I got Mag issues Also, My fuge works well... A little too well!

[Twillyg21]

Hello all,

I have a Mag issue, as well as a Nitrate question

Magnesium question first...

Two months ago I consolidated 3 mature reef tanks into 1 big system (Red Sea 3xl 900- 240 gallon system) I used seeded LR and live sand and then moved all of my coral and livestock.

The tank is doing awesome! See screen shots for parameters:

Because of the salt mix (50/50 Red Sea blue bucket/Red Sea Coral Pro) and my AWC of 6 gallons daily, I haven’t needed to dose magnesium until now.

I usually use Red Sea Foundation C for MG but I was out and found an unopened Magnesium P (powder) that I figured I’d use to get rid of.

The first attempt to make the solution, I followed the instructions of 4 tsp per 8 ounces of RO and mixed up 2000ml.

I tried dosing slow at first, but after roughly 500 ml, my Mg actually went down about 2 ppm.

So I mixed up another 500 ml but this time I added 2/3 cup of the powder (~32 tsp) to the 500 ml RODI water and then added that to the weaker batch in my dosing container.

the 500 ml was at 4x strength
The other 1000 was still at normal strength
Total solution = 1.5x strength (if my math is correct)

I then dosed ~100 ml of the new solution, waited about 15 minutes and ran my trident test. My mg did not increase, in fact it decreased another 8 ppm

What am I missing? I’m sure there is a chemical reaction taking place that I am unaware of, but it doesn’t make sense that a more potent solution would cause my mg to go down.

I wanted to ask all of you before I dump even more into my system.



Question #2 is regarding Nitrate:

Just like the heading says... I have awesome filtration!

However, my Nitrates are continually too low. I actually dose NeoNitro from Brightwell daily at ~120 ml (240 gal tank) just to keep nitrates at 3-4ppm.

My tank is HEAVILY stocked with about 22 fish, 2 BTA, 3 sand stars, 2 clams, a lobster, and a crapload of Cuc

I also feed the following:

Daily:

1/3 dose reef roids (1/3 Weekly full dosage divided by 7 days)
1/3 dose Benepets (1/3 Weekly full dosage divided by 7 days)
1/3 dose Fauna Marin coral dust (1/3 Weekly full dosage divided by days)
2 tsp Oyster Eggs
2-4 tsp Brightwell Restor
4 frozen fish cubes (2 herbivore frenzy, 1 mysis, 1 krill)
1-2 Frozen coral gumbo cubes (small)
60 ml Oceanmagik live phytoplankton

Every other day:

1 tsp Vitamarin M - Multivitamin (Brightwell)
1 ml Coral Amino - free form (Brightwell)

2-3 times a week:

20 ml Koral Color (Brightwell)
2 tsp reef snow (Brightwell)

Weekly:

45 ml Koralle-VM (Brightwell)

Here is my Filtration:

Reef Octopus Regal 300 Skimmer
Bio pellets in reactor
Xport Phos media in both reactor and in a media bag in Sump
Purigen in media cup
Carbon in Media cup
UV Sterlizer (40 watt)

I have a huge fuge which has the following:

Caulerpa prolifera
Sea Lettuce
Red OGO
Pom Pom

I have a small in tank refugium in my DT that I grow red Ogo and Pom Pom in on top of some purple rock rubble that I use instead of frag plugs. The rocks with the macro algae looks like a underwater volcano

Now, my phosphate fluctuates between .13 - .2 ppm and It doesn’t get lower which I assume is a result of my heavy feeding and heavily stocked tank.

Everything is doing awesome in the tank, apart from a small diatom bloom in my sand from the tank getting established.

Should I worry about the higher than recommended phosphates if everything is stable and healthy -including my Acro and other SPS?

Is there a way to lower phosphates only (Without using GFO)?

I have a bottle of Phosphate Rx that I’ve never used before, but would that be a good option? I have it in case of emergency

Thanks for reading and helping me with this, I really appreciate it!

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Water change will fix both.
D

 

[Twillyg21]

Water change will fix both.
D

Thanks... however I’m not sure that you read my post before answering.

And a WC won’t really do much for the phosphates. Not sure how it helps with my Mag question either

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Okay...
D

 

[Greg P]

Not sure what's going on with your Mag as I don't use that product.
For lowering PO4 you could try getting NO3 up more - say 5-10 to start with.
The PO4 will be consumed in conjunction with the NO3 - not 1:1 but you'll see changes.

 

[Twillyg21]

Not sure what's going on with your Mag as I don't use that product.
For lowering PO4 you could try getting NO3 up more - say 5-10 to start with.
The PO4 will be consumed in conjunction with the NO3 - not 1:1 but you'll see changes.

