Do acid and bleach curing methods work better than natural cures? | BRStv Investigates

[cap232]

i used 1 gallon muriatc acid to 20g of water. after I am done with that I use 1 gallon of bleach per 20 gallon. I sometimes leave it in the bleach for a mouth that's how I clean rock to store it to use at a later time. I use just tap water also its just cleaning not curing.

 

[cap232]

Interesting. Newer to the reeling community, I am about to venture into curing my pukani rock. I like the bleaching method described in the video, but want to be sure I understand the methodology. Freshwater or saltwater with bleach? I am guessing fresh? And also, I am assuming RO/DI water is preferred to water from tap? For this method, is heated water preferred? And I am also assuming the water should be circulated with a pump, like all the other curing processes? Finally, based on the leveling off of the phosphate level, is it reasonable to cut back on the length of curing to 2-3 weeks?

your just cleaning so no ro/di or pump and you don't need heated water. your not curing it your cleaning it.

 

[randyBRS]

1)Do i really have to soak in bleach 10:1 for a week, or even 2-3 weeks as BRS would like to try? I have heard many people bleach for only a day. Some 2-3 days.
2) Given my diluted muriatic acid, should i keep the acid bath going for more than 15 minutes to compensate? I really dont want to lose so much rock so i figured 15 minutes with less acid concentration would be a happy medium.

Hey there!

You may have a decent breakdown of organics from a shorter soaking period than 2-3wks, although it may be limited. There may be some larger or more dense organic particles on the rock that 1wk of soaking may not remove, but I would imagine you could remove most of those larger pieces manually before the bath. Unfortunately we didn't test the organic breakdown levels throughout the initial soaking process, so I don't have any hard data to share here.

-Randy

 

[mfinn]

@randyBRS In the last test you did a acid bath first, then the bleach bath second.
Why that order?
Any downsides to doing the bleach bath first, then the acid bath?

 

[coolhand]

I used a bleach only method. Approximately a 10:1 ratio. I let it soak in bleach and tap water for 2 weeks. After that I dropped in some dechlor tabs and let sit for a day. Tested for chlorine and it was 0. Then I dumped. I rinsed it off under a garden hose then soaked it for 2 more weeks in rodi water. I used a powerhead during soaking. Afterwards i tested again for chlorine. My readings were 0. It worked great for me. My tank cycled really fast. About 2 1/2 weeks. I had a very small algae bloom. Tanks been up and running for 3 months now. Fish are loving life. Corals look great. I will do this every time now.

 

[randyBRS]

@randyBRS In the last test you did a acid bath first, then the bleach bath second.
Why that order?
Any downsides to doing the bleach bath first, then the acid bath?

Hey there,

I talked to Aaron about this and he seems to remember that there was a concern with how much rock would deteriorate from the acid bath and opted to do that first. I remember there was a pretty significant loss of total mass from our first run with the initial concentration of acid.

-Randy

 

[mfinn]

Hey there,

I talked to Aaron about this and he seems to remember that there was a concern with how much rock would deteriorate from the acid bath and opted to do that first. I remember there was a pretty significant loss of total mass from our first run with the initial concentration of acid.

-Randy

To eliminate the big loss of rock, why not cut the acid ratio down?
The idea is just to peel off a small amount of phosphate heavy rock, isn't it?

 

[randyBRS]

To eliminate the big loss of rock, why not cut the acid ratio down?
The idea is just to peel off a small amount of phosphate heavy rock, isn't it?

Yep, after we realized how much mass was eroded, we did end up cutting the ratio down to mitigate it as best as possible. From what I saw, I would say the acid is great for the heavy surface organics. Personally, I'd rather just do the bleach and forgo the acid. I'm not too keen on the hassle of dealing with acid and I'm pretty happy with the results of bleach only.

-Randy

 

[Chris Wells]

This is really interesting.. I am cooking rock right now in bleach. Planning for 2 weeks with powerheads, then like mfinn's thoughts, I am going to to cut ratio like you said and do a "delicate" acid wash, if you will.

 

[reefknight]

Which do you feel would be more beneficial for removing large amounts of organics and the possibility of bound nutrients then; acid>bleach or bleach>acid?

Is removing the surface layer by acid with a long bleach soak more effective than say a long bleach soak followed by the concentrated acid wash? Or is this tomato/tomatoe?
Just want to get a sense of concensus as I'll be starting to remove and relocate inhabitants this week. Then the fun begins.

For the most part, how long are the majority leaving the rock in RO/DI soaks before resetting or curing a tank with this rock?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

IMO, the bleach degrades and removes organics.

