Has the hobby gotten too expensive and how does it compare to the past?
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alton
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It was called Aquarium Sales and Service owned by Ken Koehler and Mike S. The only store in SA that would QT fish before placing them in display tanks . They had a small store on Mannix and Broadway and then opened the large store on Blanco before the economy dumped in 2001 and closed. One or two of the employees ended up in Austin working for Aquatek. Today Ken still does service, and the nicest guy you want to ever meet. For 35+ years he has taken care of my bosses tanks. Sorry if I got off topic.
I too, have been in the saltwater hobby for many years. Freshwater a few more years yet. My first saltwater tank was in 1977. I remember when FAMA was the new magazine to get. ( I am a hoarder of information and still prefer a hard copy to a digital copy when being used for reference) I still have the most of those back issues of FAMA in binders. Something I should probably sell to a collector. Tropical Fish Hobbiest was the only magazine I remember from before that.
I worked in a LFS in Chicago suburbs back then. It was a sizeable store for fish. We had approximately 100 tanks of SW. and about 400 tanks of FW.
Like others, no one kept coral. It was undergravel filters, and/or an external box filter. Eheim was around then and were considered to be the ultimate in equipment. Perfecto brand aquariums were the number one company for aquariums. We used typically used dolmite for gravel. The pH was a constant 8.2. It never varied.
Damsels were $3.99 to $5. Percula clowns were $5.99. I can remember seeing pics of purple tangs and thinking I would love to have one. I was told they were $400 money upfront. Arrive alive was not gauranteed. baby clown triggers 1-2" were $95. Juvenile Imprerator angels maybe a bit more. Queen and French angels started at $15 for juveniles. Tinkerii butterflies were around $100.
Also, the LFS biggest SW supplier was Walt Smith. The amount of butterfly fish brought in was incredible.
Many fish came out of the Phillipines when cyanide was in used to catch many fish. You never knew though if your fish was collected that way. If the fish ate and didn't have any visible parasites (ich and Oodinium,flukes) you bought him.
Anyway, some of my trip down memory lane.
I worked in a LFS in Chicago suburbs back then. It was a sizeable store for fish. We had approximately 100 tanks of SW. and about 400 tanks of FW.
Like others, no one kept coral. It was undergravel filters, and/or an external box filter. Eheim was around then and were considered to be the ultimate in equipment. Perfecto brand aquariums were the number one company for aquariums. We used typically used dolmite for gravel. The pH was a constant 8.2. It never varied.
Damsels were $3.99 to $5. Percula clowns were $5.99. I can remember seeing pics of purple tangs and thinking I would love to have one. I was told they were $400 money upfront. Arrive alive was not gauranteed. baby clown triggers 1-2" were $95. Juvenile Imprerator angels maybe a bit more. Queen and French angels started at $15 for juveniles. Tinkerii butterflies were around $100.
Also, the LFS biggest SW supplier was Walt Smith. The amount of butterfly fish brought in was incredible.
Many fish came out of the Phillipines when cyanide was in used to catch many fish. You never knew though if your fish was collected that way. If the fish ate and didn't have any visible parasites (ich and Oodinium,flukes) you bought him.
Anyway, some of my trip down memory lane.
Most shocking part of the article was being reminded that 1998 was 20 years ago.............................*sigh*
I should swing by ocean gallery later and check out what the increase has been in terms of percent.
I should swing by ocean gallery later and check out what the increase has been in terms of percent.
roberthu526
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I just want to say that a month ago I bought a Mavic Pro for $670. It flies for over 25 minutes and maintains control within 2 miles while shooting 4K quality camera. And it only cost $675. That is less than a high end LED or powerhead in this hobby. That is the moment I realize that I have spent too much and it is crazy how everything is priced in this industry. Not saying I am quitting the hobby yet but it was definitely a wake up call. Now I am looking at this reefing hobby from a different angel and it really helps me to cool down when making some decisions.
I started 35 + yrs ago when Yellow Tangs were $10.00, and Flame Angels were $50.00. Today, those fish are $30 and $50. respectively here on the East Coast. Prices have changed, but quality is superior to products of the past. Our hobby is still as expensive as you want it to be. I’m running 3 tanks now, and my local tank is as cheap to run as it gets. Passion is where the costs explode. Own a boat, get the itch, and watch the money fly.
