Has anyone seen the Netflix film Chasing Coral

BRS
Status
Not open for further replies.

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I'm regreting getting into this conversation even before I write a reply.

I have watched the documentary.
It tragic to see and shows something that many of us have read many times about, but probably never seen. Will corals be extint in a few years? Unlikely. Could they look very very different from what they look now? probably. And probably a lot less then what we have now.

However, much more depressing than watching the documentary is coming to a forum like this and seeing the sheer amount of people than so easely desmiss climate change as a hox or non human caused, despite the overwelming evidence in favor of it.
With so many people disregarding the issue as "not really our fault" I'm afraid solving it will be impossible.
 
Maxout

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Guys, this planet has been around for billions of years. The climate has been doing it's own thing the whole time. Once humans started polluting, they started disrupting the climate, but are humans worse than the volcanoes that spewed for years in the Russian arctic area millions of years ago??

I don't know, but I do know that the climate will keep doing it's thing until the planet is consumed by the sun.
Probably we are, has we seem to be warming the plannet faster then ever before.
 

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
If I lived in Denver(altitude ~5000 ft) and said the boiling point of water was 94.5 C and I argued with someone who lived in miami(altitude ~3 ft) and said it boiled at 100 C. Who would be right? Both would be. Even with this simple science experiment there is a variable that you may not have considered. Given these complex systems it is millions of times harder to predict outcomes as there are so many more variables to consider.

I worked in the industry for 15 years, I even have my name attached to a paper or two. Might make me more informed on certain aspects, but it does not make me God. I don't have all the answers, nor am I willing to be so dismissive to ideas that may contradict what I believe is correct. That basically is the antithesis of the scientific principle. We should embrace new ideas and have the authors support it with data and then have someone attempt to reproduce it.

Sadly, the science field isn't much different than this message board. The science field is filled with people with their own agendas, producing crap so they have a job or produce a paper so they can get paid. The back biting, the politicking, the sexism, the infighting because of personal slights exists just in much in academia as it does on message boards, actually even moreso.



I feel as though the internet, more specifically search engines have failed us. We act more intelligent than we are, a world of information at our fingertips, ranked by the masses as to what they feel is the most correct. measurement bias at it's root through and through. Yet we argue for what? our own pride? To be right? To rationalize our choices? To be first? To be heard?


I watched the show, lamented the loss of those beautiful reefs. Vowed to see a few before every last one was gone. Then soon after I was utterly confused and humbled as another study questioned the rate at which the reefs would go extinct.

I chuckle to know that one day, humanity will laugh at my attempts at science. I will be as outdated as those who once "cured" people by blood letting.

Is it possible? Can we stop the name calling? Can we admit our own bias? Can we proclaim together that we are all ignorant about something? Can we have the wisdom to listen to a different viewpoint at times? Can we humble ourselves enough to know "The more you know, the more you know you don't know."?
Hi littlebeard
You make really good points and the article you shared is quiet interesting.

However, in many ways, the last paragraph of the article says, to some degree, the same as the documentary. If we do nothing and do not reduce our impact on the planet, there will eventually be mass extinxtions of corals:
"Given the huge size of these coral populations, it is very unlikely that they face imminent extinction. There is still time to protect them from anthropogenic heating, but only if we act quickly on reducing greenhouse gas emissions."
 

NashobaTek

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
3,001
Reaction score
7,776
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Probably we are, has we seem to be warming the plannet faster then ever before.
But are we?? How do you know for sure.

I read a article a few months ago by a climatologist who stated that we're still in a ice age because the polar caps are still covered in ice.
This planet has been through a lot of cycles and we are but a small part of it. A destructive part of it.

Earth has been a water planet, a snowball planet and a very hot planet in the history of the planet.
We're not innocent but I don't think we are the sole cause.
 

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Wasn't it in 1990 that they predicted Florida underwater by 2000? In 2018, some environmentalists hired an icebreaker to go to the South pole in it's winter time to "prove" the ice was thinner....guess what? They got stuck! Had to get another icebreaker to get them out.
You can't sail to the south pole. Its a continent, not just ice ;)
 
AS

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
In the 1970s many articles about over population. Today we have declining populations.

