Hammer receding because of algae, thoughts?

noobreefer2

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Hey everyone, I have had a hammer in my tank a little over 6 months, that hasn't grown much, but has stayed healthy for the most part. But a few months ago, I had a severe outbreak of chrysophytes, that was irritating and killing some stony corals. This coral looked fine for the most part:
IMG_7085.JPG

But a little while later, I started to notice the flesh receding:
IMG_7132.JPG

And this has just gotten worse and worse: (This picture was taken just now)
IMG_7181.JPG

Please note that the picture above was taken right after I scrubbed the skeleton with a toothbrush in a effort to get rid of the algae.

Mag: 1300 ppm
Alk: 8.5-9 dkh
Ca: 440 ppm
Nitrate: 0-1 ppm
Phosphate: 0.04-0.05 ppm
Salinity: 1.025

What do you think I could do to help the algae from taking over the coral? Should I keep scrubbing the skeleton, or is that going to do more harm than good? Could I do a peroxide dip? I am dosing vibrant by-weekly as a treatment for the algae. If anyone has had a experience like this please share your thoughts, I hope to get this coral back to looking well.

Thanks in advance, if you have questions just ask.

P.S link to my algae thread: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/dino-diatom-thoughts.810633/
 
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Just went through your algae thread, you really had a lot of bad advice there. Your corals have probably died from starvation sorry to be the one telling you.

HuduVudu

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I'm sure corals adapt many ways in the wild to survive but they are not being spoon fed mysis daily so to say all LPS need to be direct fed in a tank is misleading. They can certainly do fine with broadcast feeding and their photosynthetic process. Do they benefit from direct feeding? Of course I feel they do. If I give my dog milkbones constantly he will be nice and plump to. I never really direct feed my corals at all. Just leave my wave pumps on and allow everything to blow around like the ocean current does in the place you referenced.
Our aquariums aren't even close to the ocean. That is like saying a terrium is small forrest.

I did not say all LPS need feeding. Gonis (of which I have) do not feed directly.

In the ocean the LPS do not feed the way that we feed them in our aquarium, this is true. They eat sessil inverts, that make the fatal mistake of crossing into their tenticals. This is part of the nutruition that they need to grow and reproduce. They are genetically adapted to this and they expect it from their environment. To not provide it ensures their reccession and ultimately their death. It doesn't take long of perusing the local LFS that doesn't understand this to realize many bargains are to be had. The sad part is that most of the caretakers of these corals think as you do.
 
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Bombschell

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Nope but basic common sense tells me no one is direct feeding them in the ocean unless you have a side job of course.
They feed themselves by catching floating and sometimes active things in the water column with their tentacles
 
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Lavey29

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Our aquariums aren't even close to the ocean. That is like saying a terrium is small forrest.

I did not say all LPS need feeding. Gonis (of which I have) do not feed directly.

In the ocean the LPS do not feed the way that we feed them in our aquarium, this is true. They eat sessil inverts, that make the fatal mistake of crossing into their tenticals. This is part of the nutruition that they need to grow and reproduce. They are genetically adapted to this and they expect it from their environment. To not provide it ensures their reccession and ultimately their death. It doesn't take long of perusing the local LFS that doesn't understand this to realize many bargains are to be had. The sad part is that most of the caretakers of these corals think as you do.
Do the big coral vendors with 30,000 square feet of LPS frag tanks direct feed their corals? Nope...yet they still thrive
 
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ApoIsland

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Almost all LPS need to be fed directly.

I am always confused why people won't feed their LPS, saying something to the effect of that they think photosynthesis is enough. That is not my experience. And I am able to get very cheap LPS because stores won't feed theirs.
I am equally confused as to why people say you need to directly feed LPS. In 10 years I have never fed any LPS coral and have to frag them regularly as it's hard to keep up with growth. I keep hammers, torches, 5 or 6 diff favia, same amount of chalices, many fungia, lobos, thrachys, candy cane, leptastrea, and whatever else I am forgetting.
 
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ApoIsland

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I am equally confused as to why people say you need to directly feed LPS. In 10 years I have never fed any LPS coral and have to frag them regularly as it's hard to keep up with growth. I keep hammers, torches, 5 or 6 diff favia, same amount of chalices, many fungia, lobos, thrachys, candy cane, leptastrea, and whatever else I am forgetting.
Thinking back, this statement isn't entirely true....I did feed a pink tubastrea coral and some acans. And they died. So the only two LPS I have ever fed is the only LPS I have killed. The other 50 or so have all been thriving for years without any feeding.
 
