Hippo tang = ich

[benmed]

I have to assume this is ich… did not notice it yesterday. The clown fish seem to be okay but hard to tell on their white body. The hippo has been in about 4 weeks and the clown fish about 6.

This hippo and two clowns in a new tank (2.5 months since cycle). Also in the tank are one cleaner shrimp and one blood shrimp. There are 5 corals.

The fish were quarantined in copper before adding them but I did not quarantine the 5 corals (but I did dip them with revive). Only other thing I put into the tank is Chaeto from algae barn, sand from aquabiomics and rods fish food. I added the Chaeto and aquabiomics sand about a week ago so I assume that must be it.

questions:

1) anything else those white spots could be?

2) treatment options? I have a qt tank with copper up and running but not sure if there is any easier way than 76 days of the fish out of the tank… do the shrimp get to stay in the tank?
3) presumably the clown fish have to go into QT as well.
4) I have a UV sterilizer plumbed in, but have never turned it on because I kind of didn’t want to mess with it. Would it help or not really?

tank parameters if helpful (as of today):
Ph: 8 (apex)
Ammonia: 0 (api)
Alk: 9.2 (hanna)
Nitrate: 5 (nyos)
Calcium: 430 (Red Sea)

 

[vetteguy53081]

I have to assume this is ich… did not notice it yesterday. The clown fish seem to be okay but hard to tell on their white body. The hippo has been in about 4 weeks and the clown fish about 6.

This hippo and two clowns in a new tank (2.5 months since cycle). Also in the tank are one cleaner shrimp and one blood shrimp. There are 5 corals.

The fish were quarantined in copper before adding them but I did not quarantine the 5 corals (but I did dip them with revive). Only other thing I put into the tank is Chaeto from algae barn, sand from aquabiomics and rods fish food. I added the Chaeto and aquabiomics sand about a week ago so I assume that must be it.

questions:

1) anything else those white spots could be?

2) treatment options? I have a qt tank with copper up and running but not sure if there is any easier way than 76 days of the fish out of the tank… do the shrimp get to stay in the tank?
3) presumably the clown fish have to go into QT as well.
4) I have a UV sterilizer plumbed in, but have never turned it on because I kind of didn’t want to mess with it. Would it help or not really?

tank parameters if helpful (as of today):
Ph: 8 (apex)
Ammonia: 0 (api)
Alk: 9.2 (hanna)
Nitrate: 5 (nyos)
Calcium: 430 (Red Sea)

Yes, unfortunately Ich which is a parasite and needs to be treated in quarantine at your soonest. Best treatment would be coppersafe or general cure with coppersafe my choice at therapuetic level 2.25-2.5 monitored with a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna brand, not Api
Also monitor ammonia level with a reliable test kit during treatment and would not be a bad idea to add an air stone for added oxygen during treatment
You will also need to leave display tank FishLess (Fallow) for at least 6-8 weeks to assure the cysts and trophants have completed their life cycle without a host and have died off

 

[Lavey29]

While QT treatment is the best option. There are those that choose ich management instead for their DT. UV would help here.

 

[benmed]

dang. Well, I have the QT all set up and have copper power and the Hanna testers all ready to go. I bought them before to ward off the evil ich spirits, but I guess my voodoo didn’t work.

Is there anything else it could be or is this a slam dunk diagnosis? What is the natural history of leaving it untreated? 100% death?Nothing else it could be?
Finally, do the shrimp need to come out too? Or just the fish?

thanks for the help

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

Your title said it correctly. Hippo Tang = Ick. I've personally seen two go through a 45-day medicated quarantine and come out the other side and show ick. That's why my gang no longer has one.

 

[benmed]

Yes, unfortunately Ich which is a parasite and needs to be treated in quarantine at your soonest. Best treatment would be coppersafe or general cure with coppersafe my choice at therapuetic level 2.25-2.5 monitored with a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna brand, not Api
Also monitor ammonia level with a reliable test kit during treatment and would not be a bad idea to add an air stone for added oxygen during treatment
You will also need to leave display tank FishLess (Fallow) for at least 6-8 weeks to assure the cysts and trophants have completed their life cycle without a host and have died off

What is the success rate of a 6-8 week fallow period?

 

[Uncle99]

Not a very bad case IMM.
I’d wait, feed, and watch keeping stress low and waters stable.
If it progresses, then out fish come, shrimps can stay.
Copper, Hypo or TTM. Some do a 45 day fallow with an increase in temp.

 

[Lavey29]

Not a very bad case IMM.
I’d wait, feed, and watch keeping stress low and waters stable.
If it progresses, then out fish come, shrimps can stay.
Copper, Hypo or TTM. Some do a 45 day fallow with an increase in temp.

That's my impression also. Feed high quality frozen food and vitachem. I would dose a ciprofloaxin too just to help the immune system in case something else is going on.

