Is this Flukes? Blue Tang

[Elliott ll]

Sounds like a solid plan.....

Jay

@Jay Hemdal Hope you had a wonderful Thanksgiving. Wanted to ask a question regarding some equipment of mine that may have been contaminated with ich. I wanted to move some powerheads back to my DT that I had in QT. What's a sure proof way to not bring ich back into my tank? Can I soak in Vinegar/water mixture and let air dry for a couple of days?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal Hope you had a wonderful Thanksgiving. Wanted to ask a question regarding some equipment of mine that may have been contaminated with ich. I wanted to move some powerheads back to my DT that I had in QT. What's a sure proof way to not bring ich back into my tank? Can I soak in Vinegar/water mixture and let air dry for a couple of days?

Power heads are tough because they have those rubber boots and shafts that can resist drying. I would disassemble them, soak in vinegar and tap water overnight, rinse in tap water and then air dry for two days.
Jay

 

[Elliott ll]

Power heads are tough because they have those rubber boots and shafts that can resist drying. I would disassemble them, soak in vinegar and tap water overnight, rinse in tap water and then air dry for two days.
Jay

Okay I will do that thank you so much!

 

[Elliott ll]

Power heads are tough because they have those rubber boots and shafts that can resist drying. I would disassemble them, soak in vinegar and tap water overnight, rinse in tap water and then air dry for two days.
Jay

Just to keep you updated on the current progress, all fish have stopped showing signs of both marine ich and/or flukes (no scratching, no spotting, no flashing), except of course... the blue tang. I am a little over two weeks into copper treatment at 2.25-2.5ppm with Copper Power. I did Prazi dose #1, 5 days later Prazi #2, and will be doing my 3rd round of Prazi 10 days later on 11/30.

The blue tang is very fat now, she eats like an absolute pig. I'm not seeing any bad stress or erosion from the copper. She hides more than normal and scratches still. I'm really wondering why she is the only fish showing these signs still and why I am still seeing a little bit of white spotting. Being in QT with meds, the water isn't crystal clear so its hard to tell if it's ich spotting or idiopathic mucus plugs from copper.

I was on facebook marketplace messing around and saw a 40 gallon tank with 20 gallon sump, reef octopus skimmer, overflow, power heads, return pump, and stand basically everything my DT has and then some for $200. I went ahead and bought it and am setting it up. I'll add water and Fritz Turbostart today and I bought a massive bucket of seachem matrix. I am going to be establishing this QT tank over the next 2 weeks (I will end up making it a fowlr QT and add a small amount of sand and live rock to minimize copper leaches). However, now I have a separate sterile tank that I could transfer my fish to in a couple of weeks... If I decided to do 30 days of hyposalinity in this tank, do you drop the fish into a preset hypo tank or do I gradually decrease the salinity? Wondering how I should do this and if I should even both with turbostart and saltwater?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Just to keep you updated on the current progress, all fish have stopped showing signs of both marine ich and/or flukes (no scratching, no spotting, no flashing), except of course... the blue tang. I am a little over two weeks into copper treatment at 2.25-2.5ppm with Copper Power. I did Prazi dose #1, 5 days later Prazi #2, and will be doing my 3rd round of Prazi 10 days later on 11/30.

The blue tang is very fat now, she eats like an absolute pig. I'm not seeing any bad stress or erosion from the copper. She hides more than normal and scratches still. I'm really wondering why she is the only fish showing these signs still and why I am still seeing a little bit of white spotting. Being in QT with meds, the water isn't crystal clear so its hard to tell if it's ich spotting or idiopathic mucus plugs from copper.

I was on facebook marketplace messing around and saw a 40 gallon tank with 20 gallon sump, reef octopus skimmer, overflow, power heads, return pump, and stand basically everything my DT has and then some for $200. I went ahead and bought it and am setting it up. I'll add water and Fritz Turbostart today and I bought a massive bucket of seachem matrix. I am going to be establishing this QT tank over the next 2 weeks (I will end up making it a fowlr QT and add a small amount of sand and live rock to minimize copper leaches). However, now I have a separate sterile tank that I could transfer my fish to in a couple of weeks... If I decided to do 30 days of hyposalinity in this tank, do you drop the fish into a preset hypo tank or do I gradually decrease the salinity? Wondering how I should do this and if I should even both with turbostart and saltwater?

Setting up a brand new tank and then dropping it into hyposalinity can cause some issues with the beneficial bacteria. In a well established tank, the bacteria have no issues with the drop.

