Ifhbor

[Steve180]

My Achilles started to show white bumps for about 3 months now, it was pretty bad and looked like velvet. Soon after all my tangs started to exhibit the same symptoms except my Gem tang. 3 powder blue n Achilles are completely covered in white spots, Achilles and the big pb are swimming into the power heads. But what’s shocking is after 3 months no casualties. All my other clownfish and Anthias are all fine also.

 

[vetteguy53081]

My Achilles started to show white bumps for about 3 months now, it was pretty bad and looked like velvet. Soon after all my tangs started to exhibit the same symptoms except my Gem tang. 3 powder blue n Achilles are completely covered in white spots, Achilles and the big pb are swimming into the power heads. But what’s shocking is after 3 months no casualties. All my other clownfish and Anthias are all fine also.

3 months?? Im surprised you have not experienced any casualties. This is a clear case of velvet. . . often confused with ich parasite. With ich, you can generally count the dots whereas with velvet, it represents the solar system as in the case of your tang. velvet spots on the fish that are much finer than the spots seen in Ich making it harder to catch until in cases too late to treat.
Some behaviors associated with a fish with velvet are :
- Scratching body against hard objects
- Fish is lethargic
- Loss of appetite and weight loss
- Rapid, labored breathing
- Fins clamped against the body
- rapid breathing and mucus around the gills

Fish with velvet will typically stay at the surface of the water, or remain in a position where a steady flow of water is present in the aquarium. As the disease progresses outwards from the gills, the cysts then become visible on the fins and body. Although these cysts may appear as tiny white dots the size of a grain of salt, like the first sign of Saltwater Ich or White Spot Disease, what sets Oodinium apart from other types of ich is that at this point the fish have the appearance of being coated with what looks like a whitish or tan to golden colored, velvet-like film, thus the name Velvet Disease.
Remove fish from main tank and give them a FW dip or bath and then place them into a QT with vigorous aeration provided. Treat the fish in the QT with a copper-based medication. Although many over-the-counter remedies contain the general name as ich or ick treatments, carefully read the box to be sure it is specifically designed to target Oodinium. My choice is coppersafe at 2.25-2.5 therapuetic level at 80 degrees monitored by a reliable test kit (no api brand either)

 

[Steve180]

That’s the weird part, I have
3 pb
1 Achilles
1 yellow tang
1 gem tang
1 Red Sea regal
2 flame angel
1 lemon peel angel
1 jewel wrasse
2 copperband
6 clownfish
4 Bimac &
2 blotchy

not a single casualties, which makes me wonder is it really velvet

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I don't think that is velvet. The primary symptom of that is rapid breathing. If you see spots at all, they are very small, almost like a dusting/sheen.

Have the number of these spots changed over time?
Can you post a short video?

Sometimes, you will see chronic cases of Cryptocaryon, marine ich, but not this many spots for that length of time. What typically happens is the spots go away (like during ich management, or if you are just very lucky). In the majority of cases, within a month, the spots begin to increase geometrically in numbers and the fish die.....

Jay

 

[Steve180]

Hi Jay, thanks for the response. All my fishes originally gone through a month worth of copper. When added to display a few months later the Achilles started to show some spots and as time progress his entire body was full of it. Slowly my other tangs started to show some but it took awhile for it to cover their body. I decided against capturing all of them back out since their were no casualties. But now all 4 powder blue and Achilles is completely covered in spots and the magnificent fox face is showing some spots. The weird part is all the other smaller fishes aren’t showing any and my big gem tang and yellow tangs are spot free.. The Achilles and large pb are showing rapid breathing and constantly swimming into the power head but were still actively eating until 2 days ago. The big pb now completely stopped eating so I had to remove those 2 and did a freshwater dip.

I’m currently setting up my quarantine now, just wanted to see what I’m dealing with.

I’ll try to get a video when the lights come on.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi Jay, thanks for the response. All my fishes originally gone through a month worth of copper. When added to display a few months later the Achilles started to show some spots and as time progress his entire body was full of it. Slowly my other tangs started to show some but it took awhile for it to cover their body. I decided against capturing all of them back out since their were no casualties. But now all 4 powder blue and Achilles is completely covered in spots and the magnificent fox face is showing some spots. The weird part is all the other smaller fishes aren’t showing any and my big gem tang and yellow tangs are spot free.. The Achilles and large pb are showing rapid breathing and constantly swimming into the power head but were still actively eating until 2 days ago. The big pb now completely stopped eating so I had to remove those 2 and did a freshwater dip.

