Carx regulator solenoid off when it shoudnt

[Lasse]

Ya minute doesn't work. I wonder what the lowest is

The graphs is stored locally and is uploaded now and than to the cloud. Of some reasons - I do not know why - it will not upload if any window (at least on a PC) is open with connection to the cloud. I do not know the upload frequency but it looks like it is a couple of hours between the uploads. Every p4 can store a little more than 8000 data points and when the local memory is filled up - it delete the oldest data points. If you have a lot of events logged and too short periods - you can get effects like these of @ingchr1 . Remember to shout down the open browsers windows to the cloud - what´s with open apps windows I do not know. Your minute sample works - but you have to wait som hours (with closed connection) before you can see the data point from your cloud. I use 5 minutes sample time but probably will have more safety (not losing individual data points) using 10 minutes. If you change the sample time on one device - you change for all others too.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[ajhudson15]

Ya minute doesn't work. I wonder what the lowest is

Please watch this video. You will definitely appreciate the simplicity in this video. Doing this method means all you ever have to touch is the ph setting. you never have to count bubbles or adjust that setting. My friend showed this to em and I have had mine setup like this for 6 months and have never had to touch it. As your alk demand increases you just slowly lower the ph target value in the controller

 

[Deep]

Please watch this video. You will definitely appreciate the simplicity in this video. Doing this method means all you ever have to touch is the ph setting. you never have to count bubbles or adjust that setting. My friend showed this to em and I have had mine setup like this for 6 months and have never had to touch it. As your alk demand increases you just slowly lower the ph target value in the controller

Looks like when it comes to tuning Carx, there are 2 different ways of going about it ( and in R2R we always see these 2 play out). One that says dont bother about the PH probe, and only focus on effluent and bubble rate. And another that says just let your PH control.

Letting your PH probe control the output is certainly the more easier method. I can vouch for that because I have been trying unsuccessfully trying to adjust the bubble count.

Wonder if there is any advantages at all in controlling using bubble count /effluent ? Will it affect the PH of the tank ?

 

[ajhudson15]

Looks like when it comes to tuning Carx, there are 2 different ways of going about it ( and in R2R we always see these 2 play out). One that says dont bother about the PH probe, and only focus on effluent and bubble rate. And another that says just let your PH control.

Letting your PH probe control the output is certainly the more easier method. I can vouch for that because I have been trying unsuccessfully trying to adjust the bubble count.

Wonder if there is any advantages at all in controlling using bubble count /effluent ? Will it affect the PH of the tank ?

I did not have a drop in tank ph doing this method because the effluent is steady not dripping and never changes but 1 ph. so for a 125 gallon tank and the effluent ph changing 1ph it is so diluted it doesn't affect much. this process of controlling ph is much better because your matching the alk in the tank with the effluent so your not going up znd down with the effluent rate and trying to catch up from alk drops.

 

[ingchr1]

@Lasse, I'm not sure that's the complete issue. The P4 is also not recording as it should. This morning I cleared out all the measurement data on the P4 via GCC. I just downloaded the measurement data directly from the P4 and there are only 208 data points in the log. And not every data point has both temperature and pH in it (the two sensors I have connected). There should be at least 600 data points, as its been over ten hours of recording at 1 per minute.

Here's the chart (logged in via the Web Server) then what's in the P4 log for that time period. The chart is missing a few data points from the P4 log, but the P4 log is also not recording data every minute.

 

[Michael Gray]

so here it is currently.. looks like the PH gets to 6.5 every 30 minutes.. goes to 6.5 to 6.8 then 6.5 ... looking at graph its close to approx every 30 min.... is this to much for the Solenoid or my GHL outlet?

*EDIT* actually looking at it .. it goes from 6.5 to 7.8 in 12 minutes.. and then back down to 6.5 in 20 minutes.. is that to frequent for the outlet?? should i set it up to climb to 6.70 before it goes back down?

 

[Lasse]

it goes from 6.5 to 7.8 in 12 minutes

I suppose i it should be 6.5 - 6.8

Please your complete settings. If you have the same as before - I would test to rise the amount of CO2 (higher bubble rate) a little. Not worry about the GHL bar - it will manage this and much, much, much more. I have never been out for a PB that have failure because of to many cycles with such low load that you have from a solenoid.

This is a typical pattern when you have your controller mode set as two position controller - test these settings instead - the will give you a smother curve - but you have to rise the bubble rate a little

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Lasse]

@Lasse, I'm not sure that's the complete issue. The P4 is also not recording as it should. This morning I cleared out all the measurement data on the P4 via GCC. I just downloaded the measurement data directly from the P4 and there are only 208 data points in the log. And not every data point has both temperature and pH in it (the two sensors I have connected). There should be at least 600 data points, as its been over ten hours of recording at 1 per minute.

Here's the chart (logged in via the Web Server) then what's in the P4 log for that time period. The chart is missing a few data points from the P4 log, but the P4 log is also not recording data every minute.

