Cycling 365gallons?

[speedjester]

I’ve been trying to cycle my marine pond (dry sand and rock. ) for the last 5days. I started with 2 gallons of Fritz9 and added a 1/2lb of shrimp(Amazon lost my Ammonia). I’m going on day 5. No ammonia detected. No nitrite. Ph is 8.5. I understand it’s only been 5 days but shouldn’t I see some ammonia by now. Am I using enough shrimp? I have live rock but I don’t like transferring anything from one aquarium to another. I normally cycle my tanks with Fish and never had an issue. But this is for a trio of sharks and there propensity to react poorly to any parameter change makes me hesitant.

Any recommendations and opinions would be appreciated. Thank you

 

[fishguy242]

any detectable nitrate ?

 

[Propane]

Sometimes the shrimp method can be random.

 

[speedjester]

any detectable nitrate ?

I didn’t check Nitrates. Since I didn’t see any Nitrites. But just did. 0 nitrates.

Sometimes the shrimp method can be random.

On top of the Shrimp I’ve been ghost feeding Rods frozen and threw in 5 cubes of mysis yesterday. When I upgraded my indoor dt 300gallons. I transferred my live rock and and about 100 gallons of water. Threw the fish in and never looked back. My first time fishless. Not sure if I put enough shrimp to start cycle. I doubled the Dosage of bacteria ( 640 gallons).

Also wondering if maybe the bacteria is consuming the ammonia quickly and not letting it spike and just hasn’t produced enough nitrite to be detected..

Thoughts?

 

[fishguy242]

No exp cycling dry rock sorry, but are looking for nitrates.
ammo - nitrite to nitrate
IME with large volumes have always used live rock, but have gone as far as dumping skimmate, earthworms ,shrimp
to "instacycle" and get nitrates up.

 

[Propane]

It’s a waiting game at this point. If anything was happening you would have nitrates. Just gotta wait. Too bad your ammonia didn’t come.

 

[speedjester]

No exp cycling dry rock sorry, but are looking for nitrates.
ammo - nitrite to nitrate
IME with large volumes have always used live rock, but have gone as far as dumping skimmate, earthworms ,shrimp
to "instacycle" and get nitrates up.

I’m considering moving over some live rock or my sump sponge. From my main DT. The sharks are in my main DT now. So if by chance there is anything lurking in my main DT they have already been exposed to it. Weighing my options.

It’s a waiting game at this point. If anything was happening you would have nitrates. Just gotta wait. Too bad your ammonia didn’t come.

Got notified this AM tha Ammonia is due to arrive today. Would it be OK to dose ammonia 5 days in?

 

[Propane]

You could add it still but I would take the shrimp out so it doesn’t continue to be random.

 

[brandon429]

This is where you stand

It's done by contact time

This isn't a rise to 2ppm and fall it's too much dilution and shrimp decay doesn't rise under control. Dr Reefs thread tracked this bacteria to 2 day implantation time, you're done if rocks were in the pond

Remove bulk dead shrimp, cycle no more, your surface area is coated and non digital test kits can't help you they can only cause you doubt

Bacteria in a bottle, Myth or Fact

Call me old school, back in the day we placed a deli shrimp in a tank to kick start the cycle. When tank reached 1.5-2 ppm ammonia we pulled it out and waited sometimes weeks to months for bacteria to colonize and drop ammonia and nitrites down to 0 to make tank safe for livestock. With recent...

www.reef2reef.com

Bottle bac study, you are beyond fritz charted time

 

[brandon429]

I would input two pinches of ground up fish food=high surface area carbon and don't look back, everything will be fed well

Remove the dead shrimp if you can. If not, it's ok that's large dilution

Rotting shrimp is low surface area slow carbon. Powder food is perfect here to lock and go/ proceed

you don't have to register on a test kit the rise and fall of any parameter to be cycled. the entire point of updated cycling science is replacing non digital test kits in cycling, because in one thread they're misreading

and in another thread they're the sole decision basis on when to take action in a tank, we had to replace them

reefers project their own trust onto the kits, but they ranged too wildly for any use. that thread above is contact time counting, number of days underwater

*notice a cycling chart's axis is the same, one is a timed wait the other axis is the approximate resulting parameter. a cycling chart is more accurate for ammonia control than a non digital test kit

ammonia drops / has basic control if feed and inoculation is in place/ by day ten and that's not even using massive boosting like you did with fritz

***known wait time supersedes what any non digtal test kit says, rule of updated cycling science. those bacteria were well fed during this lead up.

now you get to begin filtration planning, all the heavy food those fish command needs throughput right into a filter, not stored in a bottom sandbed like we do in reef tanks. recommend barebottom, or if sandbed maintained, cleaned with much effort every month/lots of work will be required. trying to make a 300+ gallon tank de-eutrophic is a pain, don't play catchup play ahead of the curve is my advise. a benefit of updated cycling science is knowing a terminable date for the cycle so that we can move onto fish disease and other planning preps for the tank. you used the fastest bacteria in reefing, two gallons of it.

the way a digital ammonia meter would help you (seneye) isnt by showing a rise and fall in ammonia. it would help by showing no rise in ammonia when you add bioload, because the cycle is already done. if it wasnt cycled the ammonia would spike and not go down, on a seneye. if it spiked and never went down on an api, that would mean absolutely nothing. I have threads of that happening in months old and stocked reef tanks, with no addition of ammonia to cause the rise (misreads)

you dont actually need a digital ammonia meter, the point of updated cycling science is to make those unneeded

but if you buy one they're handy to proof statements made about timing that's for sure.

