So my tank has been cycling for about 3 weeks now. I started with caribsea liferock and live sand. I started the cycle with Dr. Tim's one and only and ammonia. Last Friday both ammonia and nitrite were at 0 or close to it, so I added more ammonia expecting it to reduce to zero on Saturday. However, that wasn't the case, on Saturday there was still 2ppm of ammonia which is how much I added. Sunday and Monday (yesterday), ammonia levels were 1.2 and .4ppm, so looks like I have a decent amount of bacteria consuming ammonia, however, my nitrite levels were 1 on Sunday and greatly increased to 5 or more yesterday. I purchased a bottle of fritz turbostart to try and help my cycle, so my question is would it be safe to add it today? I predict ammonia would be even lower, however, no clue if nitrite will increase or decrease. I am not going to add more ammonia until nitrites are almost 0, so will the bacteria from turbostart die without a food source?
Cycle Advice. 3 Weeks in can I add fritz turbostart?
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Thanks! Just wondering what chemicals are you referring too? For ammonia, I only added 2ppm 2 times during the whole cycle to start it and see if it was done. As for macroalgae, I have a nano 20 gallon with no sump or refugium, so not sure where I would add it.
SALTYMOPAR
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my .02
Add the turbostart turn up the tank temp to 85-87. bacteria populate faster in warmer temperature wait for your nitrites to come down then dose it again to 2ppm of ammonia see how fast your ammonia drops it should be 24 hours the nitrites may take longer. the bacteria that consumes nitrites takes longer to establish than the ammonia bacteria. wait for your nitrites to drop to zero then test your nitrates. should be able to add fish at this point. You could do one more test run dose it to 2ppm of ammonia then test once the nitrites are zero do a 5 gallon water change because you will have some nitrates after dosing the tank multiple times. after the water change add some fish. Don't worry about a water change losing bacteria, the bacteria lives on the rock and sand not the water.
Add the turbostart turn up the tank temp to 85-87. bacteria populate faster in warmer temperature wait for your nitrites to come down then dose it again to 2ppm of ammonia see how fast your ammonia drops it should be 24 hours the nitrites may take longer. the bacteria that consumes nitrites takes longer to establish than the ammonia bacteria. wait for your nitrites to drop to zero then test your nitrates. should be able to add fish at this point. You could do one more test run dose it to 2ppm of ammonia then test once the nitrites are zero do a 5 gallon water change because you will have some nitrates after dosing the tank multiple times. after the water change add some fish. Don't worry about a water change losing bacteria, the bacteria lives on the rock and sand not the water.
Thanks, this is what I was going to do. Only thing is my heater is weird, I have an Eheim jager 100W and I have it set at 77 but it runs at around 78-79. I can't calibrate it anymore as the red won't move any more to the right. I'll probably turn it up to like 85.
we determined in another thread you are already cycled and need no more additives, is that right
I can't recall if we did but your post seemed familiar (there are many stalled cycle threads daily, no reef cycle has ever stalled requiring more purchases)
we would have discussed false ammonia reads too, if that did occur. seneye would have been mentioned as your only trustworthy source of ammonia readings, while the others steer you completely opposite of the truth.
check out online cycling charts in comparison; on week 3 on all charts, ammonia is under control and nitrite doesnt need to be factored at all. You haven't arranged a reef tank that broke those rules, only a non seneye tester says so. Its easy to prove this tank is cycled.
change out your wastewater, and add animals and they live, because its cycled. Consider how they start reef conventions...400 reefs all starting on the same date. Would yours have to pack up and go home, while they get to stay?
depends on what you use to call a cycle ready. There's a way to test it with ammonia too, but not how it was tested above that wont work for the non seneye groups.