 

[benmed]

Not a very bad case IMM.
I’d wait, feed, and watch keeping stress low and waters stable.
If it progresses, then out fish come,

Not a very bad case IMM.
I’d wait, feed, and watch keeping stress low and waters stable.
If it progresses, then out fish come, shrimps can stay.
Copper, Hypo or TTM. Some do a 45 day fallow with an increase in temp.

shrimps can stay.
Copper, Hypo or TTM. Some do a 45 day fallow with an increase in temp.

Yeah. I guess I’m ready to start a 6-8 week quarantine unless I’m sure that is the correct diagnosis

That's my impression also. Feed high quality frozen food and vitachem. I would dose a ciprofloaxin too just to help the immune system in case something else is going on.

safe to put antibiotics in a display tank with inverts and coral?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hippo tangs are prone to mucus plugs. At least 3 of the spots are too large to be ich and are likely plugs. The other spots are too small to tell. You should probably prepare to treat with copper or hyposalinity, and watch the spots - if they don’t change location over a day or two, it isn’t ich. If they do change numbers and location then ich is likely, and you’ll have a treatment ready to go.
Jay

 

[Lavey29]

Yeah. I guess I’m ready to start a 6-8 week quarantine unless I’m sure that is the correct diagnosis

safe to put antibiotics in a display tank with inverts and coral?

I've done it multiple times now with no issues.

 

[benmed]

Hippo tangs are prone to mucus plugs. At least 3 of the spots are too large to be ich and are likely plugs. The other spots are too small to tell. You should probably prepare to treat with copper or hyposalinity, and watch the spots - if they don’t change location over a day or two, it isn’t ich. If they do change numbers and location then ich is likely, and you’ll have a treatment ready to go.
Jay

This is exactly what I need to hear. I turned the heater on and added the copper with level at 2.29. I just didn’t want to drop the fish in there for 76 days right at the beginning of my return to aquariums after 10 years after seeing white spots one time.

Does mucous plugs suggest another problem in the tank or is it just acne for an angsty teenage fish?

 

[benmed]

Hippo tangs are prone to mucus plugs. At least 3 of the spots are too large to be ich and are likely plugs. The other spots are too small to tell. You should probably prepare to treat with copper or hyposalinity, and watch the spots - if they don’t change location over a day or two, it isn’t ich. If they do change numbers and location then ich is likely, and you’ll have a treatment ready to go.
Jay

https://www.reef2reef.com/attachments/fish-mucus-hemdal-pdf.1945498/

Found this article on mucus plugs floating around here? Maybe you’ve read it???

I kind of hope this is what the tang has, but I understand probably not.

in all seriousness, thank you for all the effort you put into helping provide the education to make us more successful (or not, as in my case)

 

[Sebastiancrab]

The article was written by Jay. He is the staff marine biologist. Trust his advice.

 

[benmed]

The article was written by Jay. He is the staff marine biologist. Trust his advice.

Yes. I know. That’s why I thanked him for all that he does

 

[Jay Hemdal]

This is exactly what I need to hear. I turned the heater on and added the copper with level at 2.29. I just didn’t want to drop the fish in there for 76 days right at the beginning of my return to aquariums after 10 years after seeing white spots one time.

Does mucous plugs suggest another problem in the tank or is it just acne for an angsty teenage fish?

I don't know what causes these mucus plugs - it is apparently due to some type of stress. I have noticed a number of cases that start up during and after copper treatments. Of course, that makes things interesting when an aquarist has a fish develop white spots on their fish right after a full copper treatment (ugh).

Jay

 

[Spare time]

That's my impression also. Feed high quality frozen food and vitachem. I would dose a ciprofloaxin too just to help the immune system in case something else is going on.

Arguably that could make things worse by having the fish's microbiome take a big hit.

 

[Lavey29]

Arguably that could make things worse by having the fish's microbiome take a big hit.

Seems at times normal protocols are not very effective so nothing wrong if one chooses an alternative but yes you need to be prepared for the outcome too. How many posts have you seen on here where people put their fish in full med treated 45 day QT before the DT only to see ich pop up. I'm a firm believer that ich is in every tank in some way shape or form albeit in a dormant state. Something stresses the fish lowering its immune capabilities and ich starts. People will try and determine how ich got there and default to coral or a snail being the source spreader. Some fish are much more prone to as you already know.

 

[benmed]

October 5, 2022

youtube.com

Here is a video of the tang if it helps the smarter folk figure out what it is

 

[benmed]

Also, I have noticed little white things all over the glass which I had never noticed before. I did add copepods about three weeks ago, but I have never seen them and assumed they died a glorious Valkyrie death in the skimmer when my first batch of Chaeto swam out of the refugium into the sump.