Diagnosis Help Needed

[kodo28]

Hello,

Need some help,

2 months ago, I had what a thought to be an ich outbreak on the main display.
I went then with hyposalinity treatment 11ppt but after a month the fishes were still showing ich outbreaks so I decided to go for a quarantine tank.
The quarantine tank have been set up with a Seachem Tidal 110 filter with siporax, Ammonia alerte, a small Tunze nanostream pump 6025 and a small Tunze 9004 skimmer.

Following fishes are inside:
-Zebrasoma flavescens
-Zebrasoma veliferum
-Zebrasoma xanthurum
-Acanthurus pyroferus
-Acanthurus tennenti
-Paracanthurus hepatus

Since, 1 week I started to dose Cupranine with the recommended dosage within the 48h. Small adjustment have been done to match the 0.5mg/l. I've been testing each day and the copper level is steady since then.

All fishes are ok and eating very well.

Today blue tang is still showing some kind of white spots and no other fish is showing any sign of disease.

I am questioning myself if this is ich or not ?

Sorry for the bad pics

 

[Big G]

Looks like the tang is starting to develop a bacterial infection or maybe even Brook. Yet there are Ich like spots on its face/nose.
@Humblefish
@4FordFamily

 

[melypr1985]

The problem with Hippo tangs is that they can have a skin reaction to the copper. Unfortunately these pictures make it very difficult to tell if this is a simple skin reaction or a bacterial infection. I would suggest trying for some more pictures that are more in focus.

 

[4FordFamily]

The problem with Hippo tangs is that they can have a skin reaction to the copper. Unfortunately these pictures make it very difficult to tell if this is a simple skin reaction or a bacterial infection. I would suggest trying for some more pictures that are more in focus.

Agreed but this looks like infected insertion spots to me based on the size and the way they’ve “spread out”

 

[kodo28]

I will try to make better focus pics.

Fishes are since 2 months under treatment. First month under hypo at 11ppt.
But all were still showing outbreaks after a month so I decided to go with copper.
I started on 1st April to dose the recommended 48h dosage but the seachem multitest kit that I had was like expired so I needed to wait for new kit.
During that time, blue tang was still with spots some days better & others worst.
New kit finally came last week and after testing, copper was at 0.3mg/l so I dosed to match the recommended 0.5mg/l since then I check everyday.
All others fishes show no sign of disease and all are eating very well and not stressed at all. Only the blue tang is showing those kind of spots and scratching sometimes on the bottom.

 

[kodo28]

So it seems to be some kind of infection, because this morning I checked the fish to take better pictures and there was no spots anymore on fish.
I gave him a bath of 5mn yesterday with paraguard maybe it helped a little.

 

[EmptyWallet]

Or the copper finally 'kicked the ich', glad to hear his on the mend

 

[kodo28]

Or the copper finally 'kicked the ich', glad to hear his on the mend

Yeah maybe ;Cyclops
The thing is that the spots are going and coming back since the start of cupramine. Which makes me think that the parasite is still infecting.
Strange is the others fishes are not showing any sign of spots or scratching at all since I started to dose.
I made 10% water change today and adjusted again the copper to match the recommended strength. I gave him a bath of 5mn again with paraguard.
Wait&See if he gets infected again. ;Yawn

 

[EmptyWallet]

Good to see a giant QT. Have you thought about some PVC elbows for hiding spots. The ability to hide reduces their stress levels significantly, which of course helps their immune system and increases appetite etc. The new spots might just be the last of the ICH that grabbed on just before you hit 0.5 cupramine. If still getting new spots after 10 days it ain't ICH. With my Moorish Idol I thought it was ICH but after 10 days realized it's Lympho.

 

[EmptyWallet]

I also found my Salifert kit was hard to guage if I had .4 .5 or .6. Got a Hanna checker copper HR and the doubt is ancient history!

 

[kodo28]

Good to see a giant QT. Have you thought about some PVC elbows for hiding spots. The ability to hide reduces their stress levels significantly, which of course helps their immune system and increases appetite etc. The new spots might just be the last of the ICH that grabbed on just before you hit 0.5 cupramine. If still getting new spots after 10 days it ain't ICH. With my Moorish Idol I thought it was ICH but after 10 days realized it's Lympho.

Yeah I didn't want to go small on QT tank to reduce possible stress due small QT.
I have some pvc pipes but they are not in the video due that I was cleaning the tank bottom at the moment of the video .

when I was waiting for the new Seachem kit. I tested with JBL copper kit but I didn't wanted to go more then the 0.3 as I wasn't sure about the JBL test kit with cupramine.

The JBL goes from 0.3 / 0.45 / 0.6. When the Seachem arrived, I compared both tests and they were pretty giving me the same 0.3.
I dosed to match the 0.5 and tested again on both and JBL was giving a color between 0.45 and 0.6

 

[EmptyWallet]

Ok average of 2 kits should be fine and .6 isn't too harsh. Apparently .3 is enough for ich, they just say .5 to account for test kit error.

I have a 400 litre / 100 gallon QT which was great until I had to dose antibiotics, started getting expensive with that much water! but I can put a few fish through 6 to 8 weeks without needing a water change

 

[kodo28]

Small update, today no sign of white spots on blue tang but he is still scratching.
Tomorrow will be the 7th day of treatment.

 

[EmptyWallet]

Hopefully it's nearly over, they say it can take as long as 10 days

 

[kodo28]

Yeah hopefully
I tested again today the copper and it seems to be ok

 

[EmptyWallet]

I hate those blue colour tests! result changes based on how bright your background light is. Can' wait for my Phosphate Hanna to come in!

Humble fish does say 3 to 7 days for it to fall off typically and others have said upto 10. Apparently the white spot is actually the exit wound not the parasite itself so don't worry if you see new white spots, that would be a good sign that the last of it had dropped off. I don't know if scratching can be a sign of anything else, maybe just skin irritation after ich, like how our sores get itchy as they heal ???