Discussion in 'Nuisance Algae (including bacteria)' started by NCreefguy, Jan 19, 2017.
I know i would do a low dose to keep it away.
When I dosed Fluconazole in my tank I left everything running as usual [skimmer included] and have not done a water change since the treatment [a couple of months] and everything looks great
I am battling cloudy water that the polisher clears up but wasn't sure I should run it with the fluconazole in the tank. I did turn off my GFO/GAC reactor and turned my skimmer way down. I dosed last night and this morning I could see white in the tufts. I do believe it's working, just have to wait and see now
My name is Jose Mayo, MD, I live in Brazil and I am part of ReefClub, a good Brazilian site for marine aquarism. It was mine, in 2014, the first account of fluconazole's action on problematic marine algae, especially bryopsis and derbesia, which infested my marine tank. I also carried out the first research on the mechanism of action of fluconazole in these algae and developed the first protocols of treatments that proved to be effective. Since then I have sought to disseminate these observations as much as possible, for the pleasure of watching many aquarist colleagues solve their problems with difficult algae. Sincerely congratulations for the excellent work of disseminating your results on the use of fluconazole in the control of bryopsis and green hair algae; simply amazing!
Keep up the good work!
Thank you all!
Some years ago, more specifically in 2013 and still on the IPAq website, I started a long battle in a series of endless discussions about a personal observation during the treatment of a clown fish of mine that was with signs of fungus, and in an attempt of treatment I made use of some FLUCONAZOL capsules that I had at home, brand ZOLTEC, original mark of Pfizer lab, received from a propagandist, since in civil life I am a doctor.
As it had no hospital aquarium or quarantine, and since the fauna was limited to a couple of A. ocellaris, a Bodianus rufus, some pagurus and turbo snails, and some soft corals (kenias and anemones, basically), I simply dismantled the capsule of 150 mg of Zoltec / FLUCONAZOLE on the same display and I was observing the results.
Fish and other aquarium animals, including amphipods and copepods, felt nothing. The ocellaris fungus was controlled and ... something very strange happened; I cleaned the glass of the aquarium with the frequency of an enthusiastic beginner, and to my amazement, after applying FLUCONAZOL, the algae slimes of the glass simply did not accumulate and I came to realize that the stones and substrate, including some filamentous, also began to disappear ...
I reported the observation in the IPAq and began to research on the subject in order to understand why FLUCONAZOL had this effect and, not without some effort, I discovered that some PRIMITIVE ALGAE, among them Chlorophytes (glass algae), Derbésia , Bryopsis, Caulerpa, Codó, Halimeda and Ulva lactuca (sea lettuce), contained in their cell walls a structural lipid (fat) called ERGOSTEROL, also present in the cell walls of ALL FUNGI and which is precisely the target of attack of FLUCONAZOL , whose mechanism of action is, precisely, to block the enzymes that work in the elaboration of this lipid. Without ERGOSTEROL, the cell wall of the species containing it is weakened, and the organism, thus having diminished defenses, yields to the environment and dies. In ANIMALS IN GENERAL, from protozoan to whale, the predominant mebran lipid is CHOLESTEROL and that FLUCONAZOL does not block. The structural lipid of ZOOXANTHELAS is DINOSTEROL, which is also not blocked by FLUCONAZOL.
I also reported on these facts and discussed them (always in a good way), pretending that some would be enthusiastic, like me, and also try to experiment, since there was nothing in the aquaristic literature that referred to a drug that was CAPABLE OF AFFECTING ALGAE WITHOUT INTERFERING IN THE OTHER BIOTA OF THE AQUARIUM, being therefore REEF SAFE, and that could help the aquarists in the control of DIFFICULT ALGAE, if it were to confirm good results ... what you do now!
Thank you all
I, along with many many many other aquarists thank you. I finally was able to rid my tank of GHA after battling for almost a year. It had gotten so bad I was close to breaking down my tank and starting over. Thank you once again.
