Ecotech Mobius, I Am Trying To Wrap My Head Around The Benefits!

[Biff0rz]

ETM is their own company and expected them to move away from Neptune eventually and I am perfectly happy with that, I dont want all my equipment dependent on one device to operate like the Apex. Its far safer to split it up and not rely solely on one chip. If I understand what Mobius is trying to do it sounds more like a mesh system vs a centralized system which is FAR safer and superior lets be patient and let them build it out.
Provide good feedback with reason if you want them to include your request, they listen it just takes time and cant enable every fringe feature request.

Imo you're a bit off on this one. Being in IoT they probably went BLE because it's easier and takes less steps to handshake when it comes to development work. You don't create a mesh off of different protocols you create one on the same protocol with many devices talking to each other, they are not doing that. A centralized system is easier and just as safe as a non-centralized because really at home you have one electricity provider and one internet provider. If either of those are out no matter how many systems you have, you're sol.

What they are doing is competing. And for us competition is good. I think most reefers are just not used to the mvp/beta model which is what etm is doing then adding on so they can hit the market sooner. Imo they should probably plan a bit better and release more fully featured products.

 

[BullyBee]

I was all in for Mobius. Now I find it to be something I couldn’t care less for.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

but with the versa i have to be near the tank to increase or decrease my triton dosing.

that will soon change

 

[ReefPig]

A lot of people don't seem to like Mobius, saying things like "i want to throw my phone at the wall", why?

I got two XR30 G5 Blues from the very first delivery batch and have had zero issues with it on iphone and ipad.
It's easier to use than ecosmart, it's more reactive, you don't lose connection to reeflink (like used to happen all the time) and I've had zero failures. I would also never change my lights remotely.

I know that android users have had more issues, but I thought this was largely sorted now.

I get that for vectra and vortech you would want to control these remotely, if thats the case, then don't swap over to mobius yet. Continue using ecosmart for them until the feature is available.

Nobody is forcing you to move to mobius (yet), so why the complaints?

For versa, it was clear from the outset that this was a limitation right now, you bought into a device that didn't have remote access. So why now moan? YOU decided to buy it, nobody forced you.
I wont be buying a versa until the feature is available, simple.

If you need remote access to turn something off in an emergency, then plug it into a controlled plugbar (GHL, Neptune).
Someone even mentioned a Neptune leak detector near the return pump and then complained that ETM doesn't allow remote access to turn it off. Plug the pump into the Neptune!!

Again, nobody is forcing you to buy ETM. The level of entitlement is off the chart.

 

[robbyg]

I think the confusing part is that ETM did things in reverse. Most companies come out with a controller and then add the accessories. Due to how ETM came to the market they had to do it in reverse.

Just stating a fact. Mobius alone will never be able to control your tank remotely.
They need some kind of black box that will wirelessly talk to the Bluetooth devices and then relay that info over WiFi or better yet have an Ethernet cable to your router and then off to the internet.

It would seem like a wise idea for ETM to make this Black Box with ports so that they can physically plug devices into it like float switches, leak sensors and temp probes. I would love to add powerbars to that list but ETM seems to have their head immersed in wireless, so I suspect they will go with an EKoral type solution and use wireless power bars.

On a final note, if there is one thing that can ruin their system, it is this heavy dependency on wireless technology. So far connection issues have been one of their big problems. Software they can fix but connectivity is not so simple. Every company that I know of that has been using Bluetooth has had nothing but problems with it. This has not changed in 20 years of BT use. It's due to Bluetooth's annoying system of using complex header profiles for task assignment, its overly wasteful use of data redundancy coupled with it's fractured data issues that are inherent in the original design. Good luck ETM on fixing that one. I am sure you will get an IEEE Medal of Honor if you succeed.

 

[Lucas815]

I think the confusing part is that ETM did things in reverse. Most companies come out with a controller and then add the accessories. Due to how ETM came to the market they had to do it in reverse.

Just stating a fact. Mobius alone will never be able to control your tank remotely.
They need some kind of black box that will wirelessly talk to the Bluetooth devices and then relay that info over WiFi or better yet have an Ethernet cable to your router and then off to the internet.

It would seem like a wise idea for ETM to make this Black Box with ports so that they can physically plug devices into it like float switches, leak sensors and temp probes. I would love to add powerbars to that list but ETM seems to have their head immersed in wireless, so I suspect they will go with an EKoral type solution and use wireless power bars.

