Hybrid TTM Treatment - Puffers

[Eagle_Steve]

So we got our sons 2 puffers he ordered. As with all the other puffers we have ever received, they have ich for sure, and this time, it does not appear flukes are present. Still not 100% on that though. The porc looks to have velvet, but after shipping, the bath and acclimating will not come out of his newly found pvc elbow hidey hole. If you try to get near it, it starts the pumping like it is going to puff, so I shall leave it be. The spiney box could care less and will just about sit in my hand. Managed to get some good pics of the spots with very little effort.

Normally we do TTM and hypo for puffers as it is super easy with our setup. I use 40 breeder tanks for this to help with ammonia issues. I prepped for this already, so have 150 or so gallons of water already made and it will be temp matched to the TTM tanks. Salinity will be 1.009 in the TTM tanks. Temp will be somewhere around 76. A foam filter with an aerator will be used tonight.

Being as they just arrived they will sit in a 40b tonight. The tank is about 1/2 full and will be dripped with fresh RODI until the sensor shuts it off at almost full.

If my math and notes are right. In 12 hours the tank should be full. Starting salinity is 1.021. Ending salinity should be about 1.011. From there, I will remove 20 gallons and then drip in 1.007 water till full and this should get me to 1.009. Of course I will make corrections as needed to attain the proper salinity at the end.

Ok now that that is out of the way. Here is what we have so far.

Puffers did the bath per instructions below. Each in their own 2.5 gallon tanks with a painted black bottom.

Hydrogen Peroxide bath

Hydrogen Peroxide bath (updated 1-31-23) What It Treats: Provides temporary relief for Marine Velvet Disease and Brooklynella. After a 30 minute H2O2 bath, the fish should be transferred into a Quarantine Tank (QT) for followup treatment. How To Treat: (The following is needed) 3% Hydrogen...

humble.fish

No ill effects noted. No signs of distress or heavy breathing. Some white specs noticed on bottom of tanks, none appeared to be flukes. Microscope is nowhere to be found lol. I hate not being able to find something. Downsides of having just moved I guess.

Puffers are now in their “transition tank”.

@HotRocks @Humblefish @4FordFamily
Let me know if anymore info needs to be noted.

Pics of the spiney box for reference.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Water is now at 1.012. My math was close lol. Puffers are doing good but still have spots. and the porc is still super shy and looks to not have “dust” on it anymore, but still has ich spots.

Just drained 20 gallons of water and mixed RODI with the already made 1.009 water for a batch of 1.006 to be dripped in over the course of the day. I will monitor salinity and adjust if needed, but the goal is to have them at 1.009 by 6pm. Once there, the clock begins.

 

[Humblefish]

I would say that puffer has velvet for sure. If you do another H2O2 bath in 6 days, followed by a transfer into a sterile QT, it should take care of that. It may still take the white spots (excess mucous) a few days to clear up.

 

[4FordFamily]

I would say that puffer has velvet for sure. If you do another H2O2 bath in 6 days, followed by a transfer into a sterile QT, it should take care of that. It may still take the white spots (excess mucous) a few days to clear up.

I agree. Definitely velvet.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

I agree. Definitely velvet.

Thx guys.

Well this will be a test for sure. I do have CP on hand as well, so if no progress I can always use that method.

They are now at 1.009 and doing well, so I will continue to monitor.

 

[Humblefish]

They are now at 1.009 and doing well, so I will continue to monitor.

I've never administered H2O2 in that low of a salinity. I don't foresee any issues, but am curious if you notice any.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Day 4: (So to speak, tranfer and dip done at 71 hours from clock start)
The puffers got the H2O2 dip last night and then were placed in the next TTM tank. Spots are almost non-existent after the dip. The fish showed 0 signs of distress, the spiney box was its personable self trying to get me to pay attention to it, and the porc is starting to associate me with the yummy shrimp and scallops it has been getting. So they are doing well. Even after the dip, they seemed full of energy and acted like puffers normally act. They also took their food with no issues and had little fat bellies last night.

Note: H2O2 dip was done at 4 days from first dip and not 6 due to an unplanned business trip today. Puffs showed 0 issues, acted like puffs trying to get your attention and food. I ended up having to take a blanket and put it over the bath tank due to them being hyper and wanting to keep breaking the surface trying to spit water at me lol. I placed one of our ring cams under the blanket, looking at the tank to monitor them. After not being able to see me they just cruised around the little 5g tank like usual.

This needs to be something to think of with fish like this and may need to be noted for any fish that love to skim the surface, come up to look at ya, or anything like that. Puffers can and will aerate the bath for ya lol. If aeration degrades H2O2 quickly this can surely affect the dip. Luckily I just had to get below top of tank level to get them to stop long enough for my son to run and grab a blanket.

Was only able to get a pic of the spiney box and not the porc. Porc does not like the phone. Runs straight into the pvc elbow and hides when it sees it. The spiney box stares it down and will always face it lol. I figured the dip was enough stress, so I would not hold it for a side shot when up close I could get a shot of the fins.

Also, ignore the bubbles lol. It likes to play in the filter sponge bubbles.

