Is it feasible to remove the skimmer? Could it solve the decades-long problem of nutrient accumulation?

Belgian Anthias

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The role of a skimmer?

My father had a saltwater aquarium in the early 1970s, based on Frank De Graaf's book, manual for the tropical marine aquarium, published in 1969. The aquarium was equipped with a counter-current skimmer. Since then, a skimmer was always in use. What has been established is that accumulation of inorganic nutrients such as nitrate and phosphate has been a perennial theme since then. However, that does not make sense, as the nitrogen is naturally constantly exported through denitrification and in fact a deficiency should occur if natural marine food is used. It is possible that food provided contains far too many of these substances, so that not everything can be used up and left behind due to new growth. Such nutrients then have a very low C/N ratio and usually contain an unnaturally very high protein content.

One can NOT keep fish in a small closed environment without exporting what of the added food was not used by the fish. A skimmer only removes +- 35% at best. of biological waste, whether dissolved or not. A mechanical filter only removes undissolved organic waste. Nothing is removed from what is not in the water column. If all goes well, there is sufficient remineralization capacity and growth, the total bio-load will increase constantly, if not regularly harvested. By using a skimmer, some of the inorganic nutrients and trace elements already present cannot be used up through growth.
Fish are fed and +- 85% of the nitrogen content of the food ends up in the closed environment. Mostly as inorganic nitrogen compounds which are not removed by a skimmer. To remove this nitrogen, of which +/- 15% will escape through natural denitrification, most of the TOC and DOC produced by the fish must be able to be remineralized and reused through growth. This is NOT possible when using a skimmer. Therefore, a skimmer creates an imbalance and accumulation of inorganic nutrients.

Disruption of the nutrient balance by the skimmer makes it impossible for everything to be used up by growth and harvested as needed. Certain nutrients and trace elements can slowly build up in this way to a toxic level.
Removing the skimmer does not restore the existing nutrient imbalance it has created during the period it was in use. This can be corrected by active algae management, AAM

Starting a new system without skimmer?

A coral holobiont will produce CO2 and other inorganic nutrients used by the symbiodinium, a result of remineralization of the DOC available there. Corals are able to supply their holobiont with organic matter and regulate the supply of DOC by excreting mucus. In this way the production of sugars by the symbiodinium is also regulated, a supply of sugars that the coral eagerly uses. A high level of dissolved organic substances in the surrounding water makes it impossible for the coral to regulate the supply as required. Therefore, dissolved organic matter (DOC) levels should be kept as low as possible where corals grow. In the ocean, the level of nutrients present in the surrounding water may be very low, but the supply is inexhaustible.

In an aquarium there is a constant production of DOC.
In the absence of a skimmer, more DOC is produced and more DOC must be remineralized, and more new growth must be harvested to keep the bio-load in check. But the nutritional balance can be restored, nutrient accumulation can be prevented.

Is it feasible to remove the skimmer? Could it solve the decades-long problem of nutrient accumulation?
 
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Belgian Anthias

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After taking one look or smell at what a skimmer pulls out of the water, I don't know how anyone could run a tank without one.
Maybe because what looks bad and smells after being skimmed is the reason why it is not possible to run a tank without accumulating problems almost everybody is confronted with?
Those who do not run a skimmer, what would be a good reason why they should use one?
 

dvgyfresh

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I’m with you , I would rather not have a skimmer and let the food/proteins be recycled by other organisms but the skimmer has the important task of oxygenation and I think that is needed especially in my setup, the sump has very little flow
 

HuduVudu

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I don't use a skimmer. I have found over time that empirically I have observed that they strip the water nutrients/life. This seems to lend itself well to the mentality of sterility but I find that I am moving further and further away from that thinking. I want the phyto and zooplanktons. I work actively to add them to my system. I also feed live foods to my fish. This seems to me to produce a more stable and robust system.

I can not prove what I am saying scientifically. What I know comes from trial and error and my admittedly biased observations.

The one case where I would use a skimmer is gas exchange. Sometimes it is very difficult based on mechanical considerations to achieve what I would call proper gas exchange. This is the only case, but the caveat is stripping the tank of nutrients/life. Because of this, if I do need gas exchange I try to use a very underpowered skimmer.

FWIW
 

ReefGeezer

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I love my skimmer for now, but I'll agree that skimmers on tanks that otherwise contain organisms that use the available dissolved carbon can lead to a carbon limited system... an imbalance if you will. However, those systems are usually older and full of corals and other organisms that use the DOC... which in-turn creates inorganic N & P... which allows more DOC for the cycle to continue. BUT... in systems that aren't mature enough for this cycle to occur effectively, a skimmer helps maintain acceptable DOC and subsequently N & P levels.

There is no black and white rule to tell us when the skimmer becomes unnecessary or even detrimental. Maybe weening the tank from a skimmer is the best practice once you've decided it might be time. Slowly reduce the daily run time over several weeks or more. Stop reducing the run time if the tank starts to respond negatively.
 
