How much better are the known brands of LED compared to the generic ones?

[Felipe]

Anyone looking for a good LED light for a nano tank? I wanted to share this one that I got 3 months ago. I am happy with the results on my LPS and softies, but I wanted opinions. How much better let's say a Kessil or an AI Prime would perform? Is it worth the extra money?

Here is the link to the one I got: https://amzn.to/3s26M9P

Thanks everyone and happy reefing!

 

[hds4216]

They say you get what you pay for, and I think that’s true, especially in this hobby.

 

[Jekyl]

Black box will do the job. However they are built as cheaply as possible and don't look anywhere near as good as kessil. I had both, the black boxes make everything look washed out and out of focus.

 

[MONTANTK]

They say you get what you pay for, and I think that’s true, especially in this hobby.

I second this. Even if the spectrums is the same, the build quality may not be. Nobody wants to spend a few hundred bucks on an LED only to have bulbs burning out after a year

 

[polyppal]

 

[Felipe]

I second this. Even if the spectrums is the same, the build quality may not be. Nobody wants to spend a few hundred bucks on an LED only to have bulbs burning out after a year

I totally get it! Although I ask, how would one out perform the other? Better coloration, growth? Or is it more of a durability stand point?

 

[MONTANTK]

I totally get it! Although I ask, how would one out perform the other? Better coloration, growth? Or is it more of a durability stand point?

Color and especially growth stem from spectrum. Cheaper LEDs may not have the proper spectrum which can result in a dull looking tank and poor growth, or even promote algae growth. Many companies allow the customer to control spectrum though. Then it comes down to the quality of the LEDs used. Cheaper diodes might experience shifts in spectrum after a short period of time or even burn out. You may also sacrifice customer service when you buy an off brand fixture. When you spend $800 on a Radion you can rest assured you’re going to get a very high quality product that is going to last for years without any major issues. You’re also going to get very good customer service.

Dont get me wrong, you can still run a successful reef with cheaper lights and it is still possible to end up with a faulty higher end light. It just comes down to what’s is important to you

 

[MONTANTK]

I totally get it! Although I ask, how would one out perform the other? Better coloration, growth? Or is it more of a durability stand point?

I should also mention the R&D that goes into deciding how many of each color, what specific colors, and where they should be placed is likely not the same between a well known brand and a cheaper Chinese brand

 

[mdb_talon]

They say you get what you pay for, and I think that’s true, especially in this hobby.

I agree to a me extent, but it reminds me of an interview I saw with the CEO of Peleton. They were struggling with demand at launch. He said they doubled the price of the bike and sales skyrocketed as people now perceived it as a higher quality product.

I think we see similar things in some areas of this industry. One of the main reasons we see MAP pricing so prevalent at the high end. Manufacturers do not want their products to be seen as cheap.

 

[Gtinnel]

I've always been on the cheaper side of this hobby. I diy everything that I can and because I am cheap most of my equipment is cheaper brand. I use the cheap Viparspectra lights and they have worked well for me. I'm in the opinion that light of the correct spectrum and intensity is the same regardless of who makes the diode or the fixture that it's in. I am in no way saying the high end lights aren't nice, because they are. They're better build quality and way more controllable, but I don't think that upgrading lights would make any difference to how much growth I have in my tank.

 

[Gtinnel]

I should also mention the R&D that goes into deciding how many of each color, what specific colors, and where they should be placed is likely not the same between a well known brand and a cheaper Chinese brand

While I agree that the major brands spend a lot more money into R&D the knockoff companies benefit from that R&D without it costing them anything because they just copy the product from the reputable company. I'm not saying that the practice of copying another companies products is fair but realistically that is what happens.

 

[GaryE]

Anyone looking for a good LED light for a nano tank? I wanted to share this one that I got 3 months ago. I am happy with the results on my LPS and softies, but I wanted opinions. How much better let's say a Kessil or an AI Prime would perform? Is it worth the extra money?

Here is the link to the one I got: https://amzn.to/3s26M9P

Thanks everyone and happy reefing!

At 24w that's a very low powered light. It'll light up your tank, but doubtful it'll give the par you need for good growth long term.

 

[Montiman]

I really think how they compare depends on what aspect you are comparing.