Dogtown
Active Member
According to the US Inflation Calculator at http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/, the increase since 1998 is actually 52%. This is an expensive hobby, no doubt, but today's prices are ultimately driven by supply and demand.
lolgranny
Well-Known Member
Why are you comparing a drone to a grow light? Lol You can spend a lot more on a higher end one if you wanted to, as well as spending a lot less on a powerhead or a different grow light.
It’s a hobby, it’s as expensive as you make it. You have dogs or cats? They are expensive, but they bring you joy. Horses? Just board alone for one is much more then this hobby. Cars? Guns? Boats? Vacations? We can compare this to the price of anything we do as a hobby but at the end of the day the money you spend on something you love shouldn’t matter unless you can’t afford to pay your bills
SFKINNC
Community Member
Great article! Thanks!
I have kept fish since I was 10 years old (With a short break for college.). I am 69 now. Yes, prices have risen. A candy bar back then cost a nickel. Ground beef was 39 cents a pound! Yes, prices have risen.
When saltwater became possible, equipment was not as sophisticated. Now there is more “stuff” under your tank than there was under Buzz Aldrin when he rode a rocket to the moon. 60 years ago, I did my shopping at the LFS. The LFS is gone, closed, forced out of business. Today, the LFS is Petsmart or Petco. There is no really decent-sized LFS within driving distance of my home. For saltwater, only Petco carries a few fish and corals. The result is that reefkeeping means shopping online. Shopping online means buying sight unseen (WYSIWYG notwithstanding, what you see online may look very different when you open the box.). Added expense, of course, is the Overnight Air shipping and the unreliability of some common delivery “services.” (Frozen fish don’t just come from the grocery store.) Even “free shipping” really means only that it is included in the overall price because the price of shipping is shared among all the customers, and that includes you. I miss the LFS.
I have kept fish since I was 10 years old (With a short break for college.). I am 69 now. Yes, prices have risen. A candy bar back then cost a nickel. Ground beef was 39 cents a pound! Yes, prices have risen.
When saltwater became possible, equipment was not as sophisticated. Now there is more “stuff” under your tank than there was under Buzz Aldrin when he rode a rocket to the moon. 60 years ago, I did my shopping at the LFS. The LFS is gone, closed, forced out of business. Today, the LFS is Petsmart or Petco. There is no really decent-sized LFS within driving distance of my home. For saltwater, only Petco carries a few fish and corals. The result is that reefkeeping means shopping online. Shopping online means buying sight unseen (WYSIWYG notwithstanding, what you see online may look very different when you open the box.). Added expense, of course, is the Overnight Air shipping and the unreliability of some common delivery “services.” (Frozen fish don’t just come from the grocery store.) Even “free shipping” really means only that it is included in the overall price because the price of shipping is shared among all the customers, and that includes you. I miss the LFS.
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This is a flawed way of comparing costs. It's not even remotely the same market. There are fixed costs to developing a product before any variable costs. If the LED cost $1m to develop, but only had a market potential of 11 units, you'd need to sell them for $100k a piece to recover your fixed costs and make a 10% profit (assuming zero variable costs). If the drone cost $1m to develop but you could sell 100k units, you could sell them for $11 to recover your fixed costs and make a 10% profit. Never mind the dozens of other variables we are ignoring.
Forsaken77
Valuable Member
You know what is also different now compared to back in the day.... Longevity of equipment.
I had a tank setup for 7 years in the 90's and not one pump, heater or anything failed on me. I never had a voltage issue either. Companies make equipment that is semi disposable, even though it costs so much. Even those cheap little powerheads that rotated lasted forever. Some of my equipment even transitioned from my freshwater tank of 2 years before the saltwater. Now, things break down all the time. I was never concerned about warranties back then.
But this trend has evolved into almost every market. It's similar thinking to "why cure a disease when there's more money in maintaining & treating it?"
I had a tank setup for 7 years in the 90's and not one pump, heater or anything failed on me. I never had a voltage issue either. Companies make equipment that is semi disposable, even though it costs so much. Even those cheap little powerheads that rotated lasted forever. Some of my equipment even transitioned from my freshwater tank of 2 years before the saltwater. Now, things break down all the time. I was never concerned about warranties back then.
