Could water changes become a thing of the past? i.e. tank chemistry

[Anthony Scholfield]

Watched a live on Instagram tonight with arguing about this. I left a comment “where’s the chemist?”
It seems I found him.

Haha I was also there this evening.

So we go to solutions. How can we solve issues like thes. My simple answer is once again tank chemistry. Lets say you have higher nitrates, skip the water change and dose iron. Iron has been proven to accelerate the growth of corals. What happens when corals are growing faster than normal? They consume more nutrients... Faster. So now your nitrate issue is out the door.

Disclaimer: im not a chemist so someone can correct me if im off.

Its my understanding that iron also fuels algae growth. I use some to help my chaeto grow. Its also my understanding that algae can consume these things faster than our corals. It seems to me adding more iron would not be helpful.

Also, its my understanding that too much iron can be harmful to our ecosystems. So to be sure we are not over dosing we would have to do regular ICP tests. Also, coral better absorbs ammonia as a food source than nitrate.

You make it sound like dosing iron is a magic potion to coral growth and thus the coral will eat up all our nitrate. I dont believe this is the case and is a bit misleading.

 

[mdb_talon]

My thought is that it is not a new concept. There are countless threads on R2R about it and countless people doing no or few water changes. Not that i am saying it should be or cant be discussed further just that this is already a very common approach for a subset of the reefing community.

Personally i think there are many ways to run a tank and i think we are a long way from saying there is a "best" approach in regards to WC or no WC. Likely never will get to that point as it os going to vary a lot based on both the tank and goals.

 

[Susan Edwards]

Great article. I think times change and it gives reefers the opportunity to change or experiement to find better ways or simpler ways or even just different

I have a new upgraded tank since Oct. No water changes to date. Even had a manifold put in to use for water changes. All is stable. I dose, including the trace following Red Sea's recipe except not doing it every day yet. I will look into dosing more iron for the nitrates which just started to climb. I was at low nutrients for a long time and had to dose po4. Now that is stable, no3 around 10-20. Do have algae coming so there are excess nutrients to deal with which I am with fuge, nopox and an algae scrubber.

I use as needed chemi pure blue or elite, carbon, phosguard and purigen. I also dose mb7 to get more bacteria. It's taken me 3 months to get my alk/ca/mg stable or pretty stable so I don't want to do big water changes that will mess with that. I do plan to hook up an awc with the neptune dos I have, but will do very small changes to keep things stable. Undecided when to start or how much to do on a 220g system. Had planned on 3 gal a day but that might be too much if I want to keep stable. the manifold will be for bigger changes if I have to treat the tank like with chemiclean or such, but this time around, really working on stability

 

[Alistairn1]

In reef tanks specifically, I have made some observations related water changes. Firstly, I would think that we can all agree that with proper parameter maintenance our tanks can thrive. Some of the ways people achieve this is by dosing, water changes, skimming, media reactors, UV lighting, etc.

Secondly whenever we come upon an issue almost 99% of the time has to do with parameters. While coral structure health can be easily solved by dosing, lighting, proper flow etc. Every niche issue generally goes back to nutrients, be it bubble, film, hair algae, cyano, diatoms and even dinos. They are tied into either a nitrate, phosphate or silicate problem. Its key to understand why those issues come about and how to solve them. Often I hear reefers throwing a water change at any problem they face, especially when it comes to nutrients. I have come to the conclusion that water changes can often (not always) create more of a problem than already exists. Say you have A diatom or Dino outbreak, performing water changes adds silicates to the water column and thereby promotes their growth. While water changes may be a "quick fix" to create a cleaner system I believe that they may cause more issues.

So we go to solutions. How can we solve issues like thes. My simple answer is once again tank chemistry. Lets say you have higher nitrates, skip the water change and dose iron. Iron has been proven to accelerate the growth of corals. What happens when corals are growing faster than normal? They consume more nutrients... Faster. So now your nitrate issue is out the door. Have phosphate issues? Dose carbon or other credible phosphate removers. Parameters in check, no water changes

While Bob from Montana might have a lot about reefing right, this method of parameter management has been incredibly effective. I don't recommend this way for everyone... its difficult but incredibly rewarding as life tends to teach us.

I would appreciate your thoughts.

Nigel

I have a ea1200 pro and have always only ever changed 20L a week, i have a mix of corals and fish but I do run and clean regularly is my filter socks, skimmer and fuge mud & Chaeto. Using Red Sea blue bucket and only ever dose extra Mg to keep all stable. Just did a house move and transported every Litre with the move, never lost a single fish or coral

 

[damsels are not mean]

Water changes are good because they work 100% of the time. You don't have to test anything or try to troubleshoot what imbalance is in your chemistry. You don't have to go to the forums to ask what magic bottle you need to solve your problems. You change out the bad water for good water. Instant chemistry fix. If the tank looks bad, you change a lot quickly. There are certainly methods that produce nice tanks with dosing stuff and never doing water changes but they require a lot of testing and many things that cannot be tested for at home.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

But...I will say that I have never had these colors when I was doing WCs and my growth rate jumped 3x (yes, 3x) within 5 months by judging my ALk and Ca intake (dosing amount) and the demand is still rising. In fact, my Alk and Ca are a constant battle to keep them up. Also another plus is no more expensive frags dying (saving me even more money).