Hello Jose and welcome to R2R! Thank you very much for your work and research on this. I wish that I would have found your site earlier. As you can see from my first post, I stumbled across your site through an internet search but couldn't fully understand all of the posts with it being in a different language. Through google translations I got the main points of the treatment more or less and decided to give it a try. I think that I chose a slightly less dosage than what you/others over seas were using just as a starting point. We have our own shop so we've got several reef tanks going and were able to move things if something went wrong. I have had nothing but great results from using Fluconazole. We've got tanks that haven't had water changes in months after dosing and still have no GHA growing in them. We are also working on a low dose continuous use method right now to keep GHA from returning in tanks with regular water changes and it's working even in high nutrient tanks.
Bryopsis has ruined many reef tanks and made so many people quit reefing through the years but that won't have to happen any more. This has really helped tons of people.You can look through the thread or just search the internet now and see all of the people it is helping or has helped. We will continue to spread the word and help people kill their bryopsis using fluconazole. Thank you again Jose.
Many thanks, @NCreefguy, for the excellent work!
You have indeed succeeded!
I have to thank you all and be very pleased with your excellent results.
The genus Bryopsidales (bryopsis, derbesia, caulerpa, ulva, codium, halimeda) are algae with a cenocytic cell structure, do not have complete cell division and all algae functions as a single cell. Fluconazole blocks the synthesis of "new ergosterol," but does not remove ergosterol that is already on the cell wall. The alga has to grow (form more wall) so that, in the absence of ergosterol, this "new wall" is fragile and allows the environment to penetrate the cell and disorganize it ... so bryopsis "begins to die" by the growth tips and the disorganization is "top-down" in the filaments, until it becomes complete.
I treated with fluconazole several months ago successfully. I used 2000mg fluconazole USP powder for my 200 gallon tank. I noticed some tiny spots coming back months later and now it is quite worse again. I just redosed today... 2200mg (I think my actual volume is more like 110 gallons). Should I just plan on dosing again in a period of time to prevent it from coming back as it has this time?
I have read in some posts the suggestion to try TERBINEFINE, an optional antifungal, for algae control, replacing Fluconazole ...
DO NOT TRY IN THE FISH TANK !!!
TERBINEFINE IS EXTREMELY TOXIC FOR ALL FISH !!!
See the Safety data sheet:
For information only, fluconazole is already dissolved in injectable (intravenous) form, the carrier of which is water with 0.9% sodium chloride (saline solution), sold in plastic bottles up to 400 mg / 200 ml in solution 0.9% sodium chloride, suitable for human or veterinary use.
In my opinion, this aqueous vehicle with sodium chloride is much less likely to change the parameters of the tank and the results of the application, and it is much simpler to adjust the dose to the actual volume of the tank than with the formulations in tablets or capsules.
I suppose that in this pharmaceutical form it might be possible to define with much more precision and reproducibility the minimum dose required to control the "difficult algae", allowing the least possible interference in tank balance.
So something of note (@NCreefguy -- let me know what you think). Everytime there's a heat wave, and my tank hits 82 or more, bryopsis comes back hard and fast. It was gone for months, not even a single strand of the stuff. Two days after a heatwave it's thick everywhere.
This has happened twice now. Both times directly after a heat wave, where my tank reaches 82* degrees.
Anybody else notice this? Because if this is the case, I'm going to have to stockup every summer for life.
I’ve struggled with this algae for months not knowing how or what to use to treat it and thank god I finally found the solution. Many days of picking algae from my rocks and scrubbing the fur coat that lines the inside glass as well as this algae trying to kill my coral I’ve had enough.
I’m on day three of the Flucon treatment and I’m seeing bigger chunks of algae floating away from rock and it appears to be in a wilting stage. I’m very hopeful that within 7-10 days I’ll be able to finally go in and do a cleanup and get rid of most or all of it. From the results shown I’m excited to have my clean coral farm back and not this hideous pest that keeps popping up. I’m curious if bryopsis is from bad carts in a Rodi and the fungus passes through it such as the sediment filter. It’s not shown as a TDS in the meter sho it slips passed. I’ll post my results after 10 days or so and help prove this method. Also my fish had no trouble at all with it so far and when I dosed it the chunks floated and my puffer booed at the medication and it seems unaffected. Thanks for posting this and I’ll post again soo with my results!