But this trend has evolved into almost every market. It's similar thinking to "why cure a disease when there's more money in maintaining & treating it?"
Forsaken77
Valuable Member
My theory on why prices went up so dramatically....
In the 90's you would pay a cheap price for, pretty much, a well developed coral. Nowadays people will spend hundreds of dollars on a quarter-sized frag. Businesses see this and realize that if they're willing to spend that much on a frag, then they will have no problem spending even more to keep those frags alive.
I think the price of livestock has a direct influence on the price of hardware to maintain that livestock.
If the corals where all under $50, then the equipment prices would fall because no one would be willing to spend so much on equipment for something that can be replaced for a few bucks.
People's demand for things, and the ridiculous prices they are willing to pay, has created this market we're now stuck with.
In the 90's you would pay a cheap price for, pretty much, a well developed coral. Nowadays people will spend hundreds of dollars on a quarter-sized frag. Businesses see this and realize that if they're willing to spend that much on a frag, then they will have no problem spending even more to keep those frags alive.
I think the price of livestock has a direct influence on the price of hardware to maintain that livestock.
If the corals where all under $50, then the equipment prices would fall because no one would be willing to spend so much on equipment for something that can be replaced for a few bucks.
People's demand for things, and the ridiculous prices they are willing to pay, has created this market we're now stuck with.
Ferrell
Valuable Member
Great article and a very enjoyable read and brought back lots of memories. Thank you!
For a point of reference, I was a fish keeper for some years before coral keeping was more than just an experiment and the equipment was evolving towards those ends. My “last” tank back then was bought and set up at the beginning of the bioballs craze (which I still have for some reason), wet/dry filtration and counter current skimmers. Due to circumstances I have been out of the hobby for many years, prob 20+ now that I think back, and yes it’s changed but good husbandry hasn’t. Only the availability of info via internet and sources like R2R, access to rapid mail order and more selection has changed. Wages have risen with COG so that’s kind of a nil point in the whole scheme.
I’m back in the hobby and wished I could’ve continued it when I had to take a hiatus. It’s better than I remember and more enjoyable !!!
For a point of reference, I was a fish keeper for some years before coral keeping was more than just an experiment and the equipment was evolving towards those ends. My “last” tank back then was bought and set up at the beginning of the bioballs craze (which I still have for some reason), wet/dry filtration and counter current skimmers. Due to circumstances I have been out of the hobby for many years, prob 20+ now that I think back, and yes it’s changed but good husbandry hasn’t. Only the availability of info via internet and sources like R2R, access to rapid mail order and more selection has changed. Wages have risen with COG so that’s kind of a nil point in the whole scheme.
I’m back in the hobby and wished I could’ve continued it when I had to take a hiatus. It’s better than I remember and more enjoyable !!!
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1998 RO/DI - 199.99
2018 RO/DI - 350
Are you kidding me?
https://www.marineandreef.com/Aquat...MItcecze-G2gIVCLjACh1ldgXTEAQYASABEgIYC_D_BwE
I know plenty of people that us the new Aquaticlife RO/DI which is 129.99 and they love it.
It is easier to use than other units on the market too.
Why on earth would you pay 350 for and ro/di unit?
2018 RO/DI - 350
Are you kidding me?
https://www.marineandreef.com/Aquat...MItcecze-G2gIVCLjACh1ldgXTEAQYASABEgIYC_D_BwE
I know plenty of people that us the new Aquaticlife RO/DI which is 129.99 and they love it.
It is easier to use than other units on the market too.
Why on earth would you pay 350 for and ro/di unit?
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Prices maybe more (In General) now than 1998 if you are buying brand new at your LFS.
With Craigslist and Facebook and other reefing sites today people get out of the hobby and sell tanks super cheap.
I see them like 10 to 20 cents on the dollar.
So if you are that concerned about money buy used.
It will be a Fraction of the Price of 2018 or 1998 Prices.
This was not the case in 1988.
There are alot more options today too.
We are waaaaay better off now than we were back then,
I really hate when people write stuff like this it is always Doom and Gloom.
This Hobby is so Expensive, Blah, Blah, Blah.
All this type of talk does is scare new people away from getting into the Hobby.
