Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

[ScottB]

I saw that when dosing silicates the Hanna ULR checker returns wrongly high numbers. I have to use a different test.

Now that you say that, I feel like I recall something about that -- Si interfering with phosphate measures but not sure.

 

[iLMaRiO]

Now that you say that, I feel like I recall something about that -- Si interfering with phosphate measures but not sure.

exactly that

 

[iLMaRiO]

i don't see many improvements

 

[iLMaRiO]

update

30 gennaio 2022

youtube.com

i still have many LCA but what's the round cell visible at the top? i'm trying to focus on that.

then, at the and of the video, a VERY HUGE beast is swimming. is that a diatom or a megalodon?

still unknown what the very very small (and very fast) cells are

 

[ScottB]

update

30 gennaio 2022

youtube.com

i still have many LCA but what's the round cell visible at the top? i'm trying to focus on that.

then, at the and of the video, a VERY HUGE beast is swimming. is that a diatom or a megalodon?

still unknown what the very very small (and very fast) cells are

The very small and fast cells are Small Cell Amphidinium.

The round cell COULD be Prorocentrum, as I feel like I see a circle in the middle of the cell.

 

[iLMaRiO]

The very small and fast cells are Small Cell Amphidinium.

The round cell COULD be Prorocentrum, as I feel like I see a circle in the middle of the cell.

so, even worse. i'm dosing silicates and no3
UV off because it could zap diatoms too

and what about the big beast at the end of the video?

 

[iLMaRiO]

some pics of the sand

 

[iLMaRiO]

almost sure these are cyanos even without microscope

 

[Reef.]

i'm not sure that blowing it would go down to the overflow, at least not all and not immediatly. most of it will go back to the Bottom

or with the same system even the sand Will go down to the sump

the idea is to reduce the numbers, then other bacteria can take over.
If you have some Clarisea filter material, place a strip over the side of your powerheads, you will see a load stick to the filter, so yes blowing the dinos into the water column does actually remove a lot and definitely worth doing.

 

[bishoptf]

@ScottB @taricha Looking for any additional suggestions, I just can't finish these guys off. I have small cell a long time ago and finally got over that hump but did a chemi clean treatment a few weeks ago and I know that was a mistake which made ostreo peak back up. They are not terrible but they are there and I'd like to figure out how to kick them out once and for all. I'm running UV in my DT but so far not sure what else to try, I have phosphate and nitrate, phosphate is not as high as it normally is since I think the Dino's are locking it up.

Seems to be a combination of symbondium and ostreo, just not sure if I should try a blackout or what my best course is at this point. Like I said they are not covering everything up etc, but can't get them to recede either, such a pain. Any suggestions welcome.

Here are some pics:

Most of the growth is underneath things where there is no light...

@ScottB @taricha Hoping you can provide some advice to what additional I can do in order to bring a tank in balance. I have struggled off and on with Dino's and this other stuff seen above and at my wits end not knowing what else to try to bring things in balance. Back in December I did a Chemiclean treatment to remove some cyano (I know, I know, will never do that again) and while the tank was not in balance it made things worse. I did WC to remove the chemi clean and then this stuff kind of moved in, did a blackout and fired up the UV and things seemed to settle down but I could always see the stuff clinging to the rocks, it's really odd. But I just went with it and kept doing normal things, wc every other week etc.

Fast forward to yesterday, I have upgraded my light over the weekend and noticed when looking up, bubbles on my return and higher portions of my tank, when looking closer I could tell it was starting to look like dino's again. I could see bubbles across the back of my tank and on the upper part of the overflow. I'm just at a loss as to what to try next, I have added live rock, aquabiomics live rubble (I have another batch coming soon), UV, MB7, and other bacteria additives. I am not nutrient starved, tested last night and Nitrate was 9 and po4 was .05. When I got the live rubble from Aquabiomics (about a month ago) I turned off my skimmer and UV, skimmer came back on after 2 days but I have had the UV off that whole time, I'd really like to get to a point where I do not need the UV. But I realized something is still out of whack and just not sure what else to try. Tank is a 29g nano with 20gl sump, skimmer and running carbon and floss.

Here are some latest pics:

From the sample I took they are not in large proportion but I can tell things just are not happy and not trending the right way.

This is part of what I am dealing with its like fuzz that clings to the rocks, i have a hard time even getting a sample, just disintegrates when I try. This showed up after the chemiclean treatment and I have not gotten it to go away along with some dino's.

Just looking for idea's...Thanks

 

[iLMaRiO]

here the bubbles are increasing A LOT
i would expect a reduction not an icrease

 

[Velcro]

Should I use GFO?

My tank is coming out of the second dino outbreak (prorocentrum). Both times it was caused by using fluconazole followed by chemiclean (I was a little impulsive with their use).

The tank is now 6 months old. It is a 25 gallon nano. I see dinos (air bubbles towards the end of the photo period) on only 1 rock. I do not see any mucus layers or strands. The sand bed has a light dusting of diatoms. It has been staying that way for a week. I do not have explosive hair algae yet; my urchin and hermits clean them up quickly.

My problem - Phosphates have been staying above 0.00 since the end of December. I didn’t dose that much phosphates but had some sail die off. It is currently sitting at 0.254. Measured with Hanna phosphorus ULR. Is it too early to use GFO? I want to bring it just under 0.100.

Additional points:

• Phospahtes whet up when I ramped up SpongExcel dosing. Have not dosed any since 2 weeks.
• My nitrates bottom out if I do not dose. That has been a problem during the entire 6 months.
• I dose AFR. Tank is mostly SPS.

