I’ve gotten myself into a right mess, help

[ReefPig]

A month or so ago, I had some metals in my tank detected through ICP, around the same time my parameters started to drift all over the place.

I’ve since fixed the metal issues, having found three root causes and detoxed my tank back to where it should be, but my (dosing) parameters are a complete mess now and I don’t know how to fix them.

Ca 470
Mg 1520
Alk 8.1

Its a fairly new tank (9 months) and only have 9 acro frags, 2 monti frags and 2 acans.

Wait for it...
To maintain those parameters I’ve been dosing for a month now:
0.9ml 3 & 4 each (Alk)
0.9ml 1 (Mg)
0.1ml 2 (Ca)

It's a 200L total volume system (dt&Sump).
If I increase Ca, it flies off the scale very quickly, one day of 0.2ml and I’m at 490+

Other than Mg being high and ideally should be lower, my issue is I cannot get my dosing anywhere close to be aligned.
I know it’s common to not have to dose all 4 equally all the time, but the massive difference between my Alk and Ca dosing is weird.

My Ca doesn’t drop, it’s quite happily sitting around 470 for a couple of weeks now.

I fear this is a self fulfilling prophecy, whereby dosing unequally, I’m in fact causing the issue, but I don’t know what to do, if I increase, it goes off the scale.

 

[ReefPig]

@Randy Holmes-Farley I know this is the Triton sub forum, but any help you can give sir, would be a blessing

 

[Mhart032]

Whats the tank size?

 

[ReefPig]

Whats the tank size?

200L total volume

 

[ScottB]

A month or so ago, I had some metals in my tank detected through ICP, around the same time my parameters started to drift all over the place.

I’ve since fixed the metal issues, having found three root causes and detoxed my tank back to where it should be, but my (dosing) parameters are a complete mess now and I don’t know how to fix them.

Ca 470
Mg 1520
Alk 8.1

Its a fairly new tank (9 months) and only have 9 acro frags, 2 monti frags and 2 acans.

Wait for it...
To maintain those parameters I’ve been dosing for a month now:
0.9ml 3 & 4 each (Alk)
0.9ml 1 (Mg)
0.1ml 2 (Ca)

If I increase Ca, it flies off the scale very quickly, one day of 0.2ml and I’m at 490+

Other than Mg being high and ideally should be lower, my issue is I cannot get my dosing anywhere close to be aligned.
I know it’s common to not have to dose all 4 equally all the time, but the massive difference between my Alk and Ca dosing is weird.

My Ca doesn’t drop, it’s quite happily sitting around 470 for a couple of weeks now.

I fear this is a self fulfilling prophecy, whereby dosing unequally, I’m in fact causing the issue, but I don’t know what to do, if I increase, it goes off the scale.

Those element numbers are fine IME. Nobody will suffer. There is a huge consumption difference between frags and colonies. I suppose you are not doing WCs under Triton, but still, you could test/dose once a week and be fine.

Lastly, testing for Ca and Mg you could do monthly. I do quarterly. Sometimes. They don't move like alkalinity does.

 

[Mhart032]

When i dosed Triton, i stabilised everything then started dosing to maintain the accurate levels. I dosed everything equally with exception to the Mag part. i found my tank didn't use enough for the equal part dose. I did find that my calcium levelled out on point with the alk uptake over time.

 

[ReefPig]

Those element numbers are fine IME. Nobody will suffer. There is a huge consumption difference between frags and colonies. I suppose you are not doing WCs under Triton, but still, you could test/dose once a week and be fine.

Lastly, testing for Ca and Mg you could do monthly. I do quarterly. Sometimes. They don't move like alkalinity does.

So you don't see it being an issue dosing 0.9ml alk and 0.1ml Ca?
I'm not so worried about the elements themselves, more concerned that by dosing unequally, I'm in fact causing the reason I need to dose unequally (if that makes any sense whatsoever).

I've read about the interplay between Ca and Alk, when one goes high, the other drops down etc and I'm worried I'm causing the reason for the low Ca uptake.

 

[Mhart032]

Might i ask what your heavy metals was?

 

[ReefPig]

Might i ask what your heavy metals was?

I had copper and mercury.

Three sources of metal discovered which were rusting:

• A one way dosing line check valve
• The spring inside a drawcord toggle of a media bag
• The pump I use inside my salt mixing container, both the magnet and screws

 

[Mhart032]

ah ok. I had issues with aluminium, Dangerous levels the ICP test said. Well... the source was the AL99 p04 media they sell...

 

[ReefPig]

ah ok. I had issues with aluminium, Dangerous levels the ICP test said. Well... the source was the AL99 p04 media they sell...

I hate AL99, doesn't seem to do much at all (very low uptake of PO4) and just leaches aluminium.
You need to rinse it super well and leave it to soak for a good while (30mins+) in RO, until there are no tiny bubbles from it.
Even after that AL still goes up.

If I ever need to pull my PO4 down, I turn to old trusty RowaPhos. It's a little bit dirty, but I always rinse it and it just does what it says on the tin.

 

[ScottB]

So you don't see it being an issue dosing 0.9ml alk and 0.1ml Ca?
I'm not so worried about the elements themselves, more concerned that by dosing unequally, I'm in fact causing the reason I need to dose unequally (if that makes any sense whatsoever).

I've read about the interplay between Ca and Alk, when one goes high, the other drops down etc and I'm worried I'm causing the reason for the low Ca uptake.

