James Wetton Reefer 525xl Build

[jameswetton2895]

WOW!

Is that about the magnesium, Back down to 1360 today ... very strange.

 

[john.m.cole3]

No, it was WOW look at those beautiful corals and pristine tank! Very nice!

 

[jameswetton2895]

Ok, so today was my first sad day on my new tank journey. I spotted that my powder blue had some very small white spots on the gills, which I know to be marine ich.
Not good news.

I also couldn't find my clown tang and he wasn't coming out for food.
Really not good news.

I quickly read everything I could on marine ich and found out that there is no scientifically proven treatment that is reef safe.
Super flipping bad news.

I quickly cleaned out my old 170 reefer tank and picked up 150l of saltwater from ultra aquatics ( 25 mins away ) within 3 hours I had set up a hospital tank which I added ATM colony to and 3 marine pure 2 inch cubes ( from my existing tank ). A couple of left over bits of real reef branch and a small piece of drainpipe later and I'm good to go. Ultra aquatics gave me " Cupramine " by Seachem which is a copper based parasite treatment. I added this to the tank along with a small power head.

Advise was to turn the red lights on my tank so I could see but the fish couldn't and try to catch them that way. I got my powder blue and clown tang out of the display and the clown tang was in a real bad way.
Both fish went in about 1pm and unfortunately by around 7pm the clown tang had perished. The powder blue has eaten tonight so I'm caustically optimistic about his chances. The clown tang was my most recent fish and I hadn't really had long enough to fatten him up and get him healthy. I'm confident that I did everything possible to save him but on this occasion it wasn't enough.

Couple of things to add,
Firstly ultra aquatics were extremely helpful and if anyone in the U.K. Is anywhere near the Wrexham or north west area they should defiantly pay these guys a visit. They have an amazing selection of unusual corals and the best customer service I've come across. Huge thanks to them.

Secondly I am aware that stress is capable of inducing and making marine ich worse. I am also aware that catching fish and changing their environment is massively stressful however I wanted to give them the best possible chance of survival and to me setting up a hospital tank with proper medication was the best I could do.

Lastly I have also got some polyp lab medic which I will use to on the display tank starting tomorrow. I know this isn't a proven method but none of the other fish are showing symptoms. The medic will hopefully kill the parasite in the free swimming stage so might as well give this reef safe ( treatment ) a go.

 

[mcarroll]

I think too much....don't mistake this for negativity even if it seems like it... More like unprovoked constructive commentary.

Seems like this tank is going from zero to full in no time flat. Even in 2017 we expect bad things to happen if we don't slow it way way down. The idea that a reef (or reefer!) can be established this quickly is attractive, but...

"Nothing good happens fast in a reef tank." - not my quote.

Consider:
Having a couple/few fish and a similar amount of coral after the first year would really imply having a lot to know in that amount of time. You have to have time to make mistakes and learn from them....better that your experiment (bio-load) is small and easy to understand! The most experienced reefer I know puts a seasoned tank (and reefer) at somewhere around 5 years. I think that's reasonable too. Why not prolong your tank's stocking throughout that time frame, and even save a good percentage of it for after you've gotten there?

 

[jameswetton2895]

I think too much....don't mistake this for negativity even if it seems like it... More like unprovoked constructive commentary.

Seems like this tank is going from zero to full in no time flat. Even in 2017 we expect bad things to happen if we don't slow it way way down. The idea that a reef (or reefer!) can be established this quickly is attractive, but...

"Nothing good happens fast in a reef tank." - not my quote.

Consider:
Having a couple/few fish and a similar amount of coral after the first year would really imply having a lot to know in that amount of time. You have to have time to make mistakes and learn from them....better that your experiment (bio-load) is small and easy to understand! The most experienced reefer I know puts a seasoned tank (and reefer) at somewhere around 5 years. I think that's reasonable too. Why not prolong your tank's stocking throughout that time frame, and even save a good percentage of it for after you've gotten there?

Thanks for your advice... however as much as I agree not to over load a tanks bio load. I have 7 small fish 3 being very very small and a few coral colonies. I have never had a reading of nitrate above 5ppm ( on the way down ) so don't think I have pressure on my biological filtration. There are a lot of tanks that's are set up and stocked heavier than mine instantly with great results.
I do appreciate any and all advice so thanks for your comments. I will also say I have had plenty of time to make mistakes on old tanks and learnt a lot. I'm sure I'm going to make many more mistakes on this feeding journey but that's all part of the ride.

 

[jameswetton2895]

So I have been battling marine ich for the last 6 days, my findings so far are documented below. Some good news and some bad news unfortunately.

