If fallow is 76 days then why can copper…

Miami Reef

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Note: copper can NOT kill ich encysted stage (egg). That’s why we need to treat fish for copper for 30 days before we can lower the therapeutic copper dose because all the eggs would have hatched and been killed.

So why is fallow 76 days? If there is a strain of ich that can last that long, why isn’t it recommended to transfer the fish to a sterile tank after 30 days from a therapeutic dose copper?

Note:
We can be confident that all of the ich/velvet would have fallen off fish after 14 days. So transferring from 14 day full copper to sterile tank can shorten treatment to 14 days in lieu of 30 day copper…but for simplicity for discussion, let’s just use the standard 30 days because it’s the eggs that are going to hatch after 30 days when copper that’s sub therapeutic that I’m worried about.

@Jay Hemdal
 
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Jay Hemdal

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Note: copper can NOT kill ich encysted stage (egg). That’s why we need to treat fish for copper for 30 days before we can lower the therapeutic copper dose because all the eggs would have hatched and been killed.

So why is fallow 76 days? If there is a strain of ich that can last that long, why isn’t it recommended to transfer the fish to a sterile tank after 30 days from a therapeutic dose copper?

@Jay Hemdal
The 76 days came from a single study by Colorni where he found that Cryptocaryon tomonts could remain alive in xeric culture for that long (Petri dish with antibiotics) He never said that the fallow period needed to match that, but folks read the paper and it got extrapolated in our tanks. It certainly WILL work, the question is, what about shorter times? I’ve always used 45 days at 81 degrees.
Jay
 
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Miami Reef

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The 76 days came from a single study by Colorni where he found that Cryptocaryon tomonts could remain alive in xeric culture for that long (Petri dish with antibiotics) He never said that the fallow period needed to match that, but folks read the paper and it got extrapolated in our tanks. It certainly WILL work, the question is, what about shorter times? I’ve always used 45 days at 81 degrees.
Jay
Do you add black mollies to the tank to double check if the fallow worked?

Do you recommend me to add a mollie?
 
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The 76 days came from a single study by Colorni where he found that Cryptocaryon tomonts could remain alive in xeric culture for that long (Petri dish with antibiotics) He never said that the fallow period needed to match that, but folks read the paper and it got extrapolated in our tanks. It certainly WILL work, the question is, what about shorter times? I’ve always used 45 days at 81 degrees.
Jay
But that doesn’t explain how ich copper treatment can last for 30 days but fallow is longer. I assume it’s because fish can’t handle copper for 45 days and it’s unlikely ich will last past 30 days but it’s possible. So we need an observation period to be sure.

And the 45 day is to play it safe because trying to save a week or 2 can make you spend another 45 days for fallow.
 

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Because thats the longest that they been proven to live. Why risk it? Say you do 45 days, throw the fish back in and you get it again. 45 days now just became 121 days
 

Jay Hemdal

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But that doesn’t explain how ich copper treatment can last for 30 days but fallow is longer. I assume it’s because fish can’t handle copper for 45 days and it’s unlikely ich will last past 30 days but it’s possible. So we need an observation period to be sure.

And the 45 day is to play it safe because trying to save a week or 2 can make you spend another 45 days for fallow.
No - the fallow period was never really a "thing". Colorini just observed an active tomont under the descriptions I described. People read that and MADE the 76 fallow period based on that. I don't follow that at all, thus I started this thread:

Copper for 30 days, followed by 14 days of observation is what I use for uncomplicated quarantine. If the fish have visible ich, I go 30 days copper beyond when the last spots were seen, plus 14 days observation.

I don't like the molly test either. They are often bought and sold in brackish water. This opens up your tank to a whole slew of brackish water parasites. If you want that extra safety margin, do this: 30 days of copper past the point of seeing any spots. At least two weeks observation. If no spots, redose with copper and move the fish out of the copper treated water (theronts will be gone then).

Jay
 
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