Is it normal for a tang to suddenly stop eating?

[vetteguy53081]

I mean, those white areas always show up on him when he's stressed or lights go out. Where are you seeing the ich/flukes because I don't see it. Would love to learn here. And... Does this mean all other fish need to come out? This seriously baffles me... All fish went thru ttm.

You posted 5 pics/videos.
#4 close up- You will see dots between lateral line and upper dorsal
#5 - you can see dots between mouth and eye and by gill area which supports the heavy breathing

 

[vetteguy53081]

Yup, gotcha. But you're pretty sure this is bacteria if anything? No need to do copper for that I assume?

Copper will not do anything for bacteria. Copperpower will work with dots which im looking for a second eye/opinion/confirmation from Jay

 

[ca1ore]

Hmmn, honestly I don’t see ich or velvet in those pictures. That it comes out at night but not during the day does suggest some kind of cowering behavior. When I added my gem, my purple gave it a really hard time. I’d remove it and see if the absence of aggressors helps. I worry that blasting a weakened fish with all those meds will simply hasten its demise. Could try something like NFG powder .... contains methylene blue that helps to calm a fish.

 

[Biff0rz]

Hmmn, honestly I don’t see ich or velvet in those pictures. That it comes out at night but not during the day does suggest some kind of cowering behavior. When I added my gem, my purple gave it a really hard time. I’d remove it and see if the absence of aggressors helps. I worry that blasting a weakened fish with all those meds will simply hasten its demise. Could try something like NFG powder .... contains methylene blue that helps to calm a fish.

I don't have any nfg on hand sadly. Would a fw dip be too harsh? I feel like I could gain some sort of info from a dip. I can the place it in a hospital tank and watch. When it's out at night is just gliding along. Not swimming like normal, it's sleep swimming or whatever it is they do.

 

[ca1ore]

Not personally a fan of doing FW dips. I’ve actually never had a flukes problem. Just doesn’t look like flukes to me. Perhaps Jay has an opinion. T’were me, I’d just remove stressors and see for a day or two.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Sorry - just woke up....

All I see in the photos is one area on the fish's left side, the spot furthest back and higher up, does not look like the typical fright coloration of a gem tang, it is a slightly different color and more diffuse. I think the spots around the head are normal pores in the scales.

I'm counting the respiration rate at around 225 beats per minute, anything over 200 is critical. If the fish is still alive this morning, I think you will need to do a FW dip. The dip could kill the fish, but if it does, that just means that the fish was close to respiratory collapse anyway. A 5 minute dip in a darkened container that it can't jump out of. Don't use RO/DI, just dechlorinated tap water at the same temperature as the tank. When the dip is done, look at the bottom of the container for flukes. I doubt you will find the big Neobenedenia flukes, but if you use a magnifying glass, you may see tiny gill flukes. If the issue is velvet, you won't see anything in the dip.

If it survives the dip and if that provides some relief, it will only be temporary, so a treatment plan will need to be devised. If it survives but the breathing doesn't improve by tomorrow, then we're back to the anemia or bacterial gill disease ideas....


Jay

 

[Biff0rz]

Sorry - just woke up....

All I see in the photos is one area on the fish's left side, the spot furthest back and higher up, does not look like the typical fright coloration of a gem tang, it is a slightly different color and more diffuse. I think the spots around the head are normal pores in the scales.

I'm counting the respiration rate at around 225 beats per minute, anything over 200 is critical. If the fish is still alive this morning, I think you will need to do a FW dip. The dip could kill the fish, but if it does, that just means that the fish was close to respiratory collapse anyway. A 5 minute dip in a darkened container that it can't jump out of. Don't use RO/DI, just dechlorinated tap water at the same temperature as the tank. When the dip is done, look at the bottom of the container for flukes. I doubt you will find the big Neobenedenia flukes, but if you use a magnifying glass, you may see tiny gill flukes. If the issue is velvet, you won't see anything in the dip.