 

[speedjester]

I would input two pinches of ground up fish food=high surface area carbon and don't look back, everything will be fed well

Remove the dead shrimp if you can. If not, it's ok that's large dilution

Rotting shrimp is low surface area slow carbon. Powder food is perfect here to lock and go/ proceed

you don't have to register on a test kit the rise and fall of any parameter to be cycled. the entire point of updated cycling science is replacing non digital test kits in cycling, because in one thread they're misreading

and in another thread they're the sole decision basis on when to take action in a tank, we had to replace them

reefers project their own trust onto the kits, but they ranged too wildly for any use. that thread above is contact time counting, number of days underwater

*notice a cycling chart's axis is the same, one is a timed wait the other axis is the approximate resulting parameter. a cycling chart is more accurate for ammonia control than a non digital test kit

ammonia drops / has basic control if feed and inoculation is in place/ by day ten and that's not even using massive boosting like you did with fritz

***known wait time supersedes what any non digtal test kit says, rule of updated cycling science. those bacteria were well fed during this lead up.

now you get to begin filtration planning, all the heavy food those fish command needs throughput right into a filter, not stored in a bottom sandbed like we do in reef tanks. recommend barebottom, or if sandbed maintained, cleaned with much effort every month/lots of work will be required. trying to make a 300+ gallon tank de-eutrophic is a pain, don't play catchup play ahead of the curve is my advise. a benefit of updated cycling science is knowing a terminable date for the cycle so that we can move onto fish disease and other planning preps for the tank. you used the fastest bacteria in reefing, two gallons of it.

the way a digital ammonia meter would help you (seneye) isnt by showing a rise and fall in ammonia. it would help by showing no rise in ammonia when you add bioload, because the cycle is already done. if it wasnt cycled the ammonia would spike and not go down, on a seneye. if it spiked and never went down on an api, that would mean absolutely nothing. I have threads of that happening in months old and stocked reef tanks, with no addition of ammonia to cause the rise (misreads)

you dont actually need a digital ammonia meter, the point of updated cycling science is to make those unneeded

but if you buy one they're handy to proof statements made about timing that's for sure.

Well received the ammonia. Added the entire bottle for 300 gallons. Checked an hr later only showing around .50. Checked Nitrates I’m at what looks like 60ppm. But here’s what’s strange showing 0 nitrites. I haven’t seen a nitrite spike unless I missed it. I didn’t test for nitrites the first 2 days

 

[Propane]

It’s prolly coming.

 

[brandon429]

The feed already given is a sure lock in of fritz on the rocks per dr reefs thread. what the test kits read doesn’t matter, this isn’t a common cycle it’s massive dilution using the fastest bacteria available. I would cease adding algae fuel to the tank but this current dose of ammonia isn’t bad at all, that’s pure food, add the carbon and you can cease cycling 100% sure, the tests won’t factor.

it’s an already charter implantation time linked above

 

[brandon429]

That bacteria was costly

it confers this speed

it could have carried all your fish on day one, like a tanked episode

 

[speedjester]

It’s prolly coming.

I was under the belief you couldn’t get nitrate without first nitrite?

 

[speedjester]

That bacteria was costly

it confers this speed

it could have carried all your fish on day one, like a tanked episode

What don’t understand is why I added the entire bottle and only reached .50ppm. I would have thought closer to 2ppm. And my seachem badges are not reacting. Maybe a little towards alert. Also the ammonia had no smell which I find strange.

 

[brandon429]

If you owned seneye the reading would be worlds different

Expect some of it immediately fixed by dilution and mass bacteria

*dr reef has a seneye tracked, accurately ran version of the same bottle bac thread above. your cycle is following what that one shows, if you were using seneye


any non digital kit is known to be an estimate, and subject to hundreds of known and searchable misread threads

they aren’t necessarily correct, the non digital test kits.

try and find seneye + fritz bottle bac experiments that don’t show control by day three, = none

your ammonia may or may not have registered accurately on the non digital test kit, but it’s a known effective degree of feed for two gallons of fritz quality bacteria

 

[Propane]

What don’t understand is why I added the entire bottle and only reached .50ppm. I would have thought closer to 2ppm. And my seachem badges are not reacting. Maybe a little towards alert. Also the ammonia had no smell which I find strange.

What don’t understand is why I added the entire bottle and only reached .50ppm. I would have thought closer to 2ppm. And my seachem badges are not reacting. Maybe a little towards alert. Also the ammonia had no smell which I find strange.

It’s coming or the amount of bac you already added took care of it.

 

[Propane]

Things are happening you just gotta let it balance at this point.

 

[speedjester]

Well I received another shipment of Ammonia. I dosed the pond to 1.5ppm. This morning I’m down to .05( seachem badge) salifart test shows between .50-1ppm. Nitrites are through the roof. Nitrates are 50ppm.

Anyone know if the salifert test shows all ammonia or just free ammonia? I removed all the shrimp today also.

Thoughts? Is the pond cycled? Was hoping to transfer the sharks this weekend.