I can't recall if we did but your post seemed familiar (there are many stalled cycle threads daily, no reef cycle has ever stalled requiring more purchases)
we would have discussed false ammonia reads too, if that did occur. seneye would have been mentioned as your only trustworthy source of ammonia readings, while the others steer you completely opposite of the truth.
check out online cycling charts in comparison; on week 3 on all charts, ammonia is under control and nitrite doesnt need to be factored at all. You haven't arranged a reef tank that broke those rules, only a non seneye tester says so. Its easy to prove this tank is cycled.
change out your wastewater, and add animals and they live, because its cycled. Consider how they start reef conventions...400 reefs all starting on the same date. Would yours have to pack up and go home, while they get to stay?
depends on what you use to call a cycle ready. There's a way to test it with ammonia too, but not how it was tested above that wont work for the non seneye groups.
I have never observed once a cycle that was not ready in three weeks after adding these common boosters used (wet sand is a common one, rarely mentioned, an instant inoculant)
it always comes down to what brand of ammonia tester we're using. its two different languages totally between seneye and not seneye. You can't find one single stalled cycle on a seneye tank for a reason, cycles never stall in this hobby. the only testers that indicate stalled cycles are non seneye; red flag for data pattern watchers.
My personal goal is to convince you not to buy bottle bac, we input life after a big water change, it lives since you are cycled (and your tester never agrees lol thats the point) and we link this to huge threads where we saved people from having to buy more bac over a false reefing premise.
There's a youtube video that says cycles stall and it lists ways to unstall the cycle, and products to buy that can help it. id like to show how that is totally false and we have been showing that in our stalled cycle study threads.
only forum cycles stall
irl/reef convention cycles where money changes hands never, ever, ever stall. patterns.
it always comes down to what brand of ammonia tester we're using. its two different languages totally between seneye and not seneye. You can't find one single stalled cycle on a seneye tank for a reason, cycles never stall in this hobby. the only testers that indicate stalled cycles are non seneye; red flag for data pattern watchers.
My personal goal is to convince you not to buy bottle bac, we input life after a big water change, it lives since you are cycled (and your tester never agrees lol thats the point) and we link this to huge threads where we saved people from having to buy more bac over a false reefing premise.
There's a youtube video that says cycles stall and it lists ways to unstall the cycle, and products to buy that can help it. id like to show how that is totally false and we have been showing that in our stalled cycle study threads.
only forum cycles stall
irl/reef convention cycles where money changes hands never, ever, ever stall. patterns.
matter of fact we could have real fun
want to consider something called an insured start
thats where I agree to pay for your initial dead bioload via paypal if it dies lol
we can reassess your cycle here but im 99% ready to commit. reason why: want data for stalled cycle threads and Im on a roll not having to pay anything out. this crazy method was the only way I could convince non seneye users can go/can reef/ can start.
assessment:
post pics of your setup
liferock activates in under 12 days to full activity. wet sand....bottle bac might be the triple redundancy Ill need to commit.
want to consider something called an insured start
thats where I agree to pay for your initial dead bioload via paypal if it dies lol
we can reassess your cycle here but im 99% ready to commit. reason why: want data for stalled cycle threads and Im on a roll not having to pay anything out. this crazy method was the only way I could convince non seneye users can go/can reef/ can start.
assessment:
post pics of your setup
liferock activates in under 12 days to full activity. wet sand....bottle bac might be the triple redundancy Ill need to commit.
Sorry, just read everything you said. If what you say is true, being seneye is the only accurate source of ammonia readings, then how come there aren't more articles about it? Honestly just curious, since this is my first tank, I did research and honestly haven't read anything that you have mentioned. So your saying that articles and resources mentioning stalled tanks are just to encourage people to buy more product?