Day 1 - Noticed white spots on my powder blue tang and clown tangles missing and not eating.
- Set up a hospital tank in order to treat the fish with copper.
- Ordered polyp lap medic
- Fish went in the hospital tank
- Clown tang perished

Day 2 - Powder blue tang was eating and swimming strongly in the morning and I was in the therapeutic zone for copper treatment.
- Treated the display tank with medic once before 10am and once after 10pm
- None of the fish showed signs of ich in the DT

Day 3 - Powder blue didn't eat and was looking a bit slower
- Treated the display with medic once before 10 am and once after 10 pm

Day 4 - Powder blue perished
- Still no sign of ich on the other fish in the display
- Treated the display with medic once before 10 am and once after 10 pm

Day 5 - Still no signs of ich on the other fish

I am on a mission to feed my fish more nutritious food, I have started to use Sachem Vitality and also polyp lap Garlic supplement. I am feeding a combination of new era marine pellets, brine shrimp with added garlic and mysis shrimp with spirulina. Although all my fish looked very healthy and happy before this outbreak it is my opinion that if the fish were as heathy as they could be they wouldn't of allowed the marine ich to get a hold.

Ongoing plan,
I considered running my system with no fish in for 12 weeks, however I think the stress induced by doing this to the fish would not be ideal. So I will be implementing ich management from now on, which includes better feeding regime and more vitamin supplements etc.

 

[jameswetton2895]

OK, So I have now been using polyp lab medic for 11 days and no signs of ich on any fish. I am aware that this is by no means the end of the fight however it is very good short term news. Fish are eating really well and I have doubled the feeding regime at least, slightly concerned about nitrates doing this but as you will see below nitrates are really good.

I also have started to use the red sea Nitrate pro test kit, was using salifert but it was just too hard to distinguish the reading at the lowest levels (less than 2 ppm)

Test results - 26/11/16

TEMP - 25.5
Nh4 - 0.25
N02 - 0.1
N03 - 1
ALK - 9.8
CAL - 460
MAG - 1320
P04 - 0
SALINITY - 1.026

I am aiming for the recommended levels by red sea as I will be using the full red sea programme as required. I have been testing a lot so hopefully I will be able to work out my rough ALK uptake per day.

I am super happy with the progress of the tank, the only issue so far has been the outbreak of marine ich which I am hoping to control in the future.

 

[jameswetton2895]

Dosed NoP0x for the first time today as well. Nitrates are only 1 ppm but I have used a very low dosage to start to build the bacteria. As mentioned I am planning on using the full range of red sea products, I would love to see if anyone else is using this plan and what their fining are ? Full tank shot Below

 

[mcarroll]

Thanks for your advice... however as much as I agree not to over load a tanks bio load. I have 7 small fish 3 being very very small and a few coral colonies. I have never had a reading of nitrate above 5ppm ( on the way down ) so don't think I have pressure on my biological filtration. There are a lot of tanks that's are set up and stocked heavier than mine instantly with great results.
I do appreciate any and all advice so thanks for your comments. I will also say I have had plenty of time to make mistakes on old tanks and learnt a lot. I'm sure I'm going to make many more mistakes on this feeding journey but that's all part of the ride.

NO3 levels don't figure in to fish stress....and your corals will not like it much below 5 ppm anyway. Overcrowding is a social thing more than a pollution thing.

The biggest problems can be the newness of the tank as well as the tank keeper. (You have to tell me, I'm not trying to assess anyone from across the internet...just the tank. )

Going slow is recommended by more than just me for a lot of reasons – all of them good. That you have some experience is surely helpful, but it doesn't necessarily change the overall equation. Fish disease is a part of that equation.

Using other online people's tanks for examples is somewhat inevitable, but on this front (fish stocking) in particular there are very few good examples for a newbie (or new tank) to follow. You rarely know what anyone's results are past the first year.....or the first five years. Fish that die within 5 years are still failures. So that puts a lot of uncertainty on the actual success of most tanks you see online.

So don't spend too much time emulating others, unless they really have a track record worth following. (Off the top of my head, I can only point to one or two people online...and at least one of them would tell you, in a nutshell, not to emulate him because it's not that simple.)

I don't know if I already posted this:
Circular 919/FA005: Stress - Its Role in Fish Disease

Stress seems ambiguous in its meaning sometimes, so that guide helps IMO.

 

[jameswetton2895]

NO3 levels don't figure in to fish stress....and your corals will not like it much below 5 ppm anyway. Overcrowding is a social thing more than a pollution thing.

The biggest problems can be the newness of the tank as well as the tank keeper. (You have to tell me, I'm not trying to assess anyone from across the internet...just the tank. )

Going slow is recommended by more than just me for a lot of reasons – all of them good. That you have some experience is surely helpful, but it doesn't necessarily change the overall equation. Fish disease is a part of that equation.

Using other online people's tanks for examples is somewhat inevitable, but on this front (fish stocking) in particular there are very few good examples for a newbie (or new tank) to follow. You rarely know what anyone's results are past the first year.....or the first five years. Fish that die within 5 years are still failures. So that puts a lot of uncertainty on the actual success of most tanks you see online.

So don't spend too much time emulating others, unless they really have a track record worth following. (Off the top of my head, I can only point to one or two people online...and at least one of them would tell you, in a nutshell, not to emulate him because it's not that simple.)