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Belgian Anthias

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I’m with you , I would rather not have a skimmer and let the food/proteins be recycled by other organisms but the skimmer has the important task of oxygenation and I think that is needed especially in my setup, the sump has very little flow
I do not know what type of skimmer you are using but in general In line skimmers are used, by which the contact with the surface is limited to the foam opening, which also limits the gas exchange rate. In most cases a skimmer in not a very good aerator. Surface skimming and a simple air stone will be a lot better option for aeration and exchange of gasses.
Do air bubbles inside the skimmer tube aerate the water?
Even when the skimmer effluent is released at the water surface, it would be a very expense way for aerating water if used only for that purpose.
 

dvgyfresh

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I do not know what type of skimmer you are using but in general In line skimmers are used, by which the contact with the surface is limited to the foam opening, which also limits the gas exchange rate. In most cases a skimmer in not a very good aerator. Surface skimming and a simple air stone will be a lot better option for aeration and exchange of gasses.
Do air bubbles inside the skimmer tube aerate the water?
Even when the skimmer effluent is released at the water surface, it would be a very expense way for aerating water if used only for that purpose.
I have the aqua max 1.5 hob , it’s placed inside the sump and does release a ton of bubbles it’s filled with pineapple sponges , I almost want to lower the water level so it’s not even skimming but just aerating the water but I do occasionally dose nopox / a lot of coral foods / amino acids
 
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Belgian Anthias

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I love my skimmer for now, but I'll agree that skimmers on tanks that otherwise contain organisms that use the available dissolved carbon can lead to a carbon limited system... an imbalance if you will. However, those systems are usually older and full of corals and other organisms that use the DOC... which in-turn creates inorganic N & P... which allows more DOC for the cycle to continue. BUT... in systems that aren't mature enough for this cycle to occur effectively, a skimmer helps maintain acceptable DOC and subsequently N & P levels.

There is no black and white rule to tell us when the skimmer becomes unnecessary or even detrimental. Maybe weening the tank from a skimmer is the best practice once you've decided it might be time. Slowly reduce the daily run time over several weeks or more. Stop reducing the run time if the tank starts to respond negatively.
When a system is mature? As long a system accumulates nutrients for me it is not mature. My opinion a skimmer prevents the system to become mature.
It is the intention to replace the skimmer by a more effective and balanced way for reducing DOC, this way making it possible that by organisms released inorganic nutrients all can be reused for growth and harvested. This way preventing accumulation of nutrients, organic and inorganic.
 

HuduVudu

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but the skimmer has the important task of oxygenation
I do not know what type of skimmer you are using but in general In line skimmers are used, by which the contact with the surface is limited to the foam opening, which also limits the gas exchange rate. In most cases a skimmer in not a very good aerator. Surface skimming and a simple air stone will be a lot better option for aeration and exchange of gasses.
Do air bubbles inside the skimmer tube aerate the water?
Even when the skimmer effluent is released at the water surface, it would be a very expense way for aerating water if used only for that purpose.
Oxygenation is not what is needed in a marine aquarium per se. What however is needed is CO2 outgassing. Depending on the situation the skimmer can fufill this need, but I agree generally there are better ways.
 

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I've used skimmers of and on for the last 35+ years, aside from the very early days every tank I've run in the last 15 years has a skimmer. The benefits a skimmer brings to a system far outweigh any potential negatives if there really are any to be concerned about but I havnt found any yet that would be a cause for concern where the skimmer itself is the cause of a problem.
 

ReefGeezer

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When a system is mature? As long a system accumulates nutrients for me it is not mature. My opinion a skimmer prevents the system to become mature.
It is the intention to replace the skimmer by a more effective and balanced way for reducing DOC, this way making it possible that by organisms released inorganic nutrients all can be reused for growth and harvested. This way preventing accumulation of nutrients, organic and inorganic.
It's a matter of the ratio of nutrient producing organisms to nutrient reducing organisms. Fish and large invertebrates are usually plentiful in new systems while corals, sponges, copepods, planktonic organisms, and etc. are not. "Mature", at least to me, means these populations are in balance and C:N:p ratios remain optimal with little mitigation. While I agree that a skimmer may slow the growth of the nutrient reducing organisms, I can't see how some method of control doesn't need to be in place while the populations balance. I've read your posts for a long time and agree with so much of your thoughts. I can't agree that removing only inorganic nutrients with an algae reactor is any better that limiting DOC with a skimmer. Inorganic nutrients are also needed to create the organic compounds that the organisms that balance the C:N:p ratios consume.

The key, IMO, is to limit export of DOC and inorganic N&P to the extent necessary to reduce the risk of the negative effect they might have without creating a situation where the system is limited by C, N, or P. As long as the system is not limited, the population of nutrient reducing organisms will grow, and export will need to be reduced proportionally. You could say that export needs and maturity are inversely proportional.
 

ApoIsland

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I ditched my skimmer 8 years ago and couldn't be happier. If you have a sump or refugium and are not keeping acros there is no bigger waste of time and money in my opinion. My SRO XP 2000 was basically a $500 airstone that required weekly cleaning.

Of course I keep mostly easy sps and lps.
All the very nice acro tanks i've seen have skimmers....

full tank shot.png
 

X-37B

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I think it depends on what you keep. I could not imagine a full sps system without a skimmer.
My skimmer is oversize for my 120, Tunze 9430dc. It removes 300ml a day.
I only run a filter sock and a small amount of carbon.
The key for me is I practice heavy in/out. 15 fish in my 120 and I feed 8+ cubes a day.
I do not feed the corals.
IMO, if you practice heavy in/out and a skimmer only removes say 35% doc then their is plenty left for the corals.
The 120 is 29 months old and has a large amount of sponge visable under the rocks.
 

Mr. Mojo Rising

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A skimmer only removes +- 35% at best. of biological waste, whether dissolved or not. A mechanical filter only removes undissolved organic waste. Nothing is removed from what is not in the water column.
Since this is the basis of your argument, I would disagree, since I dont know how you came up with this statistic. Everyone runs a different skimmer, I run a skimmer rated for triple my tank size, a clean or dirty skimmer also affects efficiency.......

You are correct that nothing is removed from what is not in the water column, thats why strong flow is so super important in our tanks. The skimmer efficiency will be dependant on how strong a flow is in a tank. So , you cant just make up a number and apply it to everyone. these are just a few variables but I can come up with many more.

I'm not saying you cant have a successful tank without a skimmer, I just question the basis of your information
 

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