Never noted this - thank you @Vinny@GHLUSA have you seen this?

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Sallstrom]

If you set you pH at a certain number, then you can adjust the flow through instead. Controlling the KH by decreasing the pH in the CaRx might lead to too low pH and all media/coral gravel will turn into rubbery mud, and clog the reactor.

Like Lasse tried to explain before in this thread, if using pH and a solenoid valve, you should have lots of bubbles compared to if you run a reactor with just bubble count and no solenoid valve. Then you have bubbles 24/7. With a pH control you give more CO2 at the time, but only when needed. If you do not have enough bubbles/CO2, the solenoid valve can’t help you. Crank it up

 

[Vinny@GHLUSA]

Never noted this - thank you @Vinny@GHLUSA have you seen this?

Sincerely Lasse

@ingchr1 Open a support ticket so the team can look into this.

 

[ingchr1]

@ingchr1 Open a support ticket so the team can look into this.

Will do

 

[Michael Gray]

@Vinny@GHLUSA any idea what is bad for the outlet for solenoid turning on and off.. what time gap does GHL recommend to be ok for off and on off and on? id hate for outlet to burn out if its turning off and then turning back on every 30-45 min.

 

[Lasse]

Who is telling you that there is a problem with "burning" outlets with GHL:s powerbars? Is it the same guy that's tell you to have the solenoid on as much as possible? IME there is no such problem. As I said before - never have had any problem with burning outlets with the different types of powerbars that GHL have. And I have been running wirh cycles less than 2-3 minuters for years. The power hub can be sensitive acording to high wattage ( more than 1000 W) but not the powerbars

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Michael Gray]

Who is telling you that there is a problem with "burning" outlets with GHL:s powerbars? Is it the same guy that's tell you to have the solenoid on as much as possible? IME there is no such problem. As I said before - never have had any problem with burning outlets with the different types of powerbars that GHL have. And I have been running wirh cycles less than 2-3 minuters for years. The power hub can be sensitive acording to high wattage ( more than 1000 W) but not the powerbars

Sincerely Lasse

I'm not saying your wrong at all. I'm just researching and making sure.

It's in the directions from ghl.

How to setup Calcium Reactor control

www.aquariumcomputer.com

 

[Lasse]

I never seen this and never have problems with this. We run several solenoids with the lowest hysteresis (0.05 in pH) and in worse case 30 seconds cycles. Done it for years. Normally it switch on for around 20 sec every 5 minutes. Please se the video for bubble rate.

Only time we have "burn" a solenoid is when the CO2 has run out and the solenoid has been on for prolonged period. Therefore we have a shout down command of the outlet for the CO2 solenoid if there is an alarm active.

By the way @Vinny@GHLUSA - copy and paste is not always the best to do

About Hysteresis​

To top
The number you enter here will determine how much of a swing you are willing to allow in-between the nominal value. This determines when the pH control function is triggered.

By default, this value is set to 0.20°C or 0.36°F. This value works for most individuals. If you want a tighter or wider range of control, type in a smaller or larger value. Be careful NOT to make the hysteresis too small because it will cause the solenoid to switch ON/OFF too quickly in-between reactions which may damage the solenoid and put heavier wear on the Powerbar outlet.

The hysteresis of the pH probe is in pH units - nor degrees

Of experience - this is a no existing problem with low wattage equipment as a solenoid. However - as I have say before - high wattage equipment (like 1000 W heaters) and the power hub can burn the relay in the hub. It has happens us more than once. But not with any of the powerbars (different relays?)

Sincerely Lasse

 

[ingchr1]

@Lasse, I'm not sure that's the complete issue. The P4 is also not recording as it should. This morning I cleared out all the measurement data on the P4 via GCC. I just downloaded the measurement data directly from the P4 and there are only 208 data points in the log. And not every data point has both temperature and pH in it (the two sensors I have connected). There should be at least 600 data points, as its been over ten hours of recording at 1 per minute.

Here's the chart (logged in via the Web Server) then what's in the P4 log for that time period. The chart is missing a few data points from the P4 log, but the P4 log is also not recording data every minute.

Just as a follow up to this post, I submitted a support ticket and here was the response:

"Hi,

the ProfiLux 4 optimizes the measurement recording and doesn't sample sensor values, that have been previously the same value.

That's why the pH or temperature sensor's value are not recorded every minute. If there's been no change for over 60 minutes, the value will be always recorded even if there's no difference to the last measured value.

According to your uploaded data this can be considered as normal behavior and there's nothing wrong with it."

 

[Lasse]

Just as a follow up to this post, I submitted a support ticket and here was the response:

"Hi,

the ProfiLux 4 optimizes the measurement recording and doesn't sample sensor values, that have been previously the same value.

That's why the pH or temperature sensor's value are not recorded every minute. If there's been no change for over 60 minutes, the value will be always recorded even if there's no difference to the last measured value.

According to your uploaded data this can be considered as normal behavior and there's nothing wrong with it."

Thanks - good to know

Sincerely Lasse