If it survives the dip and if that provides some relief, it will only be temporary, so a treatment plan will need to be devised. If it survives but the breathing doesn't improve by tomorrow, then we're back to the anemia or bacterial gill disease ideas....


Jay

Ok. dang, I let him be last night. Going to go see of I can get him before the lights turn on.

 

[Biff0rz]

Ok. dang, I let him be last night. Going to go see of I can get him before the lights turn on.

Also, if it's somehow velvet and I don't have cp what do I do? Isn't copper less effective?

 

[Biff0rz]

Ok so he's alive. But he's also aware and not 'sleeping'. I'll try the fish trap bit if he's not eating I'm screwed until tonight unless I remove all the rocks (200+lbs). I agree w those spots near the back, those are not normal but they also are not present when lights are on.

 

[Biff0rz]

Ok progress made. I was able to get her out of the tank and do a fw dip! I dipped for exactly 5 mins. I added prime to the water and it was temp matched. Near the 4m mark she laid on her side but kept breathing 'normal'. Right at the 5m mark I got her into the hospital tank. Not sure what I should do now? I looked all over in the black bucket and didn't notice anything (flukes) but like you said @Jay Hemdal they may be too small. I'm not sure what to do now? I haven't medicated the hospital tank yet. Advice? Breathing is still fast.

Video coming soon. She also just laid on her side in the hospital tank, does this happen a lot after fw Dips? Help! Idk what to do. She's back up and swimming now....

 

[Biff0rz]

She's swimming with her head facing up. I counted her respitory rate and it's 45/10s or 270/min.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I may be able to see more in the video, but it is pretty typical for a fish to show signs of stress after a FW dip. The key is, does it settle down through the day and into tomorrow. I would keep the lights dim and perhaps black out the top and sides of the QT.

Jay

 

[Biff0rz]

I may be able to see more in the video, but it is pretty typical for a fish to show signs of stress after a FW dip. The key is, does it settle down through the day and into tomorrow. I would keep the lights dim and perhaps black out the top and sides of the QT.

Jay

Ok will do that now, makes sense. Should I dose prazi or anything? I have a Hob running with an air pump / stone. Powerhead is off. Lights off (now)

 

[Biff0rz]

I may be able to see more in the video, but it is pretty typical for a fish to show signs of stress after a FW dip. The key is, does it settle down through the day and into tomorrow. I would keep the lights dim and perhaps black out the top and sides of the QT.

Jay

Here's the video

 

[Biff0rz]

Also if this is bacterial based what kind of medicine would I use? I may not have it so I need to go to the lfs real quick

 

[Biff0rz]

@Jay Hemdal noticed this just now. On the top fin some sort of mucus coming off of it? Also noticing something on the bottom one too. Could this be from the fw dip? I'm wondering if it's ammonia burn even tho is used prime.

 

[Biff0rz]

 

[Jay Hemdal]

What level is your ammonia testing at, and what test kit are you using? Prime works, but after multiple additions, it doesn't work nearly as well....

This rapid breathing has got me very pessimistic, I can't figure out why it is doing that. For me, I would sedate it and do a gill biopsy, but obviously that is out of the question....

Jay

 

[Biff0rz]

What level is your ammonia testing at, and what test kit are you using? Prime works, but after multiple additions, it doesn't work nearly as well....

This rapid breathing has got me very pessimistic, I can't figure out why it is doing that. For me, I would sedate it and do a gill biopsy, but obviously that is out of the question....

Jay

0 in the dt. Will test the QT. I did a 50% w/c last night on the QT.

the breathing really has me worried too. I was thinking to dose Metro and prazi just to have something going in the tank

And yeah I have nothing to sedate him with nor do I have the skills to do the Gill biopsy LOL

 

[Jay Hemdal]

At this point, I agree with the metro/prazi route. The fish in the DT all still look fine?

Jay