First I should be clear that I do not run Triton. Nothing against it. I dosed two part for many years until my uptake made that ridiculous -- 1/2 a liter per day. Now run a calcium reactor.

My point would be just worry about ALK. Pick a number and dose what you need to keep that number. (I shoot for mid 8 because that is what my favorite coral vendors all keep.) All the two-part vendors seem to say the same thing "dose equal". And I did, and my Ca would always be 490, and my Mg usually 1350 or so (with water changes). I just don't have much reason to test them because I know what the answer will be. ALK on the other hand moves around. I test almost every other day.

 

[ReefPig]

I guess the bit I cannot get my head around is why my Ca dosing is so low compared to Alk.

For example, if I were to be using a calcium reactor, I would have no choice, both alk and ca would always be dosed in relative amounts, I wouldn't be able to "fiddle" with the dosing pumps, it would be what it is.

If I started to adjust my Ca dosing, to bring it inline with Alk, I wonder what would happen, how high would my Ca go before it settled down, whats acceptable before being a crazy number (500? 550? 600? etc).

Everyone says to dose in equal parts, but right now I'm dosing 9 times the amount of alk to ca.

Something just doesn't feel right, but perhaps I should just start to dose more.

Granted, I would need to make the adjustments very slowly, otherwise I'd no doubt kill everything.

I did a few weeks ago increase from 0.1ml to 0.2ml and in one day alone I went from 470 to 490, so I reverted back.

I'm not sure it's linear, but assuming it is, if I increased my Ca to the same as Alk at 0.9ml, then logically my Ca would increase to 650.

I've read about the relationship between alk and ca, so I'm wondering if I should start to increase my Ca dosing, but reduce my Alk dosing, until I find a point where I can dose both in equal amounts.

Surely I cannot continue dosing 9 time the amount of alk forever...?

@Julian@Triton any thoughts?

 

[Mhart032]

How are you dosing? and when do test? also how much lps sps do you have in your tank? whats the total water volume of the system, sump and display?

 

[ReefPig]

How are you dosing? and when do test? also how much lps sps do you have in your tank? whats the total water volume of the system, sump and display?

GHL Doser 2.1
Dosage split into 3.
Currently 3 x 0.3ml 1 Mg, 3a Alk & 3b Alk, and 1 x 0.1ml 2 Ca

Hanna (Alk, Ca), Aquaforest (Alk, Ca, Mg) and every few weeks ICP.
Since starting to have issues, I've been testing daily (for over a month now), roughly the same time each morning. My tests all reconcile each with other.

9 Acros Frags (1 - 3"), 2 Monti frags (~1.5"), 2 Acans (~6-8 heads).

200 Litres total.

 

[Mhart032]

Are you running a fuge with Cheato? or are you using Triton other methods?

 

[ReefPig]

Are you running a fuge with Cheato? or are you using Triton other methods?

Other methods.
A load of Siporax in my sump and Tropic Marin Bacto Balance for me.

I've never had luck with cheato in the past.

 

[Mhart032]

TBH this is why i went away from Triton, it was good for roughly 2 months.. then my DKH would swing. i went from Mecoral 2 part from rock solid DHK at 8.29 - 8.35 every day testing with Trident. triton it was all over the place. Dosing 24 hours a day like i dosed 2 part. i would get 2. - 3. swings it was very sporadic. I went back to KZ and 2 part and everything has been great. All my SPS have responded very well. Im running Calcium reactor now. but it was crazy.

 

[Julian@Triton]

I guess the bit I cannot get my head around is why my Ca dosing is so low compared to Alk.

For example, if I were to be using a calcium reactor, I would have no choice, both alk and ca would always be dosed in relative amounts, I wouldn't be able to "fiddle" with the dosing pumps, it would be what it is.

If I started to adjust my Ca dosing, to bring it inline with Alk, I wonder what would happen, how high would my Ca go before it settled down, whats acceptable before being a crazy number (500? 550? 600? etc).

Everyone says to dose in equal parts, but right now I'm dosing 9 times the amount of alk to ca.

Something just doesn't feel right, but perhaps I should just start to dose more.

Granted, I would need to make the adjustments very slowly, otherwise I'd no doubt kill everything.

I did a few weeks ago increase from 0.1ml to 0.2ml and in one day alone I went from 470 to 490, so I reverted back.

I'm not sure it's linear, but assuming it is, if I increased my Ca to the same as Alk at 0.9ml, then logically my Ca would increase to 650.

I've read about the relationship between alk and ca, so I'm wondering if I should start to increase my Ca dosing, but reduce my Alk dosing, until I find a point where I can dose both in equal amounts.

Surely I cannot continue dosing 9 time the amount of alk forever...?

@Julian@Triton any thoughts?

Please send your USER ID and AQUARIUM LETTER (eg. 55555-A) to [email protected]. After looking at your latest ICP test results I will come back and answer here to help others with the similar situation.

 

[ReefPig]

Please send your USER ID and AQUARIUM LETTER (eg. 55555-A) to [email protected]. After looking at your latest ICP test results I will come back and answer here to help others with the similar situation.

Hi Julian,
I‘m just waiting on the UK lab to process my latest ICP, which they received a couple of days ago, so hopefully should be back in the next day or so.

With any luck it should have no copper or mercury now

I‘ll message when it comes back.

Cheers,
Dave