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HuduVudu

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I am equally confused as to why people say you need to directly feed LPS. In 10 years I have never fed any LPS coral and have to frag them regularly as it's hard to keep up with growth. I keep hammers, torches, 5 or 6 diff favia, same amount of chalices, many fungia, lobos, thrachys, candy cane, leptastrea, and whatever else I am forgetting.
If you are putting LPS in the tank that is in your Avatar photo, I would not be surprised that they do well without feeding. The amount of sesile inverts available to them is going to be very high.

A person with a new basicly sterile tank is going to struggle to get the creatures to live without some sort of outside food source. They are going to be confused by the advice being given to them and why they can not successfully replicate the advice being provided.

Also when an LPS is weakened when it comes from a tank that is mostly devoid of low end life and not fed it is very unlikely to recover and continuation of that situation or removing it and putting it in a similar situation will only result in it's demise.

I get LPS all of the time in this weakened state and nurse them back to health by stimulating their feeding response and working tirelessly to get at least a few polyps to feed. It is so sad sometimes it takes hours to get them to get something in, but persistance wins and I can get a very large majority of them to recover.

Taking into account where the coral is being placed is important.
 
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HuduVudu

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Thinking back, this statement isn't entirely true....I did feed a pink tubastrea coral and some acans. And they died. So the only two LPS I have ever fed is the only LPS I have killed. The other 50 or so have all been thriving for years without any feeding.
I don't know why you would say this?

Why would you not feed Tubastrea they aren't photosynthetic? I don't think being hyperbolic is really helping to make your point.
 
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Lavey29

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I don't know why you would say this?

Why would you not feed Tubastrea they aren't photosynthetic? I don't think being hyperbolic is really helping to make your point.
The point he is making is you do not need to feed directly to LPS corals to be successful so your previous statement is not accurate. What works for you does not mean it is applicable to everyone.
 
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HuduVudu

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The point he is making is you do not need to feed directly to LPS corals to be successful so your previous statement is not accurate. What works for you does not mean it is applicable to everyone.
Tubastrea?

This is just a flame war and I am out.
 
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ApoIsland

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I don't know why you would say this?

Why would you not feed Tubastrea they aren't photosynthetic? I don't think being hyperbolic is really helping to make your point.
You are correct that was an unnecessary low dig in the second post that I made in poor taste. My apologies to you and the group here.

And I do see your point and agree that a severely neglected LPS coral in a tank totally void of nutrients would benefit from a little food. This is not the case in most situations though. For every one bleached coral you get at a discounted price I'm sure there are hundreds sold that are just fine.

The statement that "Almost all LPS need to be fed directly", in the context that you delivered it, is completely false however. Very few LPS corals need to be fed in most tanks. Only in tanks devoid of nutrients, where the coral is in visible decline, do they need to be fed directly.
 
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noobreefer2

noobreefer2

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Hey everyone, I'm ordering my Neophos and Neonitro now, and I was going to pick up some coral food right now.

Right now I have this food: https://agcorefishfood.com/store/p20/LPS_Coral_Powder_2_oz_.html
the contents is a fine green powder, and it is made of Zooplankton, and spirulina.

My corals are:
-Mayan moon favia (dying)
-Red cyphatrea
-GSP
-Green hammer
-Lavender Duncan
-Chalice (dying)
-Micrommussa

What are some foods that you could recommend for boosting coral health? Do I need other additives? Do I need to get more food or is the stuff I have fine?

Thanks everyone.
 
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noobreefer2

noobreefer2

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Nitrates are rising! Phosphates are at 0 :( I need to get that neophos soon. Hammer has pretty much all skeleton showing , I did a manual removal of a lot of the algae, and dipped hammer in H2O2.

Nitrate: 1-2
Phos: 0
Cal: 450
Alk: 9
Mag: 1350

Hopefully this will work out. Thanks everyone.
 