@ReefManKen -- Manually remove as much as possible everyday. The loose stuff. If you grab a patch and really gotta give it a firm tug, try again tomorrow. If you can grab it and a gentle pull dislodges it, take it out.
Weather it be some type of spore, or remnants of the algae growing back from bits and pieces left over.. There's a chance it may come back. So give it all the time it needs to die, and remove every bit you can.
Additionally, this helps with nutrient spikes -- I'm not anti-nutrient, I'm actually pretty for nutrients. But last time I ran this my phosphates spiked to 0.80 (not a typo) -- And while I'm fine with that, some people scream in horror at the thought, and overreact causing more problems.. Just po4 for thought.
Bryopsis não deveria ser podada:
Vida sem membrana celular: regeneração de protoplastos de células desintegradas da alga verde marinha Bryopsis plumosa.
Kim GH 1, Klotchkova TA , Kang YM .
Informação sobre o autor
Quando as células gigantes multi-nucleadas da alga verde Bryopsis plumosa (Huds.) Ag. são feridos, o protoplasma é extrudido das células e pode gerar espontaneamente numerosas células novas. As organelas celulares agregam-se rapidamente na água do mar e ficam cobertas com um envelope gelatinoso dentro de 15 minutos. Uma membrana de células lipídicas é formada dentro do envelope dentro de 9 a 12 horas e cerca de 15% da membrana celular original é reciclado para formar a membrana de novos protoplastos. Estudos citoquímicos usando Nile Red e várias enzimas revelaram que o envelope primário é inicialmente composto de polissacarídeos e, em seguida, transformado em um complexo polissacarídeo-lipídico. A coloração com diacetate de fluoresceína mostrou que o envelope primário possui algumas características de uma membrana celular, incluindo semi-permeabilidade e transporte seletivo de materiais. A agregação de organelas celulares parece ser mediada por dois tipos de materiais, um presente na seiva vacuolar e outro na superfície das organelas celulares. Cerca de mil novas células foram geradas a partir de um único ramo desintegrado e 40% deles finalmente se desenvolveram em plantas maduras.
Bryopsis should not be pruned:
Life without a cell membrane: regeneration of protoplasts from disintegrated cells of the marine green alga Bryopsis plumosa.
Kim GH1, Klotchkova TA, Kang YM.
When the multi-nucleate giant cells of the green alga Bryopsis plumosa (Huds.) Ag. are injured, the protoplasm is extruded from the cells and can generate spontaneously numerous new cells. The cell organelles aggregate rapidly in seawater and become covered with a gelatinous envelope within 15 minutes. A lipid cell membrane is formed inside the envelope within 9 to 12 hours and about 15% of the original cell membrane is recycled to make the membrane of new protoplasts. Cytochemical studies using Nile Red and various enzymes revealed that the primary envelope is initially composed of polysaccharides, and then transformed into a polysaccharide-lipid complex. Fluorescein diacetate staining showed that the primary envelope has some characteristics of a cell membrane including semi-permeability and selective transport of materials. The aggregation of cell organelles appears to be mediated by two kinds of materials, one present in vacuolar sap and the other on the surface of the cell organelles. About a thousand new cells were generated from a single disintegrated branch and 40% of them eventually developed into mature plants.
Interesting! Although I'm talking about the dead stuff, not the live stuff if that makes a difference.
Than in my case, I would need to leave the fluconazole in the tank for a considerable amount of time. As stopping medication before there is zero trace of it would take a seriously long time.
Yes, but if necessary, Water Change can be made by setting the proportional dose of Fluconazole and you can run GFO.
I am pretty sure what is growing in my tank might not be bryopsis. A week after putting 2000mg in a 100 gal. system and it's not much different than when I started. It has some white looking parts but has not shrunk or faded away.
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