I guess im buying an 8'x5' pond

[Acroporakiller]

So this morning I was scrolling through facebook and on one of my local groups I see a post for an 8'x5'x2' pond thats got 2 breeding pairs of California rays (4 total), a 6" dogface puffer, an 18" epaulette shark, and a little fiji white spotted puffer.

In seconds my impulses took over and ive sent a deposit to go pick everything up tomorrow. Im looking forward to this, because prior to this my experience with predators was dealing with a 21" snowflake eel that liked to nibble on my fingers.

Im looking forward to having a place where i can put the cool coral eaters i always wanted, but wasmt willing to sacrifice corals for.

All that being said, I have some questions im hoping yall can answer.

First, Ive always wanted to breed a pair od sharks. Ive always loved brownbanded bamboo sharks. From what ive read, im guessing a brownbanded pair would likely be my best bet for breeding in a 450g? Would it be best to get rid of the epaulette before getting a pair of brownbands? I know the epaulettes can get fairly large so I do think I'll pretty quickly be finding a new, larger home for him.

Second is about the rays. Will California spotted rays do okay with other California rays?

Third is regarding puffers. Could I keep a porcupine with the dogface puffer?

Fourth would be regarding other fish. General rule of thumb im assuming is keep it bigger than the most aggressive fish's head and i shouldnt have issues of eating eachother right? Ive always wanted a few different butterfly fish, and angels.

And lastly, wheres the best place to get bulk, meaty foods? Should i just ask my lfs for a bulk discount?

Im really excited about this! I am literally here for advice, so if you have concerns of size of pond vs my current/ future stock plans/dreams, please voice them. Im coming from keeping sps reefs for the last number of years, and researching this as I go. I know thats not ideal, but fear not, the fish will be under fine water conditions, and well fed at minimum. I wont be adding anything until I know its safe.

 

[xxkenny90xx]

That's gonna be awesome, let's see some pictures (maybe from the sellers ad)?

I can't comment on most of your questions but for the food do not go to the lfs! Go to the asain supermarket and get some seafood. Fish, clams, mussels, shrimp, all that kind of stuff is great and much cheaper than lfs foods

 

[Acroporakiller]

That's gonna be awesome, let's see some pictures (maybe from the sellers ad)?

I can't comment on most of your questions but for the food do not go to the lfs! Go to the asain supermarket and get some seafood. Fish, clams, mussels, shrimp, all that kind of stuff is great and much cheaper than lfs foods

Im local to the PNW as well, you may have saw the original post actually. I feel like ive seen your user on PNWMAS potentially.

Heres photos from the seller.

 

[xxkenny90xx]

Oh cool, yep I'm on pnwmas and even used to be a reef frontiers guy if you remember them.

Hey join the new R2R club, it's nice to get an idea of whose around! https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/pacific-northwest-reefers.1267/

 

[ichthyogeek]

Tossing in the EHM for your future reference regarding elasmobranch issues!

For these fish, your best bet will most likely be buying bulk grocery store items (shrimp. lots of shrimp, and squid).

Good job on rehoming the epaulette! Here's a formula for the sharks suitable based on size of the tank . I'd stick with the smallest species you could get, so something like a coral catshark or shorttail nurse. I believe that both lay eggs. Keep in mind that you should find prospective buyers or be prepared to ship if you plan on breeding the sharks.

As long as the rays aren't males and females, I don't think they really get aggressive with each other. This is based off of what I've learned about freshwater rays though, saltwater rays may be a completely different scenario. @Jay Hemdal ?

I think instead you should ask if you can keep puffers with sharks and rays instead of "Can I keep two different puffers together". Puffers are incredibly nippy fish...

I seem to recall a number of anecdotees about grazing fish (angels, tangs, maybe butterflies...) eating the eyes of sharks? This might just be due to underfeeding of the other fish, but remember to do your research!

 

[Kalinina]

That is exciting! Can we get an update on how the move went?

 

[harley32907]

Following!

 

[lefkonj]

I don't think you would have an issue keeping the different shark species together, but I could be wrong.

With regards to other fish the biggest challenge is making sure the sharks/rays don't get picked on. A trigger may bite their tails or discs and cause infections. Larger tang species or angels would be awesome. Especially because they are very active swimmers.

 

[Acroporakiller]

Sorry for the lack of an update everyone. The move unfortunately ran into a few bumps. Made it down okay, but when I got back I learned the salinity these guys had been kept in is 1.020, but i had filled a 150g total water volume system with 1.025 without thinking to ask. So i got home, go to unbox the shark just to find 1.020. So i realize i need to bring my holding system down so i dont shock em more. When i finally got enough rodi water to bring things in check it dropped the water temp to 70. So then i grabbed 1100w in heaters to bring it up to 76. While i waited i started the drip acclimation process. Ended up taking about 1.5 hours to get to correct temp, so i did a bunch of research. I leaned all the sharks i like more only get larger. So now i think I might just figure out what gender my shark is and find it a partner to grow up and potentially breed with eventually.

Now for the sad news. 1 of the female rays unfortunately passed away this morning. She had only been in captivity for about 4 months, so i think the second time of transport stress unfortunately killed her. She was fine, and normal last night, then this morning was curled up and blowing in the current. Water parameters are as expected for 150g of new water made with red sea blue bucket. The other 3 are doing great though! All 3 ate a piece or 2 of shrimp out of my hand this morning.

The shark is so cool. I cant believe i have a literal shark in my house.

I took both puffers into my local fish store today.

 

[lefkonj]

If you look at the sharks pelvic fins it is easy to tell its gender. Females have simple pelvic fins but males have a clasper attached.

Sorry to hear about the one ray. Rays and sharks are very tough to keep in captivity, they require not only ample swimming space but great water conditions, don't like much of the readily available medications. Substrate is also something to think about. It should be really smooth and not provide any easy ways to get a cut, as that is much more common in captivity.

 

[Acroporakiller]

Well this sucks. Unfortunately the unit we had gotten for the pond gets a bit chilly at night here in the PNW, and the load from the heater kept popping the breaker resulting in the pond getting into the low 60s every morning. Luckily I had them all in my holding tank while sorting things out. Unfortunately the only solution became to put the pond inside our house which is not viable long term. After trying to find any other realistic way to house them, ive decided I just need to rehome these guys. I sold off the grey spotted hallers ray pair locally, but ive still got the black hallers ray, and the epaulette shark. Found out the epaulette is actually a captive bred. Hes super cool to feed, I actually handfeed him with the rays. Sometimes I get nervous about him eating too much with him trying to get too much food, he scavenges for the scraps from the enormously messy eating stingrays. Theyre such fun creatures. I really wish I could find a way to keep them.

 

[Krj-2501]

First off - if you still have the puffers, you either need to sale them or move the puffers to another tank/pond. Puffers are bad tank mates for benthic sharks & stingrays.

At 8 feet x 5 feet - the pond would be likely be okay for a average size (~36") adult epaulette. But it would too small for a pair. It would be perfect for trio of Coral catsharks, a pair of Arabian Bamboos, or Speckled Epaulettes - all which average 24-30".