Fairy wrasse laying flat heavy breathing in QT

[josvanmeer]

Also worth noting: when you go from one medicine to another, you need to wait a few days in between. If you don’t and you medicate back to back, you risk over medicating their system and, essentially, kill them by doing too much. Just because the meds are out of the water does not mean the meds have left fish’s body.

General cure and copper are dosed at the same time all the time. I didnt even do that. I took this whole process as slow as anyone possibly could. I guarantee its the cupramine. Anyway it should be all good now, just waiting on him to get his strength back and then I will observe them for another week before I do anything else.

 

[NaturalGothic]

Temp was fine, nice and warm. Oxygen levels are definitely ok. I know he is stressed and I am attributing it to the copper. The other fish is taking it a whole lot better. I just did the water change and I put some spirulina brine in after the change. I actually managed to feed him some by holding a coral feeder right by his mouth and he is trying to get up to chase the food, just doesnt have the strength for it yet. He is moving his muscles more but still laying flat. I think I have done all I can to help him right now. Hopefully he will be able to get upright by the end of the day. Either way I wil update tonight to let yall know how he is doing.

you’ve done the best you can so my advice would be just leave him alone for now. Check on him from time to time but destressing is gonna be a key factor for him.

 

[josvanmeer]

He moved (twitched) his way into the pvc pipe he was always hiding in, so hes moving more than he was.
I fed him with the coralfeeder again this evening and I was able to feed him out of it, he was eating right out of it, I see he wants to chase the food, but he is seriously impaired and cant. Now I am even wondering if its not the copper at all and he seriously injured himself jumping at the lid? Its eggcrate with mesh screen in front of it so its hard, he could have broken something maybe thats why he isnt swimming?

I have no idea what copper related injuries/disease looks like so Im just guessing here.
Still hoping for some experts to stop by and chime in.

Im not really hopeful at this point. This sucks.

 

[vetteguy53081]

If you can, increase oxygen even with a pump and air stone.
I assume you’re using api test kit? All zero In a qt tank is untypical

 

[josvanmeer]

If you can, increase oxygen even with a pump and air stone.
I assume you’re using api test kit? All zero In a qt tank is untypical

Theres a powerhead mounted towards the surface that is making the surface really turbulent, if oxygen was low then it would also affect its QT partner, which has been acting like nothing is going on at all, just chillin in the tank all day since I got it.

I use Red Sea test kit for ammonia, it is reading zero last time I checked, but it also had copper in the system at that point which nothing will show up when thats the case. I have done a complete water change two days ago, and then more than half today to remove the copper. There just is no way theres ammonia present. Its old established ceramic media thats in the filter, ammonia is the last thing Im worried about. For what its worth the seachem ammonia badge has also been yellow but I dont really trust those things personally.

I dont see any skin burn or anything like that present either, hes looking good color and skin wise, he currently is just on his side not swimming.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Theres a powerhead mounted towards the surface that is making the surface really turbulent, if oxygen was low then it would also affect its QT partner, which has been acting like nothing is going on at all, just chillin in the tank all day since I got it.

I use Red Sea test kit for ammonia, it is reading zero last time I checked, but it also had copper in the system at that point which nothing will show up when thats the case. I have done a complete water change two days ago, and then more than half today to remove the copper. There just is no way theres ammonia present. Its old established ceramic media thats in the filter, ammonia is the last thing Im worried about. For what its worth the seachem ammonia badge has also been yellow but I dont really trust those things personally.

I dont see any skin burn or anything like that present either, hes looking good color and skin wise, he currently is just on his side not swimming.

You’re treating multiple meds from what I read and you want to assure there’s saturated oxygen. Powerhead at surface for gas exchange is good but you want dissolved oxygen at safe level

 

[josvanmeer]

You’re treating multiple meds from what I read and you want to assure there’s saturated oxygen. Powerhead at surface for gas exchange is good but you want dissolved oxygen at safe level

I used general cure last week, and they finished up on those last week around Friday. I did a full water change Friday. No medications should have been present in that water. Fish were acting all fine. I waited till Saturday to dose a tiny amount of copper, fish still acting fine. Initial copper levels were 0.14 after a day. Sunday I add another small dose, Copper was at 0.27, when I measured Today it was 0.24 to verify. Fish was only acting up this morning when it was laying flat. Im not sure if its now Copper related or maybe it hurt itself on the lid trying to jump or something. I followed textbook recommendations by Humblefish info, to up the levels over 4 to 5 days for wrasse specifically because they are sensitive to it. Even though its cupramine I did not expect a reaction like this from the fish, especially since the smaller yellow wrasse is doing completely fine.