If using Hanna phosphate checker silicate interferes by cause falsely elevated phos

edit: I didn’t see someone already said this

 

[Acros]

If using Hanna phosphate checker silicate interferes by cause falsely elevated phos

edit: I didn’t see someone already said this

I left it alone as per the suggestion I got here. It has slowly come down to 0.14. It is either phosphates or silicates being used up.

My nitrates are still bottoming out if I do not dose. Dinos are still hanging around in the sand, but completely gone from the rocks.

 

[ScottB]

@ScottB @taricha Hoping you can provide some advice to what additional I can do in order to bring a tank in balance. I have struggled off and on with Dino's and this other stuff seen above and at my wits end not knowing what else to try to bring things in balance. Back in December I did a Chemiclean treatment to remove some cyano (I know, I know, will never do that again) and while the tank was not in balance it made things worse. I did WC to remove the chemi clean and then this stuff kind of moved in, did a blackout and fired up the UV and things seemed to settle down but I could always see the stuff clinging to the rocks, it's really odd. But I just went with it and kept doing normal things, wc every other week etc.

Fast forward to yesterday, I have upgraded my light over the weekend and noticed when looking up, bubbles on my return and higher portions of my tank, when looking closer I could tell it was starting to look like dino's again. I could see bubbles across the back of my tank and on the upper part of the overflow. I'm just at a loss as to what to try next, I have added live rock, aquabiomics live rubble (I have another batch coming soon), UV, MB7, and other bacteria additives. I am not nutrient starved, tested last night and Nitrate was 9 and po4 was .05. When I got the live rubble from Aquabiomics (about a month ago) I turned off my skimmer and UV, skimmer came back on after 2 days but I have had the UV off that whole time, I'd really like to get to a point where I do not need the UV. But I realized something is still out of whack and just not sure what else to try. Tank is a 29g nano with 20gl sump, skimmer and running carbon and floss.

Here are some latest pics:

From the sample I took they are not in large proportion but I can tell things just are not happy and not trending the right way.

This is part of what I am dealing with its like fuzz that clings to the rocks, i have a hard time even getting a sample, just disintegrates when I try. This showed up after the chemiclean treatment and I have not gotten it to go away along with some dino's.

Just looking for idea's...Thanks

Those are ostreos but it doesn't sound like they have really spooled up yet.

Double check the UV that the tube is clean and the bulb is good. Chuck the Chemiclean in the trash. You can hang a bunch of filter floss in the areas up high, where the dinos are hanging out. Rinse before lights go down.

 

[bishoptf]

Those are ostreos but it doesn't sound like they have really spooled up yet.

Double check the UV that the tube is clean and the bulb is good. Chuck the Chemiclean in the trash. You can hang a bunch of filter floss in the areas up high, where the dinos are hanging out. Rinse before lights go down.

Yeah I thought those were the ones, I have not turned my UV back on and guess I will have to do that. Yeah I'm not going to do the CC again, I learned the hard way but the problem is I can't seem to get the tank to balance out. Are you still running UV, i'd like to not have to run and get whatever good bacteria to out compete it. So I guess your vote is to fire up the UV again and go down that path.

I've also thought about letting my skimmer to drain back into the sump and dirty up the water, good idea. My numbers aren't terrible but I think the dino's and whatever else that clingy stuff is, binding up the phosphate, it should be much higher. What do you think about letting the skimmer drain back into the sump?

 

[bishoptf]

Here are some scope pics of the stuff I have clinging to the rocks, I don't see much dino's but I have no idea what this junk is and how to go about getting it under control. I have quite a few snails and nothing seems to touch it...

I see it even on my snails shells, lol. Anyone have a clue would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[iLMaRiO]

i did a new po4 test, with salifert (the Hanna checker can't be used when dosing silicates). po4 are not detectable, very strange

 

[primo21]

Have some questions on a dino outbreak in a relatively new tank. 300g w/ ~ 200-250lbs rock, cycled over the summer. Last measurement had nitrates at 20 and phos at 0.12. Reading through the beginning of the post you recommend not letting either hit zero which they havent. Is this just a wait and see because the tank is young or should I be doing something else now. UV for a tank this size is an investment so hoping there is something else to try first. Thanks.

 

[ScottB]

Yeah I thought those were the ones, I have not turned my UV back on and guess I will have to do that. Yeah I'm not going to do the CC again, I learned the hard way but the problem is I can't seem to get the tank to balance out. Are you still running UV, i'd like to not have to run and get whatever good bacteria to out compete it. So I guess your vote is to fire up the UV again and go down that path.

I've also thought about letting my skimmer to drain back into the sump and dirty up the water, good idea. My numbers aren't terrible but I think the dino's and whatever else that clingy stuff is, binding up the phosphate, it should be much higher. What do you think about letting the skimmer drain back into the sump?

No I don't run UV all the time, but I always keep the unit ready to deploy. I built a nifty PVC contraption that allows me to just slap it on the side of the glass and plug it in. Whenever a fish looks spotty or "off", or if the system has some kind of noisiness going on.

The UV should knock those down pretty quick.

Sure, letting the cup drain for a while is fine. I am typically more inclined to add another feeding. Heavy IN / heavy OUT seems to keep my fish and sticks much more stable than otherwise. That said, I do keep tangs and foxfaces galore; otherwise I would likely have some algae issues.

 

[iLMaRiO]

what are these small and fast cells?
they doesn't look like dinos



and the "crossed" White things are diatoms?