Did I mess up? Using Walmart Ammonia in trash can cycle. (totally a newbie)

[clhardy5]

I want to replace the rock in my tank with dry dead rock so I can create the aquascape that I want (didn't put enough thought about it when I started - Rookie mistake). I will keep one of my live rocks that my anemone is attached to....but all other rock is coming out and being replaced with new rock. Keeping sand currently in the tank. (should I change this?)

So, I have cleaned (chiseled out all loose sand), power washed, soaked my rock for a couple of days - and now have started cycling it in a Brute trash can - started 3 days ago. I Googled the process, and found the ammonia/Fritz 900 method....and although now I can't find it, the directions said I could use ammonia from Walmart - Great value brand because it was readily available. So that is what I did.

My process so far....
Put rocks in trash can, and cover with salt water (1.025), a powerhead, and heater. I didn't have access to RO/DI so I bought 10 gallons of distilled water. Brought water un to 80 degrees.
Day 1 - dosed with GV ammonia until I had a reading of 2ppm..... then dumped in the full bottle of Fritz Turbostart 900.
Day 2 - Tested levels..... Ammonia .25ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 10ppm, Ph 8.2
Day 3 - Dosed ammonia up to 2 ppm again.
Day 4 Tested this morning - Ammonia .25 ppm, Nitrite 1ppm, Nitrate 20ppm. Did nothing....started thinking about the GV ammonia.....

My main question is.....Did I mess up by using Great value brand Ammonia....as I read online that it contains surfactants....and could be harmful. If so, is there anyway to salvage this cycle? If I move the rocks out of the water/trash can - into my tank, will it kill my fish?

 

[Bryn]

It is suggested that we stay away from anything other than pure ammonia, never saw a reason given. I'm guessing that the surfactant would make better contact with a surface that the ammonia is cleaning. How it would affect fish or corals, I'm not sure.

I don't think you cycle is dead, not from the numbers. I would let it run for a few days, and bring it back up to 2ppm, and see if it reduces back down. Not so much interested in the value, but that there has be a noticeable color change. Then when you want to move the rock from the trash can, soak it in some clean saltwater for a day, and then move it over.

The sand and old rock remaining in your old tank, would have cycled your new rock for you, but cycling it in a separate tub is not a bad idea to allow anything decaying to leach off/out of the rock.

 

[NinjaTiLL]

Read the label on the bottle, if anything other than Ammonia is listed, you shouldn't have used it. Not sure how to reverse course on that because I don't know how to rid the contaminated rock of surfactants. Surfactants will kill.

 

[AZMSGT]

You could try running carbon.. but to be honest. Restarting would be the safest thing.

 

[homer1475]

Pic of label on the bottle?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Cold water should neutralize it, but constant running from hose until you cant smell it anymore

 

[NinjaTiLL]

When in doubt, read the SDS...

https://i5.walmartimages.com/dfw/4ff9c6c9-1cf4/k2-_610488e6-05bb-4792-a3f9-fb86d93621d2.v1.pdf

If this document is authentic, then it does include surfactants. I would start over. Perhaps soak the rock in some citric acid and then time in fresh water (several times over several days). If you see rainbow colored oily residue on still water, you still have surfactants.

 

[Rick.45cal]

Soaps are surfactants!

 

[jtl]

When I used ammonia to start a cycle the only one I could find that would meet the test (100% ammonium hydroxide) was from Ace Hardware.

 

[clhardy5]

Pic of label on the bottle?

 

[clhardy5]

Soaps are surfactants!

I did a little more research online....and although all soaps are surfactants....not all surfactants are soaps. People recommended shaking the bottle, and it if left bubbles...it was bad....and if it didn't, then it was safe. I shook the bottle, and except for air bubbles that popped immediately, there was no foaming. So I'm not thinking the surfactants in this bottle are 'soap'.

 

[clhardy5]

Read the label on the bottle, if anything other than Ammonia is listed, you shouldn't have used it. Not sure how to reverse course on that because I don't know how to rid the contaminated rock of surfactants. Surfactants will kill.

Nothing else is listed on the label....but there's no real ingredient list. I posted pictures in this thread.

 

[UCF Alum]

I did the same thing you did years ago.
I highly recommend that you dump and rinse. Use Dr Tims ammonia to start your cycle.

 

[clhardy5]

Here's the 'shake' test:

 

[clhardy5]

I did the same thing you did years ago.
I highly recommend that you dump and rinse. Use Dr Tims ammonia to start your cycle.

I'm wondering if they've changed their formula? I saw a video from years ago where they shake the GV ammonia and it really suds up......My bottle doesn't do that:

 

[Thaxxx]

Or you could save some $ and just use your own urine. I'm not kidding.

 

[Bryn]

Nothing else is listed on the label....but there's no real ingredient list. I posted pictures in this thread.

Most likely:

Water, 7732-18-5, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Solvent
Ammonium hydroxide, 1336-21-6, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Cleaning Agent
Tetrasodium EDTA, 64-02-8, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Chelating Agent
Sodium C10-16 Alkylbenzenesulfonate, 68081-81-2, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Surfactant
Sodium Xylene Sulphonate, 1300-72-7, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Surfactant

Both surfactants are biodegradable, and are detergents. Granted the half life of one is about a week in an anaerobic environment. The LD50's of both surfactants for Fish are in the 200 and 400mg/L range.

The dilution of the Ammonia used to the amount of water applied to would be about 0.000066

 

[clhardy5]

Most likely:

Water, 7732-18-5, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Solvent
Ammonium hydroxide, 1336-21-6, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Cleaning Agent
Tetrasodium EDTA, 64-02-8, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Chelating Agent
Sodium C10-16 Alkylbenzenesulfonate, 68081-81-2, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Surfactant
Sodium Xylene Sulphonate, 1300-72-7, Intentionally added non-fragrance, Surfactant

Both surfactants are biodegradable, and are detergents. Granted the half life of one is about a week in an anaerobic environment. The LD50's of both surfactants for Fish are in the 200 and 400mg/L range.

The dilution of the Ammonia used to the amount of water applied to would be about 0.000066

Thank you....so dump and start over.....or just continue....but get a different type of ammonia to finish the dosing?

 

[Bryn]

Thank you....so dump and start over.....or just continue....but get a different type of ammonia to finish the dosing?

Would be a good idea to find some Ace Hardware Ammonia, or pick up the Dr. Tims Ammonium Chloride, then you know its clean. Your cycle is on its way from the numbers, and not much further to go.

I would do a 100% water change to be on the safe side, and add some ammonium Chloride to finish the cycle. The bacteria is attached to the surface, so you will not lose very much. Finish cycling, then rinse the rock with saltwater, and place in tank.