I generally take three days to go from full seawater to hypo - so a specific gravity of 1.024 to 1.009, in perhaps 6 reductions. I've gone faster in established tanks, but better to be cautious. You need to have a very accurate means to measure specific gravity. You also need to decide if you are going to go to hypo for ich (1.009) or the less stressful hypo for flukes (1.012). Coming OUT of hypo must be done very slowly, I would opt for 5 or 6 days with one or two increases a day.

Jay

 

[Elliott ll]

Setting up a brand new tank and then dropping it into hyposalinity can cause some issues with the beneficial bacteria. In a well established tank, the bacteria have no issues with the drop.

I generally take three days to go from full seawater to hypo - so a specific gravity of 1.024 to 1.009, in perhaps 6 reductions. I've gone faster in established tanks, but better to be cautious. You need to have a very accurate means to measure specific gravity. You also need to decide if you are going to go to hypo for ich (1.009) or the less stressful hypo for flukes (1.012). Coming OUT of hypo must be done very slowly, I would opt for 5 or 6 days with one or two increases a day.

Jay

Okay I will try to establish the tank as best as possible over the next two weeks or so. Going to dump in extra Turbostart and add a bunch of live rock. I do have a salinity refractometer for measuring salinity.

Which option would you choose in my situation? 1. Treat just the blue tang with hyposalinity. 2. treat just the fish that share qt with blue tang (including the blue tang of course), or 3. treat both QT tanks?

I have one QT tank in my living room that has zero symptoms of ich or flukes. Several of the fish had ich before copper, but I see no signs. They also still have two weeks to go in copper. QT in my bedroom has my blue tang, 4 flame angels, mexican jawfish, and a purple tang. Again blue tang only one with symptoms.

To reduce the salinity, I simply do a WC with freshwater and check with refractometer until at desired level?

 

[Elliott ll]

Setting up a brand new tank and then dropping it into hyposalinity can cause some issues with the beneficial bacteria. In a well established tank, the bacteria have no issues with the drop.

I generally take three days to go from full seawater to hypo - so a specific gravity of 1.024 to 1.009, in perhaps 6 reductions. I've gone faster in established tanks, but better to be cautious. You need to have a very accurate means to measure specific gravity. You also need to decide if you are going to go to hypo for ich (1.009) or the less stressful hypo for flukes (1.012). Coming OUT of hypo must be done very slowly, I would opt for 5 or 6 days with one or two increases a day.

Jay

@Jay Hemdal here is a picture of the blue tang. Would you say this is still Ich or idiopathic mucus plugs?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal here is a picture of the blue tang. Would you say this is still Ich or idiopathic mucus plugs?

That does look like ich to me. Can't be certain of course sometimes a visual ID simply isn't possible. Take a look at the tank in this thread. It seems to show all three types of spots in one fish! The black spots on the belly are probably turbellarians. the elongate white spots on the black area are mucus plugs, and then the fine white dots are likely ich:

Help Identifying what is on my Blue Tang and growing on maxspect

Does anyone have an idea what this may be on my Tang and also growing on my maxspect pump. It popped up on the fish overnight and am not sure if it is related or not. Thanks in advance for any help.

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

 

[Elliott ll]

Okay I may be dealing with a copper resistant strain. After 2 weeks would I really see this still? So I guess hypo is my best bet.

 

[Elliott ll]

That does look like ich to me. Can't be certain of course sometimes a visual ID simply isn't possible. Take a look at the tank in this thread. It seems to show all three types of spots in one fish! The black spots on the belly are probably turbellarians. the elongate white spots on the black area are mucus plugs, and then the fine white dots are likely ich:

Help Identifying what is on my Blue Tang and growing on maxspect

Does anyone have an idea what this may be on my Tang and also growing on my maxspect pump. It popped up on the fish overnight and am not sure if it is related or not. Thanks in advance for any help.

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

How many days into a copper treatment would you expect to no longer see any signs of Ich?

 

[vetteguy53081]

How many days into a copper treatment would you expect to no longer see any signs of Ich?

Coppersafe will need to be maintained at least at 2.25 for a therapeutic level and for no less than 14 days and be sure to hae a reliable test kit to monitor levels. DO NOT use API kit either

 

[Elliott ll]

Coppersafe will need to be maintained at least at 2.25 for a therapeutic level and for no less than 14 days and be sure to hae a reliable test kit to monitor levels. DO NOT use API kit either

I'm using Hanna Copper Checker and Copper Power for treatment at 2.5ppm. I will assume 14 days still applies?

 

[vetteguy53081]

I'm using Hanna Copper Checker and Copper Power for treatment at 2.5ppm. I will assume 14 days still applies?