IMO, one should be careful of judging water changes by comparing dosing of lots of trace elements to dosing of few or no trace elements plus water changes.

Those are two extremes, but there is plenty of middle ground that allows both and many people do both.

 

[JMetaxas]

Even though I do a Triton ICP test every 3 months, I still do water changes in my 260 gallon system. Not everything is measured perfectly via ICP. I trust the results, to a point.

 

[Mbritt]

I think its possible to run a tank without. However i still do a 10% each week to put back trace elements and things that the corals have depleted. Yes i dose but keep it to the basics. I dont do SPS sIo that is a factor here im sure. I actually find it cheaper and easier than all the dosing. Keep it simple

 

[NDIrish]

I believe it won't go completely away, but will go way down. I use Moonshiners method. Only time I add water is when I take water out for frag tank, and its very little.

 

[TanksJB]

I use moonshiner method and calculator for dosing.

I send water samples to ATI lab for what to dose. I am doing this less frequently now that I know my consumption rate (about every 3 or 4 months). I only test for phosphates occasionally with Hanna checker. It is easy and accurate and lines up with ATI results. I quit testing for nitrates because I can't find a test I can read accurately and rely on ATI. They don't move around as much as phosphate for me and stay within the Redfield ratio when they do. For me, the phosphates are what I have to watch for even though I grow and harvest algae in the sump; and I don't feed a lot. I daily dose Phosphate Rx Blue Life that I get at BRS to keep down below .10 which is better and easier for me that running bags of gfo as well as easier to control imo.

 

[Jbell370]

Great article. I think times change and it gives reefers the opportunity to change or experiement to find better ways or simpler ways or even just different

I have a new upgraded tank since Oct. No water changes to date. Even had a manifold put in to use for water changes. All is stable. I dose, including the trace following Red Sea's recipe except not doing it every day yet. I will look into dosing more iron for the nitrates which just started to climb. I was at low nutrients for a long time and had to dose po4. Now that is stable, no3 around 10-20. Do have algae coming so there are excess nutrients to deal with which I am with fuge, nopox and an algae scrubber.

I use as needed chemi pure blue or elite, carbon, phosguard and purigen. I also dose mb7 to get more bacteria. It's taken me 3 months to get my alk/ca/mg stable or pretty stable so I don't want to do big water changes that will mess with that. I do plan to hook up an awc with the neptune dos I have, but will do very small changes to keep things stable. Undecided when to start or how much to do on a 220g system. Had planned on 3 gal a day but that might be too much if I want to keep stable. the manifold will be for bigger changes if I have to treat the tank like with chemiclean or such, but this time around, really working on stability

I have a 240g with another 60g in sump and also use DOS for AWC, I do 5g per day.

 

[schooncw]

I view water changes much like an oil change on a car: the simplest, least expensive and most effective maintenance method there is.
I see no harm and only good, from an activity which is easy and relatively inexpensive.

 

[jda]

Few things... first, ICP is not even close to comprehensive so please don't have a false sense of anything if getting one. Second, many have had nice tanks for months and maybe even two years with no water changes, but the ones who have had long term success work very hard and spend lots of money to not change water - don't expect a few months to be the same as a few years.

 

[Duncan62]

I use Kent marine essential elements for trace

I've had good results with API. Kent as well. I also dose a drop or two of iodide that really helps polyp extension and color. I've got a fluval product. Read the ingredients. Most have calcium. An occasional test will help. No water changes since 81. Lol. I moved a tank water and all across town last summer and replaced about 5 gallons lost in the move but that doesn't count.

 

[JCTReefer]

Say you have A diatom or Dino outbreak, performing water changes adds silicates to the water column and thereby promotes their growth.

Ironically some people dose silicates to encourage a diatom bloom to out compete dinos. Particularly Large cell Amphidinium.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Ironically some people dose silicates to encourage a diatom bloom to out compete dinos. Particularly Large cell Amphidinium.

I dosed silicate to encourage sponges and other organisms that need it.

 

[Key Largo]

I agree with Randy that both WC and supplements have their place. Yes, there is more than one way to succesfully keep a reef tank. I have always preached the mantra that 'dilution is the solution"', although not for everything. Personally, my tank didnt start thriving until I got myself on a regular water change schedule that works for me and my tank. In my case 20% every three weeks. Not to cast aspersions here, but some refers I know eschew water changes because they feel they are a hassle, and then look for an easier way out. I personally see very little if any downsides to regular water changes. Including cost to benefit ratio IMO.

 

[Nigel35]

Take a wild reef..... let's say in the Great Barrier Reef

Let's build huge concrete Jetties where no fresh SW can come and go with the tide.


Plz report back how the wild reef is doing in the same water conditions in the coming months....

.

Thats why you need to dose and compensate...

 

[Nigel35]

I dosed silicate to encourage sponges and other organisms that need it.

How do you get around Dino and diatom invasions?

 

[Nigel35]

You make it sound like dosing iron is a magic potion to coral growth and thus the coral will eat up all our nitrate. I dont believe this is the case and is a bit misleading.

Lets take a look closer look. Iron stimulates coral growth. It is magic my friend. It's a utilitarian tool: slowly lower nutrients and fuel some growth.

On the flip side it can be dangerous. If you don't have enough nutrients in your tank while dosing certain volumes of iron you could bleach your tank. Not the method for the average Joe...