How do I get my zoas to grow nice and fat?

[AngryMike2016]

Says the guy arguing with EVERYTHING

 

[A. grandis]

Says the guy arguing with EVERYTHING

Bring something substantial to the thread, not wood to the fire!
Maybe you should change your name to start, AngryMike2016.

Edit: Everyone here sees the facts as they were posted and the video evidences.
Still no one is telling them that they are wrong or need to change. I'm not!
The facts won't change and the way we see things is what is relative to what we choose or believe. Are some of you willing to ignore the facts from all the videos I posted? If so, that's fine, really, but we don't have to be enemies because we disagree or prefer other methods. Cool off!

 

[CaliReefs]

I personally did the photography and the color correction for commercial images on many of the large online aquarium based pet stores, along with the care tips and descriptions. I used LEDs in all my photos.

I met with Kessil reps and so forth. I can share with you all that LEDS come in lots (bins), and the military gets the best of those, end user customers get mostly the bottom of the pickings.

 

[A. grandis]

I personally did the photography and the color correction for commercial images on many of the large online aquarium based pet stores, along with the care tips and descriptions. I used LEDs in all my photos.

I met with Kessil reps and so forth. I can share with you all that LEDS come in lots (bins), and the military gets the best of those, end user customers get mostly the bottom of the pickings.

and...
?

 

[CaliReefs]

I want to add that not all light, is usable light for coral. The argument that we need to replicate the fusion of the sun is a bogus argument. This is based on scientific research that can be accessed through peer reviewed scientific journals (if anyone is interested). People will find something that works based on their personal eco system (reef tank), it’s not a one size fits all, but there are standards of guidelines.

 

[A. grandis]

I want to add that not all light, is usable light for coral. The argument that we need to replicate the fusion of the sun is a bogus argument. This is based on scientific research that can be accessed through peer reviewed scientific journals (if anyone is interested). People will find something that works based on their personal eco system (reef tank), it’s not a one size fits all, but there are standards of guidelines.

Yes, "not all light is usable for coral".
Yes, no "need to replicate the fusion of the sun".
Yes, "people will find something that works based on their personal eco system".
I choose to beieve that you've meant the way those corals will look to their eyes.
Yes, "it’s not a one size fits all, but there are standards of guidelines".
All good.

 

[User1]

I didn't see anyone here saying there is only one way yet.

Let us just agree to disagree then. Probably easier that way.

 

[A. grandis]

Let us just agree to disagree then. Probably easier that way.

To me that is a nice way to stop the argument and, for some, to reject the facts I've posted, and simply disagree without a plausible reason. I had that excuse many times before and will accept your suggestion as a peaceful way to end conversation on the subject. All the evidences I've posted show my point and I had absolutely no response to those evidences from any of you who were so defensive/aggressive responding to those posts, but you really can't engage in a true rational conversation about my points. I hope you guys just consider those videos/info one day. I know I didn't waste my time here because many were just watching and they most likely will be searching more about the subject to find even more proof of what I've wrote here. This will be a great tool in the search engine too.
Cheers.

 

[A. grandis]

I'll say this: because I see what I believe as the truth, based in the fact of results and using those videos as part of some evidence, I want to share those and publish for the benefit of others.
To tolerate is to pretend that we all agree to one only thought and go on with our lives without trying to assimilate, living the lie, or ignoring the facts all together.
I'm glad we can disagree and expose our thoughts and I hope that wouldn't necessarily bring any hard feeling among us. This is what free speech is about. Let's get busy working and have a great week folks.

 

[Stigigemla]

I think it is only 2 posts here that is very valuable for the OP.

Thats Skimjim in post 70 and the video in post 72.
Skimjim points the fact that Zoas are different and have different needs.
The video shows examples of that from a tank. I dont think any of them consider themselves as experts. They just want to share their experiences.

There are many Zoas near the water surface and in the tidal zone. It is a good advice to try them first in a very high light with a sun like spectrum.

But there are other zoas coming from 50 feet or deeper. It is a good advice to try them first in blueish light of 50 to 100 PAR.

In my experience Zoas go best with low or very low skimming and some nitrate and phosphate in the water.
Most Zoas appear to do better in low flow and that indicates they are coming from deep water.