In the 1980s many articles about not having enough food to feed the world. Today rarely hear about world hunger.

In the 1990s many articles about running out of oil. Today theres fracking and many natural alternative energies.

I just don’t know what to believe anymore!
The population is still growing and predicted to reach 9 billion people in less the 20 years.... and that is with the world's most populated country restricting birth rates for the last 40 years.

Over 600 milliion people in the world (almost 10%) are already malnourished. If the population continuos to grow, food limitation could become a problem for many others.

The oil is probably the only one you are right about.

Belive the science and check how it was conducted, when and based on what info.
 

NeonRabbit221B

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Jun 21, 2019
Messages
2,832
Reaction score
5,274
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Harrisonburg, Va
But are we?? How do you know for sure.

I read a article a few months ago by a climatologist who stated that we're still in a ice age because the polar caps are still covered in ice.
This planet has been through a lot of cycles and we are but a small part of it. A destructive part of it.

Earth has been a water planet, a snowball planet and a very hot planet in the history of the planet.
We're not innocent but I don't think we are the sole cause.
You sure fill your posts with a lot of "I think" statements but lack the data to support any declarative statement. The good news is that climatologists don't base research on feelings and the data is well outlined. Im glad this forum sticks to reef topics lol
 

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
But are we?? How do you know for sure.

I read a article a few months ago by a climatologist who stated that we're still in a ice age because the polar caps are still covered in ice.
This planet has been through a lot of cycles and we are but a small part of it. A destructive part of it.

Earth has been a water planet, a snowball planet and a very hot planet in the history of the planet.
We're not innocent but I don't think we are the sole cause.
You are right. The planet has been both warmer and colder before. And it will probably be again in the future.
The problem is the rate of change. As far as we can measure it, it has never changed so rapdly.
 

NashobaTek

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
3,001
Reaction score
7,776
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
You sure fill your posts with a lot of "I think" statements but lack the data to support any declarative statement. The good news is that climatologists don't base research on feelings and the data is well outlined. Im glad this forum sticks to reef topics lol
How's that? I wasn't declaring anything, simply made a statement about a article I read.

But comments like this are why I rarely talk.
 
Avast

Nigel35

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Jun 9, 2020
Messages
702
Reaction score
569
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I'm regreting getting into this conversation even before I write a reply.

I have watched the documentary.
It tragic to see and shows something that many of us have read many times about, but probably never seen. Will corals be extint in a few years? Unlikely. Could they look very very different from what they look now? probably. And probably a lot less then what we have now.

However, much more depressing than watching the documentary is coming to a forum like this and seeing the sheer amount of people than so easely desmiss climate change as a hox or non human caused, despite the overwelming evidence in favor of it.
With so many people disregarding the issue as "not really our fault" I'm afraid solving it will be impossible.
I couldn't agree more. Things will probably look different in the years to come but that doesn't mean that all coral reefs will become extinct. As others stated, I am totally for environmentalism and creating a cleaner and more beautiful world but when it becomes a matter of religion to "saving the planet" you must draw the line there. Saving the planet or coral reefs or whatever at the cost of human life is absolutely wrong and criminal.
 

NeonRabbit221B

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Jun 21, 2019
Messages
2,832
Reaction score
5,274
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Harrisonburg, Va
How's that? I wasn't declaring anything, simply made a statement about a article I read.

But comments like this are why I rarely talk.
My point was that saying "I think we are not the sole cause" was the problematic statement. Science is fairly unbiased in that sense.

Sorry for my abrasive comments. Idk why I wandered into this thread.
 

Nigel35

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Jun 9, 2020
Messages
702
Reaction score
569
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Is it possible (and I say this entirely willing to be corrected) that the earth's global average temperature can go through phases? Some scientists believe that during the Middle Ages the earth was much warmer than it is today. Maybe it isn't global warming but just temperature fluctuation. Much akin to El Nino and La Nina
 

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
The really interesting part is that they are blaming it on temps that are rising by nearly immeasurable amounts and then contrasted against good guesses as to what the temps were in the past.
There is no dang way that a 1/10 of a degree ocean temp increase over 100, 50, or even 10 years is killing coral.