On a final note, if there is one thing that can ruin their system, it is this heavy dependency on wireless technology. So far connection issues have been one of their big problems. Software they can fix but connectivity is not so simple. Every company that I know of that has been using Bluetooth has had nothing but problems with it. This has not changed in 20 years of BT use. It's due to Bluetooth's annoying system of using complex header profiles for task assignment, its overly wasteful use of data redundancy coupled with it's fractured data issues that are inherent in the original design. Good luck ETM on fixing that one. I am sure you will get an IEEE Medal of Honor if you succeed.

This black box you mention has actually been confirmed to be the Radion G5.

Apex/COR vs. Mobius/Vectra Remote Monitoring?

I currently have an Apex and COR-20, which allows me to remotely monitor the status of the COR-20 while on vacation, etc. I can see the pump watts, rpm, and temp, which gives me a pretty decent idea if it's working or not. I also have Radion G5s and Vortechs controlled through Mobius. I'm...

www.reef2reef.com

Every Ecotech communicates between each other with a proprietary radio mesh protocol, instead of Bluetooth.
My theory is that when the Radion will be connected to Wifi, every other device in the mesh will be connected by the proprietary protocol to the Radion, completly avoiding the need of using Bluetooth.

 

[RobB'z Reef]

ETM is their own company and expected them to move away from Neptune eventually and I am perfectly happy with that, I dont want all my equipment dependent on one device to operate like the Apex. Its far safer to split it up and not rely solely on one chip. If I understand what Mobius is trying to do it sounds more like a mesh system vs a centralized system which is FAR safer and superior lets be patient and let them build it out.
Provide good feedback with reason if you want them to include your request, they listen it just takes time and cant enable every fringe feature request.

I agree, I see more value in distributed control vs centralized.

 

[robbyg]

This black box you mention has actually been confirmed to be the Radion G5.

Apex/COR vs. Mobius/Vectra Remote Monitoring?

I currently have an Apex and COR-20, which allows me to remotely monitor the status of the COR-20 while on vacation, etc. I can see the pump watts, rpm, and temp, which gives me a pretty decent idea if it's working or not. I also have Radion G5s and Vortechs controlled through Mobius. I'm...

www.reef2reef.com

Every Ecotech communicates between each other with a proprietary radio mesh protocol, instead of Bluetooth.
My theory is that when the Radion will be connected to Wifi, every other device in the mesh will be connected by the proprietary protocol to the Radion, completly avoiding the need of using Bluetooth.

Thats actually very shocking news to me!
So if you don't own a Radion G5 you will never be able to remotely talk to your Vortech or Versa pumps! That also eliminates the possibility of there being a real controller unit. I sometimes have a hard time following ETMs thinking process, maybe its because I am thinking to far ahead and keep believing a full blown controller is on the table. Maybe they are years away from even considering that.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

Thats actually very shocking news to me!
So if you don't own a Radion G5 you will never be able to remotely talk to your Vortech or Versa pumps! That also eliminates the possibility of there being a real controller unit. I sometimes have a hard time following ETMs thinking process, maybe its because I am thinking to far ahead and keep believing a full blown controller is on the table. Maybe they are years away from even considering that.

Eventually there will be other product that also has wifi capabilities. At the moment the only product available with wifi is the G5 radoins. eventually that will change.

 

[MJ in Boise]

Mobius is trash. Was the last straw for me. Went back to Tunze and will never buy another ecotech product again.

 

[robbyg]

Mobius is trash. Was the last straw for me. Went back to Tunze and will never buy another ecotech product again.

Kind of an extreme position to take considering that just a single app update could solve all your issues. We do know they are working on it.

 

[Kindred]

I’m sitting here on vacation watching my alk plummet , for some reason my tank decided to increase alk consumption this week , typical Murphy’s law type situation... I’m dosing triton core with 4 versas.

I knew this was a limitation but really wish I could control remotely to tweak them up right now

love the versa but hate no remote if they don’t add soon I’ll change out before I travel again.

 

[myakuel]

kindred, i feel your pain, wish i could help! this is the exact same issue i deal with as well, hope they do something soon to adress this or i will switch back to dos

 

[GlassMunky]

Kind of an extreme position to take considering that just a single app update could solve all your issues. We do know they are working on it.

And we’re still waiting on hell to freeze over as well.
This constant “it’s gonna come later” cry from all the ETM fanboys is just silly.
As a person buying a product I dgaf what you say will happen in a year from now, when it’s clear from your past history that you can’t follow a timeline.
I’ve been hearing the same thing “it’ll be able to do that later” for well over 8 months now, closer to year.
how is that in any way helpful to the people have have the products now?

you’re just being dragged along with a promise of a treat that may very well never come.