Thanks! Is there a certain food that increases my nitrates more than my phosphates? I can keep dosing nitrate but that gets expensive quickly $75/month

 

[Twillyg21]

I guess that I could shorten my refugium photo
period. I’m running lighting 20 hours a day in my fuge

 

[Shirak]

I don't know the exact balance between the two ingredients in Mag P but... a 240g system trying to raise the Mg from say 1320 to 1350ppm will take about 131g of mag sulfate or 227g of mag chloride. SOOO I think you would need to use just about that entire 300-400g container to make a dent in your Mg level!. Don't forget the trident isn't exact either.

 

[ScottR]

Lou Ekus had some interesting insight into the relationship between PO4 and NO3 so I’ll just parrot what he said in a nutshell. Corals can easily take in NO3 (digest not necessarily lower). But corals don’t take in PO4 very easily. So carbon dosing will fuel the bacteria and fungi in tank and they will take in PO4 which then the corals eat. The corals utilize PO4 and grow. As they grow, they will use up more nitrates and PO4. It’s not a quick fix or a one-stop fix. You said you don’t want to use GFO but how about something like Phosguard? It’s not rust. It does work well to help lower PO4. Your PO4 did have quite a big jump however. Did anything change over that time?

 

[Twillyg21]

I did two things that day that could contribute to the rise in phosphate. I added a cleaner shrimp, two acros, and a Duncan and I also vacuumed the sand bed, just the top 1/4 inch of the sand, in the whole tank.

 

[Twillyg21]

Lou Ekus had some interesting insight into the relationship between PO4 and NO3 so I’ll just parrot what he said in a nutshell. Corals can easily take in NO3 (digest not necessarily lower). But corals don’t take in PO4 very easily. So carbon dosing will fuel the bacteria and fungi in tank and they will take in PO4 which then the corals eat. The corals utilize PO4 and grow. As they grow, they will use up more nitrates and PO4. It’s not a quick fix or a one-stop fix. You said you don’t want to use GFO but how about something like Phosguard? It’s not rust. It does work well to help lower PO4. Your PO4 did have quite a big jump however. Did anything change over that time?

Interesting.. I didn’t think about carbon dosing as I usually think of that for high nitrates, but if it helps my phosphates that might be a good option.

 

[Twillyg21]

I don't know the exact balance between the two ingredients in Mag P but... a 240g system trying to raise the Mg from say 1320 to 1350ppm will take about 131g of mag sulfate or 227g of mag chloride. SOOO I think you would need to use just about that entire 300-400g container to make a dent in your Mg level!. Don't forget the trident isn't exact either.

Dang. You’re absolutely right. What would account for the drop? I was testing to see if and how much the level would rise with a regulated dose, but was surprised each time to see it fall instead

 

[Shirak]

Dang. You’re absolutely right. What would account for the drop? I was testing to see if and how much the level would rise with a regulated dose, but was surprised each time to see it fall instead

I think even the 8ppm drop is probably insignificant and just inherent in the Trident which has an accuracy of 15ppm for calcium and magnesium. So it may have gone up slightly and still 'read a drop'. There is nothing I am aware of that would cause the Mg to drop after dosing the Mag P. I think you need to dose a whole lot more though based on your system volume. Before I had a CaRx with some Mg in it I was using the powdered mag chloride and sulfate from BRS and with my 65g system would take quite a bit to see a bump in values.

 

[Born2beblack]

So I'm a year plus in dont no much but my buddy who is a long way in has told me over and over and over if you dose alk you have to dose the over 2 elements or they reacts weird and will throw stuff off.
Idk the science... Idk if this is true as I just take his advise...
But since listening I have had no alk swings or any issue chemically
I dose all 3 when needed. Meaning if my alk is low and other are fine I dose all three evenly anyways and it always comes out good.
I think he said they all react as we know they do, but if you try and dose more of one it can shift the other causing weird readings and swings.
So if alk is low and cal and mag are good
So you dose alk. It may shift mag on you or cal on a way you don't want.
I cant prove this, but I use to only dose cal and alk and I away got odd mag or cal reading and I couldn't figure it out

Asked my buddy he told me do this and my 3 elements have thus all gone down regularly at the same time. Or if one is lower it won't shoot my other 2 up if I dose all three. Idk why but this is what i do.

 

[LRT]

You can get sodium nitrate on Amazon for much cheaper to dose with. Use James planted tank calculator for mixing instructions.
Phosguard works really well. Almost too well and will quickly strip your system of phosphates if you dont monitor it.
Just the little bag goes a long way.
Dosing Nitrates at higher ppm as suggested should help bring down Phos I learned that when I overdosed Nitrates that completely stripped my phosphates. Dont know the science behind all that just know it happened to me.
You could try running your fuge light for less time. I see alot of threads with folks stripping nutrients out with scrubbers.
You could try taking cup off skimmer and let nutrients catch back up.
Lots of things you can do but sounds like you just need to dial a few things back.