I don't know if I already posted this:
Circular 919/FA005: Stress - Its Role in Fish Disease

Stress seems ambiguous in its meaning sometimes, so that guide helps IMO.

Thank again for your advice its all appreciated.

Please correct me if I'm wrong but from what I have read fish disease can come in on any new fish / coral at any point in the stocking process, weather that is 1 year or 10 ?

I can understand your points however, I really do not agree that I have caused large amounts of stress to the tank. I have cycled the tank properly, all be it using a jump start bacteria, I have stocked small fish which will produce low levels of waste in campers to the volume of the tank and the amount of biological filtration. I admit to not being as diligent as possible when it comes to feeding additives, however I am now fully clued up to this and acting appropriately.

I struggle to see that the fish stock was "overcrowded ". Having said that I am now re considering my plan on keeping multiple tangs and will probably not add another one at any stage. Thanks again for your input I will continue to keep this thread up to date with my progress and hope people can learn from my mistakes.

 

[mcarroll]

Sorry this is becoming a belabored point.....just try to go slower. That's what I said in the first place and it'll help with your long term success. The rest was just supporting info.

 

[jameswetton2895]

Sorry, this is becoming a belabored point.....just try to go slower. That's what I said in the first place and it'll help with your long term success. The rest was just supporting info.

Thanks for your advice it is appreciated, guess there is more than one way to achieve reefing goals. Ive had success before and I imagine so have you. Just different opinions, but good for other people to see both and maybe compare results.

 

[revhtree]

Very nice!

 

[Maacc]

Just been having a read, I think if you use a high quality pellet food then they tend to be packed with a lot of protein ( the reddish pellets anyway ) Same applies to the greenish pellets which tend to be crammed full of veggies. The problem with frozen food is that freezing significantly reduced the nutritional value of the food itself. Saying that the meaty food will contain certain amino acids which make up protein that can't be packed into pellets.

I think the only thing that people agree on is that once established a varied and regular feeding schedule is best.

I don't know how prohibitively expensive shipping would be, or perhaps a local lfs might stock it over there, but I would recommend the LRS line of frozen food. Thry have herbivore frenzy, reef frenzy, fish frenzy and others. I feed my tanks a random rotation of reef frenzy, fish frenzy and fertility frenzy. Far better nutrition than any pellet or flake food, and much cleaner than most frozen foods. It is slightly pricey but not really considering the other stuff we buy for our addiction .
I would also recommend hitting a local fresh seafood market if you have one for whole clams and such that you can slice and feed. Make sure you you keep the guts and such as thatvis where the oils and natural bacteria are located.

 

[jameswetton2895]

I don't know how prohibitively expensive shipping would be, or perhaps a local lfs might stock it over there, but I would recommend the LRS line of frozen food. Thry have herbivore frenzy, reef frenzy, fish frenzy and others. I feed my tanks a random rotation of reef frenzy, fish frenzy and fertility frenzy. Far better nutrition than any pellet or flake food, and much cleaner than most frozen foods. It is slightly pricey but not really considering the other stuff we buy for our addiction .
I would also recommend hitting a local fresh seafood market if you have one for whole clams and such that you can slice and feed. Make sure you you keep the guts and such as thatvis where the oils and natural bacteria are located.

Thanks for the info. I will certainly look into that range of foods.

 

[jameswetton2895]

So unfortunately I can't get LRS fish food in the uk, that is a real shame as it sounds awesome. I don't know if Larry is on here but if he is could someone tag him as I think Uk Shops would be interested in importing this product.

 

[spiraling]

Your tank looks nice. I'm just setting up my Reefer 525 and I also plan to use the rea sea products, so I'll be following along.

 

[jameswetton2895]

Your tank looks nice. I'm just setting up my Reefer 525 and I also plan to use the rea sea products, so I'll be following along.

Fantastic. Doesn't seem like many people on here are using them. So I feel abit like a test bunny but I do have faith in their range. I've been through a battle with Ich but other than that it's been a really positive journey. Lots more ups and downs to come.

 

[jameswetton2895]

Dosing pump is now set up to dose 100ml of red sea reef foundation b ( made from the powder ) every day in 4 doses starting at midnight. I have roughly calculated this to be what I use however I wouldn't be surprised if I was way off and needed to alter it dramatically over the next week or so. I want to get my alk rock solid before I programme the doser to dose calcium and magnesium. Will also be dosing No3po4x when I can get to my lfs and pick up silicon tubing.

Little bit of sad news ... I fed all my lps coral 2 days ago with reef roids and finally chopped prawn, all responded well and seemed to be very happy yesterday. Unfortunately this morning 3 of my duncan polyps were covered in brown jelly ARGGGHH hate this stuff. I removed the heads and dipped the rest of the colony in using coral RX. The rest of the heads look fine at the moment but I'm withholding judgment until the morning.

Im also getting a lot of diatoms on my sand bed which Im putting down to the relative immaturity of the system.

 

[Maacc]

@ReefFrenzy, I could be wrong but I believe LRS exports all over the world. Do you guys ship to the UK?