The acid removes phosphate and copper and such bound directly to the rock surface by dissolving a bit of it, and may remove organics by dissolving away the surface under it to some extent.

For that reason, I'd do bleach then acid.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The bleach needs to be removed somehow (dechlorinator, leave in sun, lots of water rinses, etc.)

The acid does not since it will be neutralized by the rock itself.

Make sure most bleach is gone before the acid because bleach plus acid makes chlorine gas which is toxic to you.

 

[Chris Wells]

I was going to rinse thoroughly with tap (like leave overnight in it),
then refill with ro/di and de-chlorinate with prime,
then add acid just enough to get a reaction but not more than 40:1.

A good question is how long really does the bleach method really need to cook before diminishing / no returns.

 

[mfinn]

A good question is how long really does the bleach method really need to cook before diminishing / no returns.

In the video on page 1 of this thread is a chart/breakdown

 

[Chris Wells]

In the video on page 1 of this thread is a chart/breakdown

I must have "Data dumped" before I got to the end...lol
I will rewatch,

thx

**Update: Just rewatched, so 2 weeks it is. No better results after.

 

[Stigigemla]

I have sold more than 1000 pounds of dry dead rock.
The method I rekommend my customers is to cover it in bucket with ordinary tap water and a little amount of start bacteria. It seems like the brand is unimportant. If your water is chlorinated add a coffee spoon of C vitamin. Store it in room temperature. In a few days you will see a film on the surface or begin to smell. Change all the water. After a few days it will start to smell or have the film again. Repeat again. After 2- 4 weeks there will be no film or smell in another week and the rock is ready. The last water is normally under 0.1 ppm phosphate.
No poisons or dangerous chemicals and it has functioned for all of my customers.

 

[reefknight]

IMO, the bleach degrades and removes organics.

The acid removes phosphate and copper and such bound directly to the rock surface by dissolving a bit of it, and may remove organics by dissolving away the surface under it to some extent.

For that reason, I'd do bleach then acid.

Thanks Randy for the suggestions. I'm interested in the benefits of the removal of bound organics and PO4. Due to repeated issues that have not been able to be eliminated by other means. I believe that the rock may just have become saturated. Therefore removing that outer layer of rock and and attempting to sterilize it is probably best going forward.
I know in the past i have let it dry out, scrub it off and dry completely in my garage and red wire algae (gelidium) has come back. So hopefully going to an extreme such as this will finally resolve the issues.

Has anyone attempted this with a substrate? Bleaching and rinsing I have heard of. What about acid washing? Any benefits?

 

[Montu]

Nice video, I've decided to restart my tank and bought all new rock for it...I soaked the rock in a bleach solution for 24 hrs but since I'm in no rush I just put it back in and will leave it there for about a week then I plan on using the Acid method.

What strength Acid and bleach was used in your test?

I'm using 1 gallon of 10% Sodium Hypochlorite in a 17 gallon container with 30lbs of rock..so not sure exactly how many gallons..I also am using water strait from the garden hose..with all the sanitation I'm not sure it would make a difference.

For the Acid I was just planning on taking it slow and looking for a good amount of foam for 10-15 mins..I have 31.45% muratic acid on hand for that. (I have both on hand all the time for pool maintenance)

Wish me luck.

 

[Addicted2ACRO's]

Hello...weighing in here...I'm looking for some advice and answers. I have a tank thats been established for about 6 years now. I'm looking to replace my Live Rock with Pukani Dry Rock. I just recently purchased 25 lbs... it looks awesome and has a lot of holes for frag plugs. I like the idea of the Acid and Bleach curing method, but I'm concerned about a couple of things. Will there be any adverse effects to my established system by introducing Dry Live Rock that has been cured using this method and could the Acid and Bleach leach out that might be remaining in the rock from curing?

 

[Bruce Burnett]

Hello...weighing in here...I'm looking for some advice and answers. I have a tank thats been established for about 6 years now. I'm looking to replace my Live Rock with Pukani Dry Rock. I just recently purchased 25 lbs... it looks awesome and has a lot of holes for frag plugs. I like the idea of the Acid and Bleach curing method, but I'm concerned about a couple of things. Will there be any adverse effects to my established system by introducing Dry Live Rock that has been cured using this method and could the Acid and Bleach leach out that might be remaining in the rock from curing?

acid and bleach is not a curing process. It is a cleaning process and then after it is flushed well with clean water it is then cured in saltwater until it has cycled and is now live rock.