 

[kenchilada]

If his gills are damaged he isn’t getting as much oxygen per gill beat as the other fish, so more oxygenation is better because he won’t have to work so hard to breathe.

Watch for infection (red steaks, white patches) since copper suppresses immune system and he is weak. When I ammonia burned my tang he had bacterial fin rot shortly after. Was lucky it wasn’t more serious.

Glad he’s still hanging on!

 

[josvanmeer]

If his gills are damaged he isn’t getting as much oxygen per gill beat as the other fish, so more oxygenation is better because he won’t have to work so hard to breathe.

Watch for infection (red steaks, white patches) since copper suppresses immune system and he is weak. When I ammonia burned my tang he had bacterial fin rot shortly after. Was lucky it wasn’t more serious.

Glad he’s still hanging on!

I have nothing else so I used an airlifter that is blowing in bubbles. Its really not made for this purpose but since I dont have anything silent or gentle this is it. Ill go to the lfs tomorrow to get an airstone as backup. Ill let the airlifter pump in air all night and see what the fish is doing in the morning

 

[mattzang]

he may have injured himself, i'd personally try to use something larger than a 10g for fairy wrasses. they're so darty and injury prone to begin with, i just feel like a 10g is prime for spinal injuries

beyond that like others suggested copper power seems better and raising it super slowly. i took about a week to raise up my fairy wrasses from 1.0 to 2.0 and they've all stayed eating and seem generally ok

 

[josvanmeer]

he may have injured himself, i'd personally try to use something larger than a 10g for fairy wrasses. they're so darty and injury prone to begin with, i just feel like a 10g is prime for spinal injuries

beyond that like others suggested copper power seems better and raising it super slowly. i took about a week to raise up my fairy wrasses from 1.0 to 2.0 and they've all stayed eating and seem generally ok

Yeah this is my very first time quarantining fish and a 10 gallon is literally recommended everywhere. I see now that is definitely a too small area. I have a 40gal breeder but I dont want to use that since maintenance would be too much.

As far as the fish is concerned, blowing bubbles in all night didnt do anything as I suspected so if someone mentions oxygen levels one more time you will be ignored.

I am looking for serious replies that are actually helpful.

I will try to see if I can record him today and upload a video of him twitching around, but I think he tried to jump and broke something.

If so is he able to recover from that at all?

What can I do to help him if he broke something? I am already spoon feeding him and he is eating a lot that way, so he is not going hungry.

 

[josvanmeer]

Uploading a video of him. Please confirm if this looks like a spinal injury or something like that. In that case I already done some research and besides crossing your fingers theres basically no hope.

 

[SaltyT]

A 20 gal long works well for QT'ing wrasses if you don't want to mess with setting up your 40b. I would recommend removing the egg crate and just using a screen top for your QT tank and using a screen top on your DT too as any wrasse can jump.

Based on the video I don't think there's anything you can do except keep trying to feed him and hope he recovers.
Sorry

 

[josvanmeer]

A 20 gal long works well for QT'ing wrasses if you don't want to mess with setting up your 40b. I would recommend removing the egg crate and just using a screen top for your QT tank and using a screen top on your DT too as any wrasse can jump.

Based on the video I don't think there's anything you can do except keep trying to feed him and hope he recovers.
Sorry

Theres a screen lid on my 150.
I think what I am gonna do in the future is just not quarantine myself. I know I can quarantine myself, but I wasnt really looking for another tank in my house to begin with; and now this happens which for me personally it feels like I just cant win if that makes any sense?

I am trying so hard to provide a disease/parasite free environment and follow all the directions given online that people have great success with and I still end up with a broken fish.

I am just gonna leave it up to TSM and Dr Reef now to provide me with the fish I want because I dont want to go through this again.

I will use the tank purely for hospitalizing, since I stil have all the equipment needed and a whole array of meds on hand to cure almost anything.

 

[SaltyT]

I totally understand where you're coming from. I got my radiant wrasse from TSM Aquatics in October after having tried for years to get one through QT. She arrived in top condition. I've heard great things about Dr. Reef too.

I hope your wrasse pulls through. Keep us posted!

 

[josvanmeer]

I totally understand where you're coming from. I got my radiant wrasse from TSM Aquatics in October after having tried for years to get one through QT. She arrived in top condition. I've heard great things about Dr. Reef too.

I hope your wrasse pulls through. Keep us posted!

I currently have an algae blenny and a Marginalis Butterfly preordered from TSM, which will be a prized possession in my tank, so I am really excited about it. They currently have some wrasse in the facility as well, with some that I wanted so I am just gonna go ahead and add another order.