 

[lefkonj]

For 99% of my use Mobius has been great. I am hopeful for the future. I understand the limitations but compared to how poor the quality is with Neptune I will take these limitations. If I was traveling and my ALK consumption went up I am not sure I would increase it remotely, unless someone could put eyes on the tank and give me a health update.

 

[Evaaron]

Imo you're a bit off on this one. Being in IoT they probably went BLE because it's easier and takes less steps to handshake when it comes to development work. You don't create a mesh off of different protocols you create one on the same protocol with many devices talking to each other, they are not doing that. A centralized system is easier and just as safe as a non-centralized because really at home you have one electricity provider and one internet provider. If either of those are out no matter how many systems you have, you're sol.

What they are doing is competing. And for us competition is good. I think most reefers are just not used to the mvp/beta model which is what etm is doing then adding on so they can hit the market sooner. Imo they should probably plan a bit better and release more fully featured products.

I think you misunderstood my point, I was not talking about mesh for the sake of IOT and being online, I was saying that with Mobius if one of my devices fail all the rest continue to function, maybe not on the cloud when that feature is enabled but rather continues to do its job. Ever had a apex controller die? Nothing works, not the outlets, dosing pumps etc. A cor20 may continue to function but most everything else in that ecosystem wont.

 

[robbyg]

I think you misunderstood my point, I was not talking about mesh for the sake of IOT and being online, I was saying that with Mobius if one of my devices fail all the rest continue to function, maybe not on the cloud when that feature is enabled but rather continues to do its job. Ever had a apex controller die? Nothing works, not the outlets, dosing pumps etc. A cor20 may continue to function but most everything else in that ecosystem wont.

The only problem with that line of thought is that it is mostly Apex specific. If you look at some of the other brands like GHL and Aquatronica the basic design takes into account this weakness. All of my powerbars along with dosing pumps, lighting system and other modules like eco tech, tunze and SMS all contain an independent CPU system that just gets loaded with commands from the main controller and will function just about normally even if the controller itself is disconnected from the system.

 

[Evaaron]

The only problem with that line of thought is that it is mostly Apex specific. If you look at some of the other brands like GHL and Aquatronica the basic design takes into account this weakness. All of my powerbars along with dosing pumps, lighting system and other modules like eco tech, tunze and SMS all contain an independent CPU system that just gets loaded with commands from the main controller and will function just about normally even if the controller itself is disconnected from the system.

It is mostly Apex specific, I have used GHL but it was many years ago so I can’t speak to their current design. I was reffering to Apex because it’s the most popular and most people are familiar with it.

 

[ChangNoi]

I disagree with "you shouldnt need to reprogram your tank when away from home". I have done so multiple times in a pinch and it was hugely helpful. Controlling the tank when away from home is a good part of why I own an Apex.

To be honest most of these companies dont outsource their apps (like they should) and they end up being pretty "meh". I hope that Mobius is a step forward for ecotech.

I agree completely with you. I actually own a set of four of the Versa pumps and love them, they work great...but, I travel often and most recently got stuck away from home for 4 months (due to the shutdowns associated with COVID-19). I needed to increase the dosing on my calcium reactor and couldn’t do it due to no internet connection to the Versa pumps! I lowered the pH in the reactor using programming on my Apex and that worked for about a month, but finally had to have a friend go to the house, download the Mobius app, logon with my credentials and adjust the dosing levels. Had the Mobius “ecosystem” included the promised internet connection, I could have done this easily. Very disappointed in EM for moving to this system without including the connectivity. This is simply an indication of the type of company they are.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

I agree completely with you. I actually own a set of four of the Versa pumps and love them, they work great...but, I travel often and most recently got stuck away from home for 4 months (due to the shutdowns associated with COVID-19). I needed to increase the dosing on my calcium reactor and couldn’t do it due to no internet connection to the Versa pumps! I lowered the pH in the reactor using programming on my Apex and that worked for about a month, but finally had to have a friend go to the house, download the Mobius app, logon with my credentials and adjust the dosing levels. Had the Mobius “ecosystem” included the promised internet connection, I could have done this easily. Very disappointed in EM for moving to this system without including the connectivity. This is simply an indication of the type of company they are.

On a side bar, what do you have that allows for 4 months of automated feeding?