Yes. You can let it gradually come down as you approach day 10. Always add oxygen when providing any form of treatment with as simple as an air stone

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I'm using Hanna Copper Checker and Copper Power for treatment at 2.5ppm. I will assume 14 days still applies?

Personally, I run Coppersafe for 30 days. I've had too many reports of ich making it through 14 days of any of the amine-based copper products. The 14 days schedule stems from the old copper sulfate/citric acid products. That was a lot more effective, but a lot harsher on the fish, thus the shorter time frame.

Oh - and just to clarify - I dose coppersafe for 30 days beyond the date that I last saw spots on the fish. Remember - copper doesn't kill the resting tomonts, and those can live 30 to 45 days, only to release swarmers after you remove the copper.

Jay

 

[Elliott ll]

Personally, I run Coppersafe for 30 days. I've had too many reports of cih making it through 14 days of any of the amine-based copper products. The 14 days schedule stems from the old copper sulfate/citric acid products. That was a lot more effective, but a lot harsher on the fish, thus the shorter time frame.

Oh - and just to clarify - I dose coppersafe for 30 days beyond the date that I last saw spots on the fish. Remember - copper doesn't kill the resting tomonts, and those can live 30 to 45 days, only to release swarmers after you remove the copper.

Jay

Okay so since I am still seeing Ich on my Blue tang then I need to not begin my 30 day count down until I stop seeing signs?

I am at 50 days fallow in my DT after another 30 days in QT. I would assume I can consider it a sterile tank after 50 days. 30 days of copper treatment with no signs of ich and then transfer to DT "new sterile tank." I would HOPE this would be a safe bet.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Okay so since I am still seeing Ich on my Blue tang then I need to not begin my 30 day count down until I stop seeing signs?

I am at 50 days fallow in my DT after another 30 days in QT. I would assume I can consider it a sterile tank after 50 days. 30 days of copper treatment with no signs of ich and then transfer to DT "new sterile tank." I would HOPE this would be a safe bet.

Yes, 30 days after the ich spots have gone is safest. If your DT has gone 50+30 days fallow, you would be beyond the longest time ever recorded as being needed (76 days).
Jay

 

[Elliott ll]

Yes, 30 days after the ich spots have gone is safest. If your DT has gone 50+30 days fallow, you would be beyond the longest time ever recorded as being needed (76 days).
Jay

I just calculated and my birthday is 76 days from beginning of fallow... I see this as a sign... I will begin adding fish back to DT Jan 17.

I guess my last question is what's the longest amount of time I should continue with copper?.. If I still see Ich in another 14 days, would you abandon for hypo or ttm?

My fear is that I could end up having the QT with my blue tang sitting in copper for 60 days at this rate.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I just calculated and my birthday is 76 days from beginning of fallow... I see this as a sign... I will begin adding fish back to DT Jan 17.

I guess my last question is what's the longest amount of time I should continue with copper?.. If I still see Ich in another 14 days, would you abandon for hypo or ttm?

My fear is that I could end up having the QT with my blue tang sitting in copper for 60 days at this rate.

Copper generally knocks ich back after 14 days at a full dose. If the spots are still there, you need to consider a different diagnosis. Blue tangs develop white spots that are not ich in rare instances.
Jay

 

[Elliott ll]

Copper generally knocks ich back after 14 days at a full dose. If the spots are still there, you need to consider a different diagnosis. Blue tangs develop white spots that are not ich in rare instances.
Jay

Okay, my blue tang has been in copper for a total of 18 days, unfortunately I had to add a flame angel to the tank on Nov 20th so I believe that reset the clock. The blue tang is at 11 days now and still displaying spots + scratching.

Today I dosed my 3rd round of prazi (dose 1, dose 2 - 5 days later, dose 3 - 10 days later). I would highly doubt the scratching and/or spots is from flukes after 3 rounds of prazipro.

Here's the picture of the spots again. If they are still there after 14 days then is it possible that they could be mucus plugs?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Okay, my blue tang has been in copper for a total of 18 days, unfortunately I had to add a flame angel to the tank on Nov 20th so I believe that reset the clock. The blue tang is at 11 days now and still displaying spots + scratching.

Today I dosed my 3rd round of prazi (dose 1, dose 2 - 5 days later, dose 3 - 10 days later). I would highly doubt the scratching and/or spots is from flukes after 3 rounds of prazipro.

Here's the picture of the spots again. If they are still there after 14 days then is it possible that they could be mucus plugs?

Ah, I’ve seen that picture before (am dealing with too many threads). That isn’t mucus plugs, more like ich. I think you just need to let the copper ride. Tell me again: copper type, testing level and testing method?
Jay