LEDs, T5s and MHs for zoas discussion. What are your thoughts?

[happyhourhero]

Every moment that goes by I feel more and more sorry for HOME tanks with LEDs...
MH/T5s all the way!!!!!!!!
Grandis.

T5, MH and LED are all fantastic lighting options and it mostly boils down to personal preference.

My lights are on cheap home depot timers. Blues on at 11:00 off at 9:00. Whites on at 1:30 and off at 8:30. 80% Blues all day, 50% whites all day. Have never lost a frag and dont think i have strange growth patterns. I have Zoas and palys growing right next to SPS. My lights were cheaper and cost much less to run/maintain than t5.

... and yes, I only recommend T5s and or MHs for any aquarium. Forget LEDs!
Too much trouble for anyone to deal with and not worthy the money.
Generally speaking there is no LED in the market today I would think would be anything worthy.
Too much money for toy lights.

BUT, whatever! You like LEDs go ahead...

grandis.

Above is my first post in your thread. Here is Jan 2nd...still running my same LED (for over a year now..you mentioned they wont last that long). So thats 3 months between posts. Is my tank on the decline? Would most readers believe that my lights are not quality or they are "toy lights"? I haven't changed even one of my TWO settings on my super complex light in months...what is complex about that?

 

[A. grandis]

I've run LEDs for nearly a decade with success. As I've said before. And I started with simple neutral white and cool blue CREEs drilled to a heatsink using control circuits I built from scratch. Your insistence on trying to find any one corner that you can put your finger nail under and scratch at is proof you don't care for debate. You just want someone to say you are right. Maybe you can request a "MH and T5 are the Only Good Lights" section and discuss it there.

You may think you are inspiring dialog on the matter but you are not. Your single-mindedness stunts the discussion before it can even begin.

Try to read lots of threads I participate and see that I recommend people to come and help those with LED problems, with their experiences. That shows that I'm not against YOU guys having them. BUT that wouldn't change the fact that I choose not to recommend them too! It is my choice of dealing with the problem and to recommend something that will work better IMO.
Guess how many would help those LEDs? It is so hard to figure out and takes a while. That's why it's not worthy to me!
Very hard to find a solution in some cases too. I'm sure you'll agree with that!
Defending LEDs just because isn't the way to go either.
Any LED system will give you some work to start with and therefore too many corals are lost in the process every day...
Go ask around...
That's one of the worse points in getting them in the first place.

I gotta go. Unfortunately I just can't come to the forums at this time of the year...
You guys take care and have fun.
No hard feelings.

WWC: you guys have the most amazing corals and lots of nice fishes too.
Hope I can visit your facility soon! Have a great 2017!
Aloha,

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

OK, fine. Feel good now that you've spread your opinion that LEDs are bad and that everyone else but you has an agenda?

You live in Hawaii, stop wasting your time talking about artificial sunlight and go enjoy some of the real stuff. It's cold and there is snow on the ground here.

LOL!
Have a great time there!
Take care...
Grandis.

 

[jsker]

I have been running a higher end LED's for 10 months now and a lower end model for 1 year previous. I have run the old tubes and MH in the past. My reason for going LED is heat the main issue and changing bulbs every 9 months or a year + with MH. Also not have to purchase a chiller for $400+ plus the bulb changes of $120 every six to eight months for the t5's. Another reason for my choice was electric conservation with AC in the Florida heat as someone else stated in a past post.

Since switching over to a good brand of LED's my corals have really taken off with growth, and this my path I prefer.

 

[jedimasterben]

Not sure where everyone lives but here in the Southern US, using halide can have a big effect on your air conditioning bill.
My buddy changed his metal halide schedule to run 6pm to 2am or something like that because of how much the halide s were heating the house, he ended up swapping to led only.
We get 100+degree days easily during the summer and trying to cool your house, and tank, while your lighting is heating it up certainly does have a factor in your electric bill, even if the metal halide vs led fixtures are consuming the same amount of electricity.
At a rate 0.05/kwh I was paying
$150 to cool a 900sqft townhouse, I don't want my lights making the AC run more. I cool my house 24/7, from March through about October we are using AC. I'm lucky if we get a few weeks a year that doesn't require some climate control in the house.
Now if I was up north I would probably look at halide cause the heat would probably help in the winter time.
I guess my point is the climate you live in can factor into the energy use/savings of your lighting.

Not actually true. Watts are watts, and they all end up as heat eventually, doesn't matter what source they come from. Now when it comes to JUST tank temperature and heat transfer from the lighting directly, metal halides are big sources of infrared light (essentially pure heat) that gets put into the tank that LEDs simply do not radiate. When it comes to ambient temperature, though, both sources will be equal if both are the same wattage.