People need to start talking about how much easier it is to Reef Nowadays due to Advancements in Technology and Better Knowledge of Reefing as a Whole.
Rather than complain about high prices.
This does a great disservice to the Hobby and Needs to Stop.
Seems like I am the only one that thinks about the future and stuff like that unfortunatley
Lets focus on getting more people into than hobby instead of scarring them away people.
With Craigslist and Facebook and other reefing sites today people get out of the hobby and sell tanks super cheap.
I see them like 10 to 20 cents on the dollar.
So if you are that concerned about money buy used.
It will be a Fraction of the Price of 2018 or 1998 Prices.
This was not the case in 1988.
There are alot more options today too.
We are waaaaay better off now than we were back then,
I really hate when people write stuff like this it is always Doom and Gloom.
This Hobby is so Expensive, Blah, Blah, Blah.
All this type of talk does is scare new people away from getting into the Hobby.
People need to start talking about how much easier it is to Reef Nowadays due to Advancements in Technology and Better Knowledge of Reefing as a Whole.
Rather than complain about high prices.
This does a great disservice to the Hobby and Needs to Stop.
Seems like I am the only one that thinks about the future and stuff like that unfortunatley
Lets focus on getting more people into than hobby instead of scarring them away people.
Willragan
Well-Known Member
Imo you can successfully keep a reef tank on a budget if you do not get caught up in the label war lol. This applies to livestock and equipment. You can build a beautiful tank with healthy corals using hardy species and simple, generic equipment. I know this because i see these tanks all the time. However, if you want the most exclusive acro frags or the rarest fish you are going to have to spend ALOT more money on livestock and if you want those frags to look like they do in the vendors tanks you are also going to have to spend alot more money on equipment or you are gonna have a bunch of $500 brown and green frags. That last part is my opinion and someone may well post pics to prove me wrong but i do not generally see colored up homewreckers in tanks with $100 chinese black box lighting. So i think alot of it is what you want. Do you want an aesthetically stunning tank your nonreefer friends will ooh and ah at or do you want a collection of exclusive acros that folks on this forum will jawdrop for? The 2 require amazingly different levels of time and monetary commitmeny imo. I am not gonna say that anyone is making the hobby too expensive with designer names because no one has a gun to anyone's head making them dump a grand on a frag. The demand is there or the price would not hold. Its the same with every other hobby or passion in the world. You can go out and shoot a 75 round of golf with alot of talent and a $50 driver(golfers please do not crucify me this is an example and i dont play golf) or you can spend $800 on a driver and shoot a 72 with same said talent. A guy came by my shop selling a $6000 set of KITCHEN KNIVES(which made me practically s@!t my pants) and i bought my wife a $150 set of frontier woman(or some such s#!$) at walmart and they both cut up tomatoes just fine i am sure. So its all in what you want. Personal choice i would call it hobbyist vs collector. Do i personally think it is crazy to buy coral for $1000 an inch? Absolutely. Do i do it everyday? Absolutely. LOL!
srad750c
Well-Known Member
Prices maybe more (In General) now than 1998 if you are buying brand new at your LFS.
With Craigslist and Facebook and other reefing sites today people get out of the hobby and sell tanks super cheap.
I see them like 10 to 20 cents on the dollar.
So if you are that concerned about money buy used.
It will be a Fraction of the Price of 2018 or 1998 Prices.
This was not the case in 1988.
There are alot more options today too.
We are waaaaay better off now than we were back then,
I really hate when people write stuff like this it is always Doom and Gloom.
This Hobby is so Expensive, Blah, Blah, Blah.
All this type of talk does is scare new people away from getting into the Hobby.
People need to start talking about how much easier it is to Reef Nowadays due to Advancements in Technology and Better Knowledge of Reefing as a Whole.
Rather than complain about high prices.
This does a great disservice to the Hobby and Needs to Stop.
Seems like I am the only one that thinks about the future and stuff like that unfortunatley
Lets focus on getting more people into than hobby instead of scarring them away people.
I stopped buying used a long time ago, most times you’re buying someone else’s headaches, especially since equipment is not as good as it was back in the day. So far so good with new. But d.... it’s expensive.
danreefman
Valuable Member
Hobby is relevant. Dollar is worth nothing in whatever you buy. Especially in the bay area.
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