Also I have been told from time to time that cycling can take up to a month or even two. Also, almost everywhere I look and people I ask still say to be sure your cycle is done, your tank should be able to reduce 2ppm of ammonia in a day, and nitrites and nitrates should be below an acceptable level. I understand if ammonia readings would be wrong, but how about nitrite and nitrate? After adding ammonia both my levels skyrocketed and would definitely kill fish
its very new science indeed, thats why I have to result to paypaling my way to new data. sorry to flood you with crazy data, but this thread sums up my take
not one poster in the entire chemistry forum, a place where snake oil salesmen are digested, speaks out against stalled cycles because they know how powerful seneye really is compared to all the rest.
www.reef2reef.com
I think there are not very many chemical claims people could make in that forum that were wrong and get away with it. In that thread, I seek out claimed stalled cycle threads and get them to start, then log the results. threads like this from me tend to run in the 5-10 year range, not fly-by-night work examples. we are hungry for true patterns and just getting started there.
not one poster in the entire chemistry forum, a place where snake oil salesmen are digested, speaks out against stalled cycles because they know how powerful seneye really is compared to all the rest.
We should use the collective power of the chem forum to prove or deny the possibility of sustained .25 ammonia in reefing
Why does it matter if reef tanks can have stuck cycles? Because when you move homes you don't want to lose animals, cycling science needs precision and predictability in order to protect our tanks. perhaps an emergency setup is needed, no wait time permitted or If you are invited to show...
www.reef2reef.com
I think there are not very many chemical claims people could make in that forum that were wrong and get away with it. In that thread, I seek out claimed stalled cycle threads and get them to start, then log the results. threads like this from me tend to run in the 5-10 year range, not fly-by-night work examples. we are hungry for true patterns and just getting started there.
Payne Train
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Brandon helped me out with my cycle just a few weeks ago - A lot of help and useful advice.
I also used turbo start and Tim’s one and only ammonium chloride.
www.reef2reef.com
I also used turbo start and Tim’s one and only ammonium chloride.
Cycling new tank - could use a little input
I am cycling my new SR 80 gal mixed reef tank I am using RODI water my my new unit from Melevs reef. For rock, I am using Caribsea life rock . For sand I went with 1/2 pink Fiji and 1/2 Grade A mixed throughout the tank . I am also using Marinepure 1 1/2 media spheres, and I used a 4 oz...
www.reef2reef.com
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ok if you add a typical clown non fancy (Payne Train thank u lol) and it keels over in a cloudy smelly not ready to start doom water Ill paypal you for it. buy a couple zo frags too, normal ones, not the five hundred dollar ones, and add them too lol. nice one, I feel that tank is cycled and can't not be cycled.
I dont do this so that I can spend my hamburger meat money on other people's cycles, Im trying to show whats trustworthy in this hobby and what is for sale. ok go.
I dont do this so that I can spend my hamburger meat money on other people's cycles, Im trying to show whats trustworthy in this hobby and what is for sale. ok go.
Payne Train
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Lol Peaches is still doing really well . Up to 2 clowns, a lawnmower blenny, finger leather, fat head dendro and three things of Duncan’s.
I started my tank on April 15th and with Brandon’s advice, all turned out really well.
good luck ! Here some pics of my tank. Sorry about the blue lights, they are a paint to turn off and on for pics
I started my tank on April 15th and with Brandon’s advice, all turned out really well.
good luck ! Here some pics of my tank. Sorry about the blue lights, they are a paint to turn off and on for pics
I cannot explain what's up with testers we got by forty years on em before seneye arrived
And, at any moment someone can chime in with hard zero numbers on any given non seneye test to prove they work: admitted
But that doesn't change our direction, something isn't passing the smell test lol no pun intended with these stalled cycle threads; so once seneye did arrive on scene and showed no, none, zero outliers to cycle completion that made me question all stalled cycles ever posted
When working calibrated seneye shows something above .00x thousandths ppm then will have to change course/ interpretation of how surface area works in reefing
in all these studies Im also trying to rectify how conventions never fail to start OK with all the different fw and sw systems they employ compared to our starts on forums which are pretty much never permitted to start on a given date ahead of time, before the build begins. They have to be variable per forum rules...