I’m currently setting up my quarantine now, just wanted to see what I’m dealing with.

I’ll try to get a video when the lights come on.

That sounds like ich. In some cases, certain fish have built up acquired immunity to it, and of course, some species are more prone to ich than others. Achilles and PBT are just about the most sensitive fish to ich out there, so them not faring well does point me to that diagnosis. The video may tell us more.

Jay

 

[Steve180]

 

[Steve180]

Hope this will do

 

[MnFish1]

API tests - are fine - barring further evidence

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hope this will do

Yes - from what I can see, this looks like ich. That is going to be tough to deal with....

Jay

 

[MnFish1]

Yes - from what I can see, this looks like ich. That is going to be tough to deal with....

Jay

It seems to me - I'm sure Jay will correct me - that its CI(ICH) - in varying stages.
EDIT - and perhaps - also affecting different fishes differently. The fact (in my brain at least) - is that velvet kills - this is not velvet - unless all of your fish suddenly became immune. Instead - it's CI - affecting different fish - differently. CI (ICh) can kill fish the myth proposed often here that it's harmless - is in fact a myth. You have a high stocking density

 

[czoolander]

Side bar.

I noticed in the second post about velvet " fish rubbing on rocks" I have a wrasse that will rub rocks as he swims past them. I do not see any signs of velvet or ich on any of the fish and they have been in for months.

Can fish rub rocks to mark territory ? is this normal wrasse behavior ?

Sorry not trying to hijack the thread I hope your fish recover and get healthy soon !!!!!!!!!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Side bar.

I noticed in the second post about velvet " fish rubbing on rocks" I have a wrasse that will rub rocks as he swims past them. I do not see any signs of velvet or ich on any of the fish and they have been in for months.

Can fish rub rocks to mark territory ? is this normal wrasse behavior ?

Sorry not trying to hijack the thread I hope your fish recover and get healthy soon !!!!!!!!!

Sometimes, wrasse will side swipe things as a feeding response. However, if it doesn’t look like it is feeding on something, then it may be flashing/scratching. That is often a sign of flukes.
Jay

 

[Steve180]

Yes - from what I can see, this looks like ich. That is going to be tough to deal with....

Jay

At this point what is my best course of action?

why is this tougher to deal with than other cases?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

At this point what is my best course of action?

why is this tougher to deal with than other cases?

Well, tough because the best course of action is to pull all of the fish and dose them in copper while you leave the tank fallow for 6 weeks or so.
Jay

 

[czoolander]

I see there c

Sometimes, wrasse will side swipe things as a feeding response. However, if it doesn’t look like it is feeding on something, then it may be flashing/scratching. That is often a sign of flukes.
Jay

I see there can be quite a few symptoms of flukes and the wrasse isn’t displaying any of them besides rubbing on rocks occasionally.
is it possible for him to be marking territory by scent ? Do fish do this ?

when I added a clownfish he chased him for 10 days .
I recently added a Solon wrasse and he is doing the same treatment/ harassment.

he’s not lethargic very active. Big appetite. Eyes are t cloudy . No trouble breathing. I’m no expert on fish disease but he doesn’t have any fluke symptoms besides he likes to rub on rocks .

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I see there c

I see there can be quite a few symptoms of flukes and the wrasse isn’t displaying any of them besides rubbing on rocks occasionally.
is it possible for him to be marking territory by scent ? Do fish do this ?

when I added a clownfish he chased him for 10 days .
I recently added a Solon wrasse and he is doing the same treatment/ harassment.

he’s not lethargic very active. Big appetite. Eyes are t cloudy . No trouble breathing. I’m no expert on fish disease but he doesn’t have any fluke symptoms besides he likes to rub on rocks .

I've never heard of scent marking in fish. Some people have thought that in a few cases, the fish just develop this as a stereotypic behavior (like lions pacing in a zoo). In the end though, fish often have chronic gill fluke infestations and the only symptom of that is head scratching.

Jay