrate with bio pellets if I wasn't paying attention.

how is the bacteria with the nitrates getting exported if it is just in a bag ? I thought the whole idea with the reactorfor pellets was to shake off the bacteria so it can then be skimmed ?

 

[Gogol_frag]

how is the bacteria with the nitrates getting exported if it is just in a bag ? I thought the whole idea with the reactorfor pellets was to shake off the bacteria so it can then be skimmed ?

Deep, is it possible that the bacteria, after they consume the Nitrite is in turn consumed by the corals? ... and the excess bacteria (post-coral consumption) is getting skimmed out? That is what I am hoping to happen, although admittedly while groping in the dark.

So, I am surmising that using the pellets (more efficiently with reactors, less efficiently in a mesh-bag) help propagate the bacteria, that convert Nitrate to Nitrogen gas and then are either skimmed out or remain in the system for further spring-cleaning. In either case Nitrites in the water column will be reduced. - This is just a hope of how things may pan out. I don't have proof.

Blasterman, by keeping the pellets in a mesh-bag did you observe your Nitrate levels reduce? - Understandably i will be running pellets in my reactor, but am genuinely curious about your experience.

 

[Deep]

Deep, is it possible that the bacteria, after they consume the Nitrite is in turn consumed by the corals? ... and the excess bacteria (post-coral consumption) is getting skimmed out? That is what I am hoping to happen, although admittedly while groping in the dark.

So, I am surmising that using the pellets (more efficiently with reactors, less efficiently in a mesh-bag) help propagate the bacteria, that convert Nitrate to Nitrogen gas and then are either skimmed out or remain in the system for further spring-cleaning. In either case Nitrites in the water column will be reduced. - This is just a hope of how things may pan out. I don't have proof.

Blasterman, by keeping the pellets in a mesh-bag did you observe your Nitrate levels reduce? - Understandably i will be running pellets in my reactor, but am genuinely curious about your experience.

the bacteria are on the pellets, thats why you need the reactor to shake them off for any consumption or skimming.

 

[Gogol_frag]

the bacteria are on the pellets, thats why you need the reactor to shake them off for any consumption or skimming.

... aah. I had totally not realized that. Thank you, good sir!

 

[Kenneth Wingerter]

... aah. I had totally not realized that. Thank you, good sir!

No worries, in the case of purple non-sulfur bacteria (at least Rhodopseudomonas palustris, the species in PNS ProBio), the mother cells are sessile (form films), but the daughter cells are motile (swim into the water column). So long as the bacteria successfully colonize the pellets and grow (i.e. reproduce), and the daughter cells can find their way out of the reactor and into a skimmer, you'll certainly be exporting nutrients. Or generating live coral food.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Im under the understanding that your actually trying to create or replicate an aerobic or non aerobic zone.
E.g. area for bacteria to grow. The pellets tumbling and rolling or moving across each other or over each other just rounds the edges and helps break down the carbon source for the bacteria in the reactor or area or zone.

This bacteria created binds proteins for export...? It is a nasty water booster for your protein skimmer basically.
D