And, at any moment someone can chime in with hard zero numbers on any given non seneye test to prove they work: admitted
But that doesn't change our direction, something isn't passing the smell test lol no pun intended with these stalled cycle threads; so once seneye did arrive on scene and showed no, none, zero outliers to cycle completion that made me question all stalled cycles ever posted
When working calibrated seneye shows something above .00x thousandths ppm then will have to change course/ interpretation of how surface area works in reefing
in all these studies Im also trying to rectify how conventions never fail to start OK with all the different fw and sw systems they employ compared to our starts on forums which are pretty much never permitted to start on a given date ahead of time, before the build begins. They have to be variable per forum rules...
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For this tank I'd want a near total water change before starting, that's consistent with our approach... clean nice water vs the cycling dosed water
Claimed bacteria are stuck to surfaces, immune to any degree of full water changes
Claimed bacteria are stuck to surfaces, immune to any degree of full water changes
Just a few questions about your arguments. Like I mentioned, I have not seen anything about Red Sea tests being inaccurate. Someone at the end of your thread mentioned that rinsing test bottles with tap water, which I have been doing for the last 3 weeks as I don't have rodi water just sitting around, which might cause some inaccuracy. However, my nitrite levels were at really high levels, around 5 and nitrates at around 50. I see that you mention nitrite does not really matter, but then what about nitrate? Also, I just don't see enough people saying similar things to what you are. I understand that without people testing what you are saying, that change in ways won't happen, but as a beginner it just seems logical to go with the traditional way that most people say is the way to go. As for seneye, I also am confused on why it has so many bad reviews on BRS
All those are extra to the fact we start reefs in that thread right when the hesitation is highest. That's why I deal in actual work examples, anyone can weave a tale into anything on the web pro or con; but you'll find lots of claims arent really backed by anything. with paypal and that amount of work, we've got some backing 
I dont bother checking into the dynamics of the test kits, we just know cycles cant stall and when they do Ill be paying up. a stalled cycle kills animals, and a completed cycle keeps them alive.
if anyone feels that uncycled reefs aren't immediate killers, set up a dry sand dry rock 5 gallon tank and add ten snails mixed, dead overnite for proof.
add ten snails in a cycled 5 gallon tank/live. easy no test cycle confirmation on how active surface area really works.
Regarding online evals, they mean nothing to me since they dont have any tie-in to our cycling discussion. Even if 100 people dont like seneye, that has no bearing on the work we are doing and the $$ that is on the line with each start we made. they dont like its technicality; that has no bearing on the fact we know all reefs convert ammonia at the thousandths level ppm after three weeks underwater, with those rocks and sand and boosters already in place (x3).
There likely is some answer regarding test kit use/prep/ability
and even if that's wrangled into shape, your tank is still cycled. Non seneye testing is a mile deep rabbit hole, not for me. Im a results guy and can call them off a single tank pic with submersion history known.
Not one reef tank with rocks, sand, and boosters has ever stalled. Not once. That statement comes from the limited amount of seneye data we have to work with; if that's false data then I expect some dead animals from a premature start soon.
I dont bother checking into the dynamics of the test kits, we just know cycles cant stall and when they do Ill be paying up. a stalled cycle kills animals, and a completed cycle keeps them alive.
if anyone feels that uncycled reefs aren't immediate killers, set up a dry sand dry rock 5 gallon tank and add ten snails mixed, dead overnite for proof.
add ten snails in a cycled 5 gallon tank/live. easy no test cycle confirmation on how active surface area really works.
Regarding online evals, they mean nothing to me since they dont have any tie-in to our cycling discussion. Even if 100 people dont like seneye, that has no bearing on the work we are doing and the $$ that is on the line with each start we made. they dont like its technicality; that has no bearing on the fact we know all reefs convert ammonia at the thousandths level ppm after three weeks underwater, with those rocks and sand and boosters already in place (x3).
There likely is some answer regarding test kit use/prep/ability
and even if that's wrangled into shape, your tank is still cycled. Non seneye testing is a mile deep rabbit hole, not for me. Im a results guy and can call them off a single tank pic with submersion history known.
Not one reef tank with rocks, sand, and boosters has ever stalled. Not once. That statement comes from the limited amount of seneye data we have to work with; if that's false data then I expect some dead animals from a premature start soon.
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