 

[Coralreefer1]

Let us remember that their is much more to consider when determining if corals and their coloration, health and growth rate are maintained under the most optimal conditions besides light.
Water flow, parameters, feeding, where the corals come from and stability...these are all pertinent components that promote the health and vigor of any coral.
As for lighting, you have to take into account the PAR and PUR of your tank. Corals can possess different strains of zooxanthellae which can alter the color and pattern of a polyp not to mention assist in the growth and health of the polyp or colony.

 

[User1]

To me that is a nice way to stop the argument and, for some, to reject the facts I've posted, and simply disagree without a plausible reason.

It was the only play either one of us had so that is what I went with. And it still wasn't good enough.

The trouble with your posts is the delivery method. You continue to say we reject the facts you post and disagree without reason. A difference of opinion some of us have - what is the big deal? Furthermore, the facts you state again are either an opinion of yours or sourced elsewhere. How is that different than anyone else providing information? People posted their views on it and their tank and every time you said it could be better, or it isn't right because it is reaching for light, etc. Go back and re-read.

Last time - I personally do not care what lights you favor. There are successful tanks running many different combinations of lighting. Success with only MH, success with only T5, success with hybrid, and success with LED only. Heck, please reference Mr. Saxby's tank - I believe that is LED only.

My only issue is when someone insists there is only one way or theirs is the best.

 

[dryworm]

A. grandis, the only thing you have succeeded at in this thread is exposing yourself

 

[warlocktitan]

As I mentioned before, all things being equal, everybody has their own views what light best for them or their comfort level of what they can achieve or prefer.
At the same token, whatever light source you can get for your reef tanks is still base on Sunlight spectrum derivative regardless.

It was not until 9 months ago I was an led fan due to easy to setup but easy to mess up with all the configuration without understanding completely the spectrum relative mean to certain corals whether the intensity or pur and par that make corals happy provide the water quality is there.

I saw many posts despite with the same led setup but one tank is working better than other and ofcourse with different water parameters will make different too but the consensus or preconception is that if Mr. A has similar led light setup as Mr. B thing should be equal and have the same success but reality it does not equate that way due led custom configurations and few missing things of tried and true of MH and T5 has that led is sorely lack such as CRI and CCT.

Color temperature

Output spectrum of a typical metal-halide lamp showing peaks at 385nm, 422nm, 497nm, 540nm, 564nm, 583nm (highest), 630nm, and 674nm.
Notice how even and more balance spectrum spread out compare to Led spectrum can provide.
It's basically less intensity than the full sun spectrum but proportional less to the sun spectrum in regard.

Because of the whiter and more natural light generated, metal-halide lamps were initially preferred to the bluish mercury vapor lamps. With the introduction of specialized metal-halide mixtures, metal-halide lamps are now available with a correlated color temperature from 3,000 K to over 20,000 K. Color temperature can vary slightly from lamp to lamp, and this effect is noticeable in places where many lamps are used. Because the lamp's color characteristics tend to change during lamp's life, color is measured after the bulb has been burned for 100 hours (seasoned) according to ANSI standards. Newer metal-halide technology, referred to as "pulse start," has improved color rendering and a more controlled kelvin variance (±100 to 200 kelvins).

No doubt led advancement will eventually replace MH and T5 technology in future of development from a leading optic Japanese company such as Kyocera and other companies follow suit.

Until then it's just a balance game for Led users ATM.

For now, I am switch back to MH and T5 due for the above reasons but I still use Led as supplement if I want the extra pop or artificial color that led stimulate my corals for that candy color enhancements .

I enjoy MH, T5 and Led technology and embrace them for different reasons.
I know its strength and manipulate to my advantages so life is all good.

 

[revhtree]

A. grandis, the only thing you have succeeded at in this thread is exposing yourself as a troll.

Friends let’s please remember to not get personal and keep it friendly as possible! Thanks.

 

[User1]

As I mentioned before, all things being equal, everybody has their own views what light best for them or their comfort level of what they can achieve or prefer.
At the same token, whatever light source you can get for your reef tanks is still base on Sunlight spectrum derivative regardless.

It was not until 9 months ago I was an led fan due to easy to setup but easy to mess up with all the configuration without understanding completely the spectrum relative mean to certain corals whether the intensity or pur and par that make corals happy provide the water quality is there.

I saw many posts despite with the same led setup but one tank is working better than other and ofcourse with different water parameters will make different too but the consensus or preconception is that if Mr. A has similar led light setup as Mr. B thing should be equal and have the same success but reality it does not equate that way due led custom configurations and few missing things of tried and true of MH and T5 has that led is sorely lack such as CRI and CCT.

