Consistency with Chaeto

[Stevorino]

Hey Friends!

I have a couple acropora frags in my reef tank and they never seem to be happy (constantly browned/faded colors, but still encrusting/growing slowly). They've been in there about a year.

All other corals (especially Montiporas) are doing well. I keep my parameters around this at most times:


Alk: 9
Calc: 430
Phos: 0.1 (sometimes less, after a Phos-X dose)
Magnesium: ~1300
Nitrate: 0 (measured by Red Sea Kits - I haven't seen it detectable in a year or two, using multiple brands of kits)

120g Display - 250g total system
Rare water changes
Feed a cube of Mysis Shrimp, twice daily (increased on purpose to drive up Nitrates)


I've played with lighting and other factors and now believe Nitrate is the issue.... which I think my Chaeto situation may be at play.

With my Chaeto, I essentially let it grow up to the point where it'd almost fill up a 5 gallon bucket (I have a 120g refugium), rip off 3/4 of it and throw it away... and then let that remaining 1/4 grow back up over the course of a month or two until it's a big amount again. Am I right in assuming the Chaeto may be sucking up most of the nitrate availability and what is the considered 'best practice' in regards to managing chaeto growth to keep nitrates consistently low, and available for Corals.

 

[hotdrop]

I’ve been playing around with mine recently, I started with a full sump worth and now I’m down to a baseball size clump and still at near 0 detectable phosphate/nitrate. Alk consumption has gone up since I decreased the amount of Chaeto and turf algee growth has stayed roughly the same.

 

[AlgaeBarn]

I have found that in already low nutrient systems, using a slower growing macro can really help manage your tanks balance. While chaeto is super popular, if you are running a low bio load you may want to try something like red ogo or pom pom which absorbs nutrients overall more slowly than chaeto or sea lettuce. That being said, if your fish and invert load is pretty high and you feed heavy stick with chaeto and keep experimenting with size!

 

[Stevorino]

I’ve been playing around with mine recently, I started with a full sump worth and now I’m down to a baseball size clump and still at near 0 detectable phosphate/nitrate. Alk consumption has gone up since I decreased the amount of Chaeto and turf algee growth has stayed roughly the same.

How long have you been at that baseball size?

What confuses me is that even when I throw away a bunch (and theoretically have 10-20% of previous chaeto size in sump), the nitrates remain undetectable. This weekend I may just take all but a baseball size out and monitor daily to see if I can get any nitrates to come through.

 

[Stevorino]

I have found that in already low nutrient systems, using a slower growing macro can really help manage your tanks balance. While chaeto is super popular, if you are running a low bio load you may want to try something like red ogo or pom pom which absorbs nutrients overall more slowly than chaeto or sea lettuce. That being said, if your fish and invert load is pretty high and you feed heavy stick with chaeto and keep experimenting with size!

Great feedback - If this size changeup doesn't workout, I'll definitely try a different type of macro before dosing Nitrates (which seems like the next step in this process?). Thank you!

 

[JCOLE]

Might need to dose Nitrates. I have the same issue. I have low Nitrates. Anywhere from 1-6ppm. I dose Nitrates 2-3 times a week to stay consist with these levels otherwise they will drop to 0.

I know the Chaeto is sucking it all out. That is why I dose Nitrates. I would rather dose and keep the Chaeto so it will keep my Nitrates at bay rather than pull the Chaeto and run the risk of high nitrates.

 

[Stevorino]

Might need to dose Nitrates. I have the same issue. I have low Nitrates. Anywhere from 1-6ppm. I dose Nitrates 2-3 times a week to stay consist with these levels otherwise they will drop to 0.

I know the Chaeto is sucking it all out. That is why I dose Nitrates. I would rather dose and keep the Chaeto so it will keep my Nitrates at bay rather than pull the Chaeto and run the risk of high nitrates.

Hmmm... makes a lot of sense.

If you don't mind sharing - what are you using to dose, how much, and how big is your system? Are you seeing noticeable improvement with coral growth?

 

[Larry L]

if you are running a low bio load you may want to try something like red ogo or pom pom which absorbs nutrients overall more slowly than chaeto or sea lettuce.

Sean, do you have a feel for how much nitrate that chaeto or any of the other common macros pull out as compared to phosphates? Would you expect to see nitrates bottoming out first, or phosphates, or both? Or does it just depend on the ratio that you had to start with? Are some types better at removing nitrates and some better at removing phosphates?

 

[AlgaeBarn]

Hey! Greg here, Actually sea lettuce has shown to do a bit of a better job on phosphates than chaeto! with everything its about levels initially sure... because if you have a very high phosphate but not too much nitrate, as soon as nitrate is removed most macros will likely stop absorbing the phosphate as well!

 

[AlgaeBarn]

Great feedback - If this size changeup doesn't workout, I'll definitely try a different type of macro before dosing Nitrates (which seems like the next step in this process?). Thank you!

