Copepod Question (as related to Pipefish/Mandarin feeding). How am I doing?

[TedsReef]

Hello everyone. I recently seeded my DT with Tisbe pods in preparation for a Pipefish pair or a single Mandarin. I have about 20lb dry rock (so it's white). I'm going to allow 2-4 weeks for them to get established before adding fish that will eat them (tank currently only has 1 torch coral, 2 palys, and 3 snails).

It's only been three days since I seeded the tank. I've been observing some pods that I can see on the glass and back wall. I see an increasing number with eggs each day.

I'm also cultivating Tisbe using a 2L bottle method to help keep populations up.

Anyone with experience able to offer any tips (add a different type of pod, pod feeding schedule, etc)?

 

[ihavecrabs]

Hey @TedsReef

Depending on how new or stable the tank is, it is common to see pod populations ebb and flow. I would recommend feeding the tank well and providing them an area of refuge to ensure continued ability to repopulate away from predators. If you started the tank recently and with dry rock, it can take up to a year to get the rock well established enough to maintain a high amount of stability to enable the pod population to flourish. Some people find it takes 6 months, others over a year. All depends on the tank!

Re-seeding with your culture is a great way to continue to boost the population and keep it healthy.

My #1 recommendation would be to wait on your purchase until you have sustained a thriving pod population for a month or so. You're much more likely to have success if the pod population does most the work for you

Good luck!

 

[Paul B]

I don't know how old or big your tank is, but pods will starve to death in a very new, clean tank. I would wait until you have a nice growth on your rocks.

 

[TedsReef]

Thanks all. It's a new tank - a little over a month. I do have some cyano on the rocks. I've also been crushing 4 small fish food pellets, combining with some tank water, then spraying the rocks once a week. I'll be more patient!

 

[Subsea]

Thanks all. It's a new tank - a little over a month. I do have some cyano on the rocks. I've also been crushing 4 small fish food pellets, combining with some tank water, then spraying the rocks once a week. I'll be more patient!

You have the right processes in place. While awaiting tank maturity, continue feeding dry pellets to feed pods, bacteria and algae. If you have a phytoplankton culture you should feed your pods phytoplankton. At differrent life stages, both amphipods & copepods are herbivores and detrivores.

With the fish that you have selected, every other inhabitant must not compete with the live food supply these fish require. To keep interest up while awaiting addittion of fish, consider an interesting scavenger like Coral Banded Shrimp and/or Serpent Starfish. I have Mandarin’s in both display tanks. They graze continually and are very amniable fish. I know nothing about pipe fish.

 

[Hermie]

Any update on how your pods have come along?

 

[TedsReef]

Any update on how your pods have come along?

I cultivated tigger pods for about 6 weeks (so dosed them 3 times in the tank). I stopped because I read that they won’t survive in a tank (I never noticed them in the tank after 2-3 days and I have no predators) and since I was trying to seed, it was pointless at this time.

My Tisbe pods are still going. I feed a couple drops of phyto and sprinkle a little reef roids in every 4-5 days. Despite constant seeding, it seems they haven’t taken hold in my tank or were consumed by other pods. At one point they were all over the tank but I haven’t seen Tisbe in a while. There are now two dominant pods in my tank: some type of ostracod and a larger size, slender, grayish pod that moves quickly across my rocks.

 

[Hermie]

I cultivated tigger pods for about 6 weeks (so dosed them 3 times in the tank). I stopped because I read that they won’t survive in a tank (I never noticed them in the tank after 2-3 days and I have no predators) and since I was trying to seed, it was pointless at this time.

My Tisbe pods are still going. I feed a couple drops of phyto and sprinkle a little reef roids in every 4-5 days. Despite constant seeding, it seems they haven’t taken hold in my tank or were consumed by other pods. At one point they were all over the tank but I haven’t seen Tisbe in a while. There are now two dominant pods in my tank: some type of ostracod and a larger size, slender, grayish pod that moves quickly across my rocks.