Color temperature

Output spectrum of a typical metal-halide lamp showing peaks at 385nm, 422nm, 497nm, 540nm, 564nm, 583nm (highest), 630nm, and 674nm.
Notice how even and more balance spectrum spread out compare to Led spectrum can provide.
It's basically less intensity than the full sun spectrum but proportional less to the sun spectrum in regard.

Because of the whiter and more natural light generated, metal-halide lamps were initially preferred to the bluish mercury vapor lamps. With the introduction of specialized metal-halide mixtures, metal-halide lamps are now available with a correlated color temperature from 3,000 K to over 20,000 K. Color temperature can vary slightly from lamp to lamp, and this effect is noticeable in places where many lamps are used. Because the lamp's color characteristics tend to change during lamp's life, color is measured after the bulb has been burned for 100 hours (seasoned) according to ANSI standards. Newer metal-halide technology, referred to as "pulse start," has improved color rendering and a more controlled kelvin variance (±100 to 200 kelvins).

No doubt led advancement will eventually replace MH and T5 technology in future of development from a leading optic Japanese company such as Kyocera and other companies follow suit.

Until then it's just a balance game for Led users ATM.

For now, I am switch back to MH and T5 due for the above reasons but I still use Led as supplement if I want the extra pop or artificial color that led stimulate my corals for that candy color enhancements .

I enjoy MH, T5 and Led technology and embrace them for different reasons.
I know its strength and manipulate to my advantages so life is all good.

I don't think anyone took offense to your posts. You are not pushy. FWIW I do not believe the LED graph is accurate because several manufactures blend in other color emitters such as UV, Lime, etc. That will change the spectrum maybe? Then again I'm no expert. Dana Riddle would be ideal in this situation I bet.

My original tank in 2000 was using 175 W MH with SVHO actinic. I like the look and I felt it was a more natural looking tank similar to the colors I would see while diving. So I get what you are saying. I've never used T5's nor really have an interest. Mainly because I do not want to have to replace bulbs frequently.

 

[warlocktitan]

I don't think anyone took offense to your posts. You are not pushy. FWIW I do not believe the LED graph is accurate because several manufactures blend in other color emitters such as UV, Lime, etc. That will change the spectrum maybe? Then again I'm no expert. Dana Riddle would be ideal in this situation I bet.

My original tank in 2000 was using 175 W MH with SVHO actinic. I like the look and I felt it was a more natural looking tank similar to the colors I would see while diving. So I get what you are saying. I've never used T5's nor really have an interest. Mainly because I do not want to have to replace bulbs frequently.

well that's life when you embrace T5, I only use them to blanket the surface area with MH so the tank get 95% coverage.
I prefer latest led improvements with MH provided I can get the prefer spectrums arrangement to complement MH once I have my custom configuration from a led company then I will retired T5 completely.

 

[AngryMike2016]

Bring something substantial to the thread, not wood to the fire!
Maybe you should change your name to start, AngryMike2016.

Edit: Everyone here sees the facts as they were posted and the video evidences.
Still no one is telling them that they are wrong or need to change. I'm not!
The facts won't change and the way we see things is what is relative to what we choose or believe. Are some of you willing to ignore the facts from all the videos I posted? If so, that's fine, really, but we don't have to be enemies because we disagree or prefer other methods. Cool off!

Wants others to cool off while being hot headed.

Makes sense.

 

[Matthijs]

@A. grandis can u tell me what kind of LED lights u tested?
It seems like u are 100% against LED if I read your messages and IMO you shouldn't.
Maybe off-topic for the topic starter but for me this topic is very informing and this kind of topics are very interesting!

Grtz,
Matthijs

 

[tankstudy]

Top Shelf Aquatics, I think, in one of their interviews talks about polyp size. It's been a while so it could be someone else.

They had some utter chaos in lower and higher lighting and the lower light polyps were far larger and displayed a slightly different coloration than those in higher lighting.

I've also had the same thing occur in my zoa/paly collections.

However, not every zoa/paly responds the same way to those conditions. Some will just stretch themselves up to be closer to the light source. Some will do both, stretching and getting larger.

I wouldn't be surprised if some species weren't able to do anything, morphological change, in lower lighting conditions. Their only adaption would be to grow slower due to less available light.