Fins look much better, and I hope it stays that way.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

For notes:

Temp of tanks is always 74, as that is where water sits normally in our house. This also allows for perfect temp matching with new water and the new tank, as well as the baths. Pretty much all non-piped (fish tank related lol) water stays at 74 in the house with no heater being used.
SG: 1.009 or 12ppt
Ammonia has been testing at 0 and no prime has had to be used yet. Wife is testing 6-8 times a day using salifert and red sea. We also have the alert badges in a huge bulk pack and they are being used as well. they show 0 ammonia also. I think using 40 breeders for them is why. They are fed, but not heavily and they are only in the water for 70-72 hours. Lots of water and small puffers helps lol. We also remove any uneaten "spit up and chew again misses" within 2 minutes of feeding.

First bath was in a 2.5 gallon tank per puffer.
Second bath was both puffers in a single 5 gallon tank.
Both baths were dosed per instructions provided by @Humblefish
Each 2.5 gallon tank held 2 gallons of water to where I filled it to. This equates to 19ml of H2O2 being dosed.
The 5 gallon tank held 4.5 gallons of water to where I filled it to. This equates to 43ml of H2O2 being dosed.
All baths lasted 30-32 minutes.
Neither bath led to the puffers showing any signs of distress, ill affects afterwards, or anything outside of normal nutcake puffer behavior.
Appetite has not been suppressed, breathing is normal during and after the baths, and 0 ill effects so far.

 

[Humblefish]

@Eagle_Steve Since you are deviating away from the 6 day redosing schedule, I would give the fish extra H2O2 baths for good measure.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

@Eagle_Steve Since you are deviating away from the 6 day redosing schedule, I would give the fish extra H2O2 baths for good measure.

They have been getting a bath at every tank transfer (every 4th day).

Also need to report on them.

They are doing great. They have been doing TTM for 16 days with a transfer and dip every 4th day. There are no signs of spots, appetite is the usual puffer "I eat everything until I look puffed", no signs of stress, and the porc has figured how to get your attention by spitting water.

I will be moving them to a sterile 75 gallon tank that is used for storing extra live rock and growing out some macros. It has also not had a fish or any new additions in it in 8 months. They will remain here for 2 weeks to observe them. So this will be a test to see if it worked or not. Also as a note, this tank was the first tank moved to the new house and has never been in contact or anywhere near 15 feet or more of any other of my tanks. So I have full confidence in this tank being completely clean, it is also a lower salinity tank due to the macros seeming to grow better. With that said, I will be bringing the salinity up slowly to 1.025 or 1.026 to test this in real world, since no one keeps their tanks with corals at 1.019.

Will get some pics when we moved them over tonight. Also, shout out to the wifey, as she is dripping the last TTM tank to get it up to the salinty of their soon to be vacation home.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Puffers are now in the live rock/macro tank. They got one last dip before going in and are doing well.

I can also confirm that they had velvet along with ich. A biologist friend at Vandy confirmed it was velvet and ich present in the scraping I brought her.

The porc is also not camera shy anymore. 2 weeks in here and then they will go into my sons 90 until they get big enough to go into his 150 with the other aggressive fish.

Hoping for the best with this knocking the velvet out. TTM and hypo has always worked for ich, so we shall see.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

@Humblefish @4FordFamily @HotRocks

Puffers are about to be moved to the main tank with the other fishes. 0 Spots after treatment, and 0 spots period. Appetite is normal puffer, eat till they look puffed. Being as we are just past the 30 day mark since start of treatment, I do not want to call this a success, without some input from you all.

 

[4FordFamily]

Thanks for the update, glad it’s working well so far!

 

[oivind.gran]

@Humblefish @4FordFamily @HotRocks

Puffers are about to be moved to the main tank with the other fishes. 0 Spots after treatment, and 0 spots period. Appetite is normal puffer, eat till they look puffed. Being as we are just past the 30 day mark since start of treatment, I do not want to call this a success, without some input from you all.

Hi

How are the puffers in the main tank? still without issues?

We have an outbreak of ich in the DT so we will do ich management for 2 weeks until I come back from work abroad.

We have 2 puffers Diadon Holocanthus and a Valentini puffer.

How did you move the puffers between the tanks and the dip? I normally use a plastic box with tank water between moves so the puffer cant inhale air.. Did you just move it with your hands?

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Hi

How are the puffers in the main tank? still without issues?

We have an outbreak of ich in the DT so we will do ich management for 2 weeks until I come back from work abroad.

We have 2 puffers Diadon Holocanthus and a Valentini puffer.

How did you move the puffers between the tanks and the dip? I normally use a plastic box with tank water between moves so the puffer cant inhale air.. Did you just move it with your hands?

Puffers are good and doing great. No signs of any disease and very healthy.

 

[oivind.gran]

Puffers are good and doing great. No signs of any disease and very healthy.

How did you move the puffers between the tanks and the dip? I normally use a plastic box with tank water between moves so the puffer can`t inhale air.. Did you just move them with your hands?

 

[Eagle_Steve]

How did you move the puffers between the tanks and the dip? I normally use a plastic box with tank water between moves so the puffer can`t inhale air.. Did you just move them with your hands?

When i moved them, I just hold their mouth shut. That’s it.

 

[oivind.gran]

When i moved them, I just hold their mouth shut. That’s it.

Okay, that`s interesting..

Thanks for the tips.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Okay, that`s interesting..

Thanks for the tips.

May not be the best thing when moving them, but has worked for many years for me.