• Par
  • Cheap LEDs can definitely put out the PAR needed.
• Spectrum
  • Some cheap LEDs have awful spectrums others are much better. The key advantage of higher end LEDs is that most high end LEDs have more guidance on how to use the light. Manufactures provide guidance with presets or Kessil logic and there are many users who can share their schedules this is not the case for black boxes. Even if the black box can produce the right spectrum it will be hard to figure out how to do that.
• Longevity
  • The LEDs in many cheap lights can be good, but often the supporting equipment like power supplies, heat sinks, fans, and wiring is bad. In my experience these components go bad far before the LEDs do so they should not be overlooked. My personal opinion is that an LED light is a piece of modern technology and I upgrade all of my tech about every 5 years. If you can get more than 5 years out of a light then that is great when I can't get 5 years out of an iphone or laptop.
• Parts Availability
  • If a component goes bad will you be able to fix the light? Will the company even be around by the time a part goes bad? Mainstream brands will have much better parts availability.
• Color Blending
  • lenses are one of the areas cheaper lights skip on but they do a lot for blending the spectrum inside of the tank. You will get much more disco effect in the tank and the spectrum will likely differ more from point to point in the tank with cheaper brands.
• Control Interface
  • While I don't like thinking of lights as toys many do and the app interface will be better on name brand lights. You would be shocked at how much developing and maintaining an app costs. I hear people on forms say that it is super easy, but I know some aquarium manufactures that have spent over a million dollars designing a single app and even more doing continual updates. You can't just throw one together that works as well as google or apple apps. We have developed a very high standard for reliability in our apps and it is hard for small niche companies to meet this standard but the major brands do a good job.
• External appeal
  • Name brand fixtures do far more to make sure lights are easy to mount in a variety of ways and that they look good over the tank.
• Noise
  • Because cheaper fixtures use cheaper fans and heat sinks the fan noise is greater.
• Support
  • If you need to contact the manufacture will there be anyone to help? With the cheap Chinese brands there will not with the major brands someone will answer. I love when brands are active on reef2reef. It shows they want to engage with the reefing community.

 

[Felipe]

Thank you all for the replies. I personally have owed an AI prime, ATI Fixture, a Radion XR15 G3 along with many cheaper generic LEDs. One major problem I had with my AI prime was the shaded areas. Not as much with my Radion, although towards the corners I would still have darker spots compared to my ATI 24" 4X bulbs and to these long led fixtures. (All used on the same tank IM 25G Lagoon). And I really don't see a huge difference in growth and coloration and long as I respected the wattage rule of thumb and provided a fair spectrum.

 

[Felipe]

The cheaper LED I got is on my 10 Gallon aio since I had to shut down my 25g lagoon last November.

 

[iMi]

I work on product development and have been to many factories in China, Vietnam, Taiwan... I've worked lighting products as well (not aquatic, but think flashlights, work lights, etc).

Here's the truth.

Those "unknown" brands are often times the exact same product, components, etc as the brand names because those factories are the ones supplying them. That's not always the case, but more often than not.

Having said that, LED quality depends on many factors. If it's a COB, does it have an integrated controller or does it have a dedicated circuit board. Is the diode from a reputable supplier? We used to import U.S. made diodes back in the day as they were superior in quality. Is it properly calibrated?

I went with Fluval because I trust them. I know the product they put out is high quality and the light is properly balanced to offer the right spectrum. The support is there as well.

So, I guess there is more risk with the unknown brands. Not all factories have the same standards.

 

[sde1500]

I'd say to a point, paying more gets a better product. While that light is likely good enough for a 10g nano you use it for, its really quite weak. 100 LEDs but 25w means very weak LEDs. Look at the ones the higher end lights use, 3-5W per LED. Compare that to something like: https://reefbreeders.com/shop/photon-16-v2/ less than half the lights, puts out way more PAR.

 

[Rubberfrog]

I totally get it! Although I ask, how would one out perform the other? Better coloration, growth? Or is it more of a durability stand point?

Without being able to measure and compare the spectrum and intensity, it's just people guessing and making assumptions. I don't like guessing, so I paid a little more to buy a light with a tested and proven spectrum.

 

[wildcrazyjoker81]

If anyone here really wants to see what cheap lights are a good bang for you buck then you need to check out Jim's (telegraham on instagram/youtube) content. He tests the lights that the big vendors don't. He does par reading and spectrum on each one as well. Thus far he has done the Alibaba LED bars, NICREW, NOOPS, a few different black boxes, and more. He also shows how to save money replacing parts and such on expensive dosers and such. Lots of great content. Plus the guy is hilarious and is more than willing to help out and test other items if you send them to him.

 

[Thaxxx]

I should also mention the R&D that goes into deciding how many of each color, what specific colors, and where they should be placed is likely not the same between a well known brand and a cheaper Chinese brand

It doesn't need to be.
They just steal the R&D