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vetteguy53081

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Not sure where this info is coming from but dont fret on nitrates- Phosphates somewhat. Focus on light, water flow and calcium - often why they recede. Like most other coral species, Euphyllia requires Stable tank conditions, and is intolerant to major swings in water quality, and is sensitive to almost any level of copper in the water. Since they are a large polyp stony coral, calcium and alkalinity are two very important water parameters that will affect the growth of your coral. This coral will start to die off if the calcium levels are too low. A calcium level of about 400 ppm is just right.
This coral species isn’t terribly picky when it comes to the proper placement in your tank. The trick would really be just to avoid the extremes. Avoid extremely bright locations or areas of very high current, and avoid areas that are too dark or with currents that are too low. Fast currents risk damaging the soft, fleshy polyps (and getting an infection). Bright lights will cause bleaching. Insufficient lighting will cause the poor coral to wither away and starve to death.
Hammer corals only require a moderate amount of light for photosynthesis and can grow well in the intermediate regions of your tank. Just about any reef LED lighting should be sufficient for most tanks. Reduce white light intensity and get it off the sand bed which sand can irritate it.
The polyps should sway in the current, but not sustain so much pressure they are constantly bent over their skeleton. Too much flow will tear the polyps (worst case) and cause the polyps do not extend in the first place (best case). So, don’t give them too much flow.
R%egarding arguments on feeding - I broadcast and get better results than direct feeding. Hammer corals are more subdued eaters who would benefit from the occasional feeding of a meaty marine food like mysis and brine shrimp.
Here are some of mine- Just Some:

660g 3.30d.jpg
660g 3.30a.jpg
 
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noobreefer2

noobreefer2

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Not sure where this info is coming from but dont fret on nitrates- Phosphates somewhat. Focus on light, water flow and calcium - often why they recede. Like most other coral species, Euphyllia requires Stable tank conditions, and is intolerant to major swings in water quality, and is sensitive to almost any level of copper in the water. Since they are a large polyp stony coral, calcium and alkalinity are two very important water parameters that will affect the growth of your coral. This coral will start to die off if the calcium levels are too low. A calcium level of about 400 ppm is just right.
This coral species isn’t terribly picky when it comes to the proper placement in your tank. The trick would really be just to avoid the extremes. Avoid extremely bright locations or areas of very high current, and avoid areas that are too dark or with currents that are too low. Fast currents risk damaging the soft, fleshy polyps (and getting an infection). Bright lights will cause bleaching. Insufficient lighting will cause the poor coral to wither away and starve to death.
Hammer corals only require a moderate amount of light for photosynthesis and can grow well in the intermediate regions of your tank. Just about any reef LED lighting should be sufficient for most tanks. Reduce white light intensity and get it off the sand bed which sand can irritate it.
The polyps should sway in the current, but not sustain so much pressure they are constantly bent over their skeleton. Too much flow will tear the polyps (worst case) and cause the polyps do not extend in the first place (best case). So, don’t give them too much flow.
R%egarding arguments on feeding - I broadcast and get better results than direct feeding. Hammer corals are more subdued eaters who would benefit from the occasional feeding of a meaty marine food like mysis and brine shrimp.
Here are some of mine- Just Some:

660g 3.30d.jpg
660g 3.30a.jpg
Thanks Vetteguy, I have a calcium level of about 450 right now, should I lower it to 400? If so, how slowly? I'll check my par charts to see the intensity it is receiving, the flow that the hammer is receiving is relatively slow, I have been spot feeding the hammer this food: https://agcorefishfood.com/store/p20/LPS_Coral_Powder_2_oz_.html (at night). What are your tanks targeted parameters?

Thanks for the informative response, its much appreciated.
 
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vetteguy53081

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Thanks Vetteguy, I have a calcium level of about 450 right now, should I lower it to 400? If so, how slowly? I'll check my par charts to see the intensity it is receiving, the flow that the hammer is receiving is relatively slow, I have been spot feeding the hammer this food: https://agcorefishfood.com/store/p20/LPS_Coral_Powder_2_oz_.html (at night). What are your tanks targeted parameters?

Thanks for the informative response, its much appreciated.
let it lower itself tp 400-420 by adding less. More critical is LOW calcium. The planktonic powdered foods are not for hammers. Meaty such as small plankton, brine shrimp and mysis shrimp. Also add aminos to tank weekly

Mine- which one . . . LOL
The ones with hammer:

Temp 78
ph 8.18
salinity 1.025
nitrate 7
phos .02
Ammonia .01
mG 1312
Alk 10
CA 446
 
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