Im setting up a "QT" to hold all my mollies tomorrow because they are destroying the apoc pods I seeded yesterday. DT will only have a puffer for a few weeks, hopefully I can est. a decent population. Do you have much algae in your tank? As far as population growth, you only get out a portion of what you put in (food). I wonder if RG complete would be safe to dose in a DT. https://reefnutrition.com/product_rgcomplete.php

 

[TedsReef]

Im setting up a "QT" to hold all my mollies tomorrow because they are destroying the apoc pods I seeded yesterday. DT will only have a puffer for a few weeks, hopefully I can est. a decent population. Do you have much algae in your tank? As far as population growth, you only get out a portion of what you put in (food). I wonder if RG complete would be safe to dose in a DT. https://reefnutrition.com/product_rgcomplete.php

I've never had a disturbing amount of algae but I've always had algae. The back wall will go through phases of having fuzz to being bare. I've never used RG complete but you can probably dose any live or otherwise type of phyto food. I use AlgaeBarn's phyto.

 

[lapin]

Im setting up a "QT" to hold all my mollies tomorrow because they are destroying the apoc pods I seeded yesterday. DT will only have a puffer for a few weeks, hopefully I can est. a decent population. Do you have much algae in your tank? As far as population growth, you only get out a portion of what you put in (food). I wonder if RG complete would be safe to dose in a DT. https://reefnutrition.com/product_rgcomplete.php

The answer is yes it is reef safe. So is Phytofeast. Yes it will feed the pods as they go thru the filter feeding stage. Having a tank that is full of green water may not be the best look. Also it might cause nutrient problems in a new tank. I did this when seeding my tank. I dont have a nutrient problem now, but had a lot of green dust on everything for a month while doing this.
I also seeded Amphipods. I think they are good at keeping hair and other unwanted algaes from getting started. They are also a bigger burger. My angel and wrasses pick them off all day long. Once your rock as a good coating of crud the pods will be able to reproduce without you having feed them much.
You can also keep a pod hotel in your sump and put that in your tank once a week at night. Pods will migrate to your rock under the cover of darkness like a vampire.

 

[Subsea]

Pods are not vampires. They are opportunist! In mass, they will eat a whale one bite at a time

AND, THEY ARE IN THE FOOD CHAIN FOR EVERYBODY.

 

[rayjay]

I find it odd that you could see tisbe with eggs. I've been culturing tisbe for a LONG time now and have a hard time seeing them at ANY time without being able to hold a water sample up to a strong light. The largest they get is about a millimetre in size (that's about 25.4 of them at their largest to make up an inch)
For me, they culture best in shallow volumes in trays, and, do best at cooler temperatures. Purpose for my culturing has been to augment feeding for seahorse fry.
The rate of growth is NOT such that you can maintain a mandarin or other fish solely on this diet as first of all, they are so small that to be of any significance it takes a LOT of these to feed a mandarin.
While I routinely add tisbe pods to the adult seahorse tanks just out of curiosity, I don't ever see any once introduced, even in the sump where the live rock is kept. In any case it most certainly won't sustain even one seahorse, and IME, the seahorses don't even show interest in small foods, preferring something larger in size like amphipods and enriched adult brine.

 

[Hermie]

The rate of growth is NOT such that you can maintain a mandarin or other fish solely on this diet as first of all, they are so small that to be of any significance it takes a LOT of these to feed a mandarin.
While I routinely add tisbe pods to the adult seahorse tanks just out of curiosity, I don't ever see any once introduced, even in the sump where the live rock is kept. In any case it most certainly won't sustain even one seahorse, and IME, the seahorses don't even show interest in small foods, preferring something larger in size like amphipods and enriched adult brine.

Reading from more experienced people, it's becoming clear that copepods in a tank are more or less just to enrich the day-to-day of a dragonette and that supplemental feedings would become the really the main source of nutrition via some DIY "feeder" device. I mean, the levels of resources required just to culture phyto/copepods in a separate containers are large enough that they'd overtake the "character" of any display tank/sump/refugium combo if those two "goals" were combined (for convenience sake, feeding a dragonette within the same environement the food is grown in). Maybe I'm not making sense, but my original hope of having enough copepods to feed a mandarin is making me realize that I'd need a relatively massive refugium in which copepods could be mature if I am not feeding the fish w/ supplemental frozen(ideally) food. Now I'll think about setting up a separate Refugium to go w/ my sump, but it's not looking easy