Dosing nitrates is definitely an option! Using a slower growing macro may help to eliminate the need to dose though, if growth rate falls into step with your nutrient levels, and you get your trimming schedule dialed in, you may maintain nitrate without having to dose!

 

[BeejReef]

It's easier to regulate export by varying the photoperiod on your macroalgae than it is to try and prune it to the "ideal" size.

I'm not there now, but at points, I've lit it as little as 4 hours a day. Leaves you room to push-button maneuver if you find you need more export. You can ramp back up without waiting a few weeks for the algae to regrow.

 

[hotdrop]

How long have you been at that baseball size?

What confuses me is that even when I throw away a bunch (and theoretically have 10-20% of previous chaeto size in sump), the nitrates remain undetectable. This weekend I may just take all but a baseball size out and monitor daily to see if I can get any nitrates to come through.

Takes about two weeks to double. I have this routine now where I divide it into 2 clumps and throw one of the clumps away.

 

[hotdrop]

I have found that in already low nutrient systems, using a slower growing macro can really help manage your tanks balance. While chaeto is super popular, if you are running a low bio load you may want to try something like red ogo or pom pom which absorbs nutrients overall more slowly than chaeto or sea lettuce. That being said, if your fish and invert load is pretty high and you feed heavy stick with chaeto and keep experimenting with size!

It’s funny I keep telling everyone on my local Facebook Group that not buying my chaeto from you is so far my biggest reefing mistake I’ve made but somehow I can’t overcome that mental hurdle and pay for the shipping on the red ogo because the chaeto works well enough. Now if you could sell me something that actually eats the dang turf algae I might finally be able to make that 40$ minimum for shipping, purple urchin and yellow tang so far have been unsuccessful.

 

[minus9]

It’s funny I keep telling everyone on my local Facebook Group that not buying my chaeto from you is so far my biggest reefing mistake I’ve made but somehow I can’t overcome that mental hurdle and pay for the shipping on the red ogo because the chaeto works well enough. Now if you could sell me something that actually eats the dang turf algae I might finally be able to make that 40$ minimum for shipping, purple urchin and yellow tang so far have been unsuccessful.

Sometimes Mexican turbo snails will eat turf algae, but it's hit or miss.

 

[minus9]

Keep it mind if you dose nitrates and you have zero phosphates, you'll have negative results.

 

[AlgaeBarn]

It’s funny I keep telling everyone on my local Facebook Group that not buying my chaeto from you is so far my biggest reefing mistake I’ve made but somehow I can’t overcome that mental hurdle and pay for the shipping on the red ogo because the chaeto works well enough. Now if you could sell me something that actually eats the dang turf algae I might finally be able to make that 40$ minimum for shipping, purple urchin and yellow tang so far have been unsuccessful.

I have personally had sally lightfoot crabs that have munched turf algae, completely tore through and ended my issue... but unfortunately there are issues with them in tanks sometimes too (never had a problem personally, they have never eaten my fish or anything lol). I think them and maybe halloween hermits I have seen go after the stuff too. I would say turf algae is a crab thing... maybe even emeralds? Good luck finding the right "picker" to wear that down!

 

[Bret Brinkmann]

Might need to dose Nitrates. I have the same issue. I have low Nitrates. Anywhere from 1-6ppm. I dose Nitrates 2-3 times a week to stay consist with these levels otherwise they will drop to 0.

I know the Chaeto is sucking it all out. That is why I dose Nitrates. I would rather dose and keep the Chaeto so it will keep my Nitrates at bay rather than pull the Chaeto and run the risk of high nitrates.

It sounds like your nitrates are already at bay. If your goal is to keep nitrates low, then dosing nitrates should be counterproductive right? Seems like you're creating more work for yourself. Have you tried reducing the amount of cheato to try and better match the level of nitrates you want to maintain? Looks like you export faster than what naturally builds up so why not slow export down instead of dosing what you don't want getting out of hand?

Sean, do you have a feel for how much nitrate that chaeto or any of the other common macros pull out as compared to phosphates? Would you expect to see nitrates bottoming out first, or phosphates, or both? Or does it just depend on the ratio that you had to start with? Are some types better at removing nitrates and some better at removing phosphates?

I have a planted tank with various caulerpas and gracilarias. My tanks pulls nitrates like crazy but not as much phosphates. Without dosing phosphates they usually test in between 0.015 to 0.2 ppm. Wide range I know but I'm slowly getting it dialed in. It greatly depends on the size of my macros. Which occasionally experience a die off if I can't prune regularly due to life.

My tank can easily use over 20 ppm nitrates in about 3 to 4 days. I do have a 4 inch deep sand bed which I've measured can reduce 20 ppm nitrates per week consistently, at least before I got macros. I have to dose nitrates for my macros but rarely do I need to dose phosphates.

 

[JCOLE]

I found it is a constant battle. I know what to expect by dosing Nitrates. If I take away Chaeto then I run the risk of too many Nitrates going into the system. Dosing Nitrates every couple days is not a lot of work.