I went from a pair of Maxspect Ethereal pulling about 85w each to a 150w DE halide (pulling about 155 watts from the wall on an electronic ballast, so actually underdriving the lamp a bit) and two LED strips that when run concurrently with the halide use another 60 watts from the wall, so all in all, my actual wattage from the wall is about 20% higher. I saw about 10% increase in temperature of the small, poorly ventilated room the tank is currently in, and my electric bill will increase by around three dollars per month just from the tank, and maybe another couple of dollars overall. I pay $0.14 per kilowatt hour, nearly triple your rate, and cooling a home roughly 25% larger.

 

[Newb73]

I've not kep up with this thread but my 24k zoas i bought with only 3 heads are spreading, Duncans spreading, torch and frongspaws, plate monti looks good. Claim looks amazing. My flower pot goniporiea abd encrusting monti not so much. Blasto is doing great, acans not so much. Polyps are a runaway train as are mushrooms.

 

[saltysilverado]

... and yes, I only recommend T5s and or MHs for any aquarium. Forget LEDs!
Too much trouble for anyone to deal with and not worthy the money.
Generally speaking there is no LED in the market today I would think would be anything worthy.
Too much money for toy lights.

BUT, whatever! You like LEDs go ahead...

grandis.

Don't hate the player, hate the game. Leds are the cutting edge in aquarium lighting and with them coming into the market more and more each year I appreciate WWC for taking on the "challenge" of growing and maintaining a successful reef that is up to their own standards. If you ever have issues with your personal reef it sounds like they have the best knowledge of the new science of LED Reef Keeping

 

[tuna_bullet]

my best growth and colors come from Mh and led combo, T5 and Led second best, but way better with electricity and heat

 

[Lenny_S]

Not actually true. Watts are watts, and they all end up as heat eventually, doesn't matter what source they come from. Now when it comes to JUST tank temperature and heat transfer from the lighting directly, metal halides are big sources of infrared light (essentially pure heat) that gets put into the tank that LEDs simply do not radiate. When it comes to ambient temperature, though, both sources will be equal if both are the same wattage.

To correct your statement, everything on earth above 5 degrees Kelvin (-268 degrees centigrade) emits IR, that includes LED's

The reason LEDs emit less IR (or heat if you please) is because for the amount of visible light energy they produce they consume less electrical energy than fluorescent bulbs and far less than incandescent bulbs. So LEDs simply have a better ratio of IR to visible light radiation produced for amount of electricity used than other bulbs.

So even at equivalent wattage, LEDs will emit less IR than incandescent or fluorescent. Not by a huge amount, but if you were to combine both that IR efficiency and lower wattage for equivalent light output to something like a 250 watt MH... then it would be pretty significant.

 

[A. grandis]

For those who can't imagine lots of T5s, or simply don't want to give up their LEDs, just try to have both of them.
Your tank will be much better than with only LEDs!
I would say that your LEDs are actually the supplement in the equation!

Don't forget to have fun!
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Growth, growth, growth!
You can put those pop blue LEDs to help your taste for the fluorescent reflections!
This guy will never use LEDs again!
I don't blame him!

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

And...
Another option for that pop blue thing is the blue E5s.
You can have a nice T5 fixture and put one of the E5 blue bulb as a supplement, to have that look you like.
Some people really like the blue from the LEDs. Perhaps because they see that all the time at the stores (?).
I personally don't because it doesn't look natural, meaning that we don't see that in the ocean.
But this is personal...
Have fun!


Grandis.

 

[jedimasterben]

I personally don't because it doesn't look natural, meaning that we don't see that in the ocean.

... you're kidding, right? Nothing about hobbyist lighting except for using, say, 6500K lamps, is 'natural'.

 

[themcnertney]

WOW still discussing huh.
As I mentioned, I've learned little about zoa growth with regard to different lighting. Really a contradicting and pointless thread IMO.

 

[happyhourhero]

Grandis- do you run out from under the bridge and harass people on the way home with their LEDs?

 

[USMC4Life]

I'm late to the conversation but I would say SB reeflights would work for just about anything. They are LED's.

 

[A. grandis]

... you're kidding, right? Nothing about hobbyist lighting except for using, say, 6500K lamps, is 'natural'.

You are probably right!
I forgot about it...
Let me put in a better way here:
The blue from the Blue Plus ATI bulb is closer to the natural blue spectrum from the ocean than those strong popping blue LED lights IMO.
How's that?
Now go watch that video, please. LOL!
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

WOW still discussing huh.
As I mentioned, I've learned little about zoa growth with regard to different lighting. Really a contradicting and pointless thread IMO.

I think if it was really pointless we didn't have so many people joying here...
But yes, it's way too contradicting thread.
I'm glad I people can read it though.
Many had decided to use some T5s over their tanks because of what I and many others have posted here.

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Grandis- do you run out from under the bridge and harass people on the way home with their LEDs?

LOL! No, only when it's time to vote.
Haha!!
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

I'm late to the conversation but I would say SB reeflights would work for just about anything. They are LED's.

Any LED with the right power and spectrum will work to keep most corals and anemones.
But not better than MHs and or T5s, IMO.

Grandis.