I'm going to rinse my sand bed. Who else has done this?

Have you ever "rinsed" your sand bed?

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schooncw

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Nope that's an incorrect assumption. :) Sand is about an inch or maybe a little deeper. It's primarily aesthetic.
Well if that's the case, I don't think it really matters what you do, if you have the sand for aesthetic reasons only. Why not consider a DEEP sand bed, that will give you all of the inherent benefits? Fine sand, at least 4.5", with a thin layer of larger grain on top, to prevent it blowing everywhere and will never be disturbed? Apart from aesthetics, anything else is just a detritus trap.
 

smartwater101

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Well if that's the case, I don't think it really matters what you do, if you have the sand for aesthetic reasons only. Why not consider a DEEP sand bed, that will give you all of the inherent benefits? Fine sand, at least 4.5", with a thin layer of larger grain on top, to prevent it blowing everywhere and will never be disturbed? Apart from aesthetics, anything else is just a detritus trap.
I mean... talk about a detritus trap. That's what a DSB is! Our boxes of captivity are tiny. There isn't nearly enough pods/worms/bacteria/CUC that is going to clean up that cess pool. Not by a long shot.


The risks of a DSB faaaar outweigh the benefits, hence why the trend died long ago.
 
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Ento-Reefer

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I vacuum the sand bed in my 180g 2-3 times a month. I rinsed the sand really well before I added it. It passes the sand drop test.
 
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Daniel@R2R

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Well if that's the case, I don't think it really matters what you do, if you have the sand for aesthetic reasons only. Why not consider a DEEP sand bed, that will give you all of the inherent benefits? Fine sand, at least 4.5", with a thin layer of larger grain on top, to prevent it blowing everywhere and will never be disturbed? Apart from aesthetics, anything else is just a detritus trap.
I ran a DSB in my tanks for a number of years. I much prefer the shallow sand bed. The only reasons I have a sand bed at all is because I prefer the look of a sand bed over bare bottom and to allow for fish and critters that burrow in the sand to sleep.
 
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I mean... talk about a detritus trap. That's what a DSB is! Our boxes of captivity are tiny. There isn't nearly enough pods/worms/bacteria/CUC that is going to clean up that cess pool. Not by a long shot.


The risks of a DSB faaaar outweigh the benefits, hence why the trend died long ago.

Exactly! I have a 4 to 6 inch DSB of UNRINSED Southdown tropical playsand...this is the stuff you built DSB's back around 2000. This bed is on a lightly stocked 120 gallon FOWLRLS. It is 17 years old and based on old school techniques I didn't disturb it. IT IS FULL OF DETRITUS. Granted less flow probably contributes to more detritus settling, but how can you crank flow on a fine sand bed, keep detritus suspended and not be building up on your sandbed?

I have started to gravel vac it more often, but there are nooks and crannies where detritus WILL eventually settle. It may not cause problems but will be unsightly.

A big pile of sand, much like rock will eventually become a sink for phosphates.

My current nitrate readings are 75ppm and phos is around 2.5ppm.
 

MnFish1

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I mix mine up by hand every month, and barely anything comes out. The tank is just cloudy for an hour or two.

Nutrient import/export balance is more important in my opinion. If you are not exporting well or maintaining the sand bed, yes, it will get quite dirty.
Hopefully you're wearing gloves
 

schooncw

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I mean... talk about a detritus trap. That's what a DSB is! Our boxes of captivity are tiny. There isn't nearly enough pods/worms/bacteria/CUC that is going to clean up that cess pool. Not by a long shot.


The risks of a DSB faaaar outweigh the benefits, hence why the trend died long ago.
In my opinion, if done correctly, I see no risk at all and having been in the business for many years, I know of many deep sand bed tanks that have been running for decades. The key phrase here is “done correctly”.
 

brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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I agree. AZDesert Rat is a poster who keeps a classic Berlin style and its about 20 now or maybe 25.

The key is variability and actually commutability in my opinion. Though classic Berlin style dsbs can work, they vary too much in 5 years time for the masses to keep repeating the method past the 90s.

when they work balanced they're awesome, but too rare. When advising others in setting up long term systems that are less likely to crash, or get an invasion that sometimes earns a voluntary takedown, cleaner vs stored up is winning bigtime.
 

smartwater101

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I know of many deep sand bed tanks that have been running for decades
Like I said in another comment, some will never have it blow up, but there is a reason people refer to it as a ticking time bomb.