Question everything. Especially en Vogue scientific claims made or endorsed by any government.
Step by step.
The ocean as warmed by about 1 to 1.5C over the last century. That alone is obviously not killing the corals.

However lets use our tanks as an exemple. if the temperature in you reef tank is 25 degress celcius all is fine. If warm wether comes along and your chiller isn't working and the temperature raises by 2 degrees (27C) your tank is probably going to be fine until it cools down again. However, if the base temperature is already 26 to start with, then you are now pushing 28. oNt sure most corals are going to like it.
If on top of that, the higher average global temperatures are higher, the that 2C increase may actuall be a 3 degree incress.

See how it works?
 
Fritz

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I don't subscribe to the propoganda. Working in the IT Project Management world, I realize that many just want sound bites, they don't want the whole story. The cliff notes, not the book. Many of my 2 sentence summaries that my work has asked me to provide boil 6 months or a year's worth of work into 2 sentence sound bites.

I think of climate change the same way. A catchy two word phrase that means little without the nerdy scientific details.

Do I think our climates are changing? Of course. They always have! We had the ice age, we've had the volcanic age, we've had many changes in our climate. A two hundred or heck even a 1000 year span of tracking weather does not equate to tracking climate change.

Not when we're talking about changes over millions of years. I had seen a story on the fact that the sun may have seasons. This would impact all planets in the solar system. These seasons could last years then shift. The earth may have broader seasons than just the four annual seasons. Seasons that last tens of thousands of years. If we're at the tail end of one longer term season and shifting to a new one over the next 100 years? Then yes, we'll probably see dramatic shifts.

Do I believe climate change is caused by humanity. I believe there's some evidence to support it is. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle that maybe 15-25% of our climate change is human caused the other 75 to 85% is caused by the sun and planetary changes that have been happening for millions of years.
Can you point me to the info regarding planetary changes and the sun? Everything I can find says that we are actually moving away (not in a relevant time scale for this discussion)
 

KimG

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
201
Reaction score
247
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I don’t think it’s about the oil companies I think it’s because the media and government have been pushing environmental doom since the 70’s. They have gone so far as to pure dates and timelines on the end of the planet. None of it ever comes to fruition, ever. Meanwhile the people pushing it are getting rich by doing it. If science says global warming is a sham, those research dollars go away.
This isn’t to say there isn’t something of concern here. It is to say that it has been monetized and propagandize to the point of saturation and disbelief for many.
Unfortunately, once you frame it like that there is not discussion or debate.

If you make all science to be a sham and about money, than you can dismiss any piece of scientific data upfront.
Independently if it was collected in america, or china, or russia, or europe, or any other places (incidentally the data used for the models and reports comes from all over the world).
Therefore it doesn't really look like you want a serious debate with actuall facts and figures.

But even to this point. Science can be funded by many ways and many companies with interests in both sides. And even despite this, finding a peer reviewed scientific article with any scientific prof that we aren't the cause of climate change is almost impossible. That should tell you something.
 

Grumblez

Community Member
View Badges
Joined
May 16, 2021
Messages
84
Reaction score
109
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Roanoke
I couldn't agree more. Things will probably look different in the years to come but that doesn't mean that all coral reefs will become extinct. As others stated, I am totally for environmentalism and creating a cleaner and more beautiful world but when it becomes a matter of religion to "saving the planet" you must draw the line there. Saving the planet or coral reefs or whatever at the cost of human life is absolutely wrong and criminal.

???
Who is saving Coral Reefs/ the planet at the cost of Human lives? It's a interesting topic to bring up though. As with most things there's generally 2 paths, the short term path of greater immediate profit and long term path of sustainability.
 
Aquarium Specialty - dry goods & marine livestock
Status
Not open for further replies.
BRS

What's the main reason you take on DIY reefing projects?

  • Save Money

    Votes: 108 34.7%
  • You Like To Make Things

    Votes: 109 35.0%
  • Necessity, you want it a certain way

    Votes: 78 25.1%
  • Time, you need it quick

    Votes: 5 1.6%
  • Other (please explain)

    Votes: 11 3.5%
noopsyche
Top