There are a lot of things people do FOR YEARS and never see the consequences. But that doesn't mean its worth the risk, is all I'm saying.
 

Fallling

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I don't necessarily rinse all my sand, but I always "poof" it with a turkey baster/coral feeder tool to stir up detritus - sometimes just for the benefit of all my nps during the week while other times it's right before a water change so I can siphon it out as it settles on top of the sand bed.

I do also vacuum my sand bed, however, I recently added a decent amount of finer aggregate sand which vacuums out easily, but I go ahead and add the vacuumed out sand back to the tank (about a quart size ziploc bag).

So, in essence I am partly rinsing my sand bed. The cyano on my sand bed does seemed to have improved since I've started doing this.
 

brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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Agreed,

Look what friend blusop did using those patterns. It works,
for many large tankers.



That’s a whole lot of large tanks, revealing patterns, showing command over detritus without takedown cleaning

We like to have people rinse their brand new sand if it’s typical caribsea stuff to perfect cloudlessness so the start of the tank isn’t messy. Then they can add animal charger packs now accessible online, on a siltless system, or set rocks and know it won’t shift and cloud.

Then they stick stir, they export vs store, and apparently don’t have to rinse ever again.
 
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schooncw

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I agree. AZDesert Rat is a poster who keeps a classic Berlin style and its about 20 now or maybe 25.

The key is variability and actually commutability in my opinion. Though classic Berlin style dsbs can work, they vary too much in 5 years time for the masses to keep repeating the method past the 90s.

when they work balanced they're awesome, but too rare. When advising others in setting up long term systems that are less likely to crash, or get an invasion that sometimes earns a voluntary takedown, cleaner vs stored up is winning bigtime.
Amongst other things, the key is using fine enough sand, so that it does not “clump”. This is what will cause hydrogen sulphide to develop and build up over the years.
 

schooncw

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Like I said in another comment, some will never have it blow up, but there is a reason people refer to it as a ticking time bomb.

There are a lot of things people do FOR YEARS and never see the consequences. But that doesn't mean its worth the risk, is all I'm saying.
The entire point of the DSB-done correctly-is that is NOT a "ticking time bomb" and is a perfect way to maintain a stable reef tank. If you set it up correctly, there is virtually no chance of it failing, period!
 

sarcophytonIndy

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I mean... talk about a detritus trap. That's what a DSB is! Our boxes of captivity are tiny. There isn't nearly enough pods/worms/bacteria/CUC that is going to clean up that cess pool. Not by a long shot.


The risks of a DSB faaaar outweigh the benefits, hence why the trend died long ago.
You haven't seen my pods and worms. I could drop a pot roast in there and it would be devoured in minutes. Although I don't do DSB, I don't want to give up that much volume in the DT.
 

schooncw

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You haven't seen my pods and worms. I could drop a pot roast in there and it would be devoured in minutes. Although I don't do DSB, I don't want to give up that much volume in the DT.
A proper DSB has no detritus, precisely because of all of the pods, worms, etc. The key is, having sand that is fine enough, so it does not clump to the point that all of the DSB inhabitants can't get to it.
 

smartwater101

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A proper DSB has no detritus, precisely because of all of the pods, worms, etc. The key is, having sand that is fine enough, so it does not clump, to the point that all of the DSB inhabitants can't get to it.
Go find a DBS, take a siphon, and put it in there. Hell, just take your hand and mix it up. Even a tiny bit. It is absolutely filled with detritus. DSB stores detritus. It does not remove it (Not to any beneficial extent anyway, because there is simply not enough worms/pods to ever clear it up.)

Obviously don't do this (because you'll set off the time-bomb), but that's kind of the point. You keep saying "set it up correctly." Well a good way to set one up is NEVER touch it, because you've just created something that has the potential to be very harmful to your tank. The best way to set up a DBS? Don't set up a DBS.

THE RISKS FAR OUTWEIGH THE REWARD.

I'm beginning to think people don't really understand why this trend died.
 

Can you run a a successful reef long term without some type of reactor and media?

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