LFS says they run copper, safe or good enoigh?

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Bouncingsoul39

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No i’m sorry to say it’s not good enough. I worked at a few LFS and also sold to them while working for the big three wholesalers. Many of them don’t really know what they are doing when it comes to husbandry and disease and parasite treatment.
Many are under lots of pressure to make sales and will tell you what you want to hear though it may not be completely true.

They might add copper but don’t test daily with a good kit. There are many variables like maintaining a therapeutic level of the copper for effectiveness. Also, the fish needs to be in the copper for a minimum amount of time.
With all that said, you can only trust yourself and your own quarantine process to make sure it’s a good one and keep parasites out of your display.
 

Dave1993

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My LFS treat with copper and i dont QT even got a powder blue tang (people say a must QT fish) i didn't all is good but i'm from the UK and from what i have heard and seen much better husbandry from the UK fish stores
 
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Joe31415

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One of my LFS runs all their fish through a QT with copper and General Cure. I generally wouldn't take their word for it, but I can see part of their QT system in the backroom from the store and there's been a number of times where they have a fish in stock, technically, but won't sell it because it still in QT. Even when I've said that I can finish the QT at home, they get weird about it and prefer just to have me leave my name/number and they'll call me when it's ready. Those fish, in the one or two times I've done it, have gone directly into my DT without incident (still makes me a bit uncomfortable though).
The other LFS I go to, OTOH, I wouldn't allow anything directly into my DT. No idea if they QT fish, but they do claim to dip frags (but I QT them anyway). I got my first two fish from them. At that point, I had no other fish, no corals or other inverts, nothing. I QT'd them anyway and it was a good thing I did. One of them had ich. Never did spread to the other one and it's possible it wasn't ich, but whatever it was took several months to clear up.
I still buy from that LFS, but everything goes into QT, be it fish or inverts.
 

Lost in the Sauce

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The copper at the LFS is not high enough to kill parasites. It just limits the visual symptoms so they can survive long enough to be sold…and they look good to the consumer.

The parasites will show once brought to a copper free system.
We literally know nothing about the specific store in question other than op stated they use copper.

They very well May hold therapeutic levels for the correct period of time and transfer into a clean system but unwilling to say it is QT because of liability.

Although your response could be correct, it's a broad statement that none of us can actually make definitively from the information provided.

The fact that the LFS cares enough to run copper is a big plus in my book.
 

Miami Reef

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We literally know nothing about the specific store in question other than op stated they use copper.

They very well May hold therapeutic levels for the correct period of time and transfer into a clean system but unwilling to say it is QT because of liability.

Although your response could be correct, it's a broad statement that none of us can actually make definitively from the information provided.

The fact that the LFS cares enough to run copper is a big plus in my book.
Most (if not all) LFS are receiving fish weekly. It’s impossible for them to maintain therapeutic copper for 30 days and make sure each fish has a calendar to be removed after 30 days.

Most fish cannot tolerate long term copper. It’s a poison. The only reason it works is because it kills ich before the fish.

I stand by my opinion. It’s common practice for LFS to maintain sub therapeutic copper because the fish chain is so polluted.

TL;DR: LFS receive way too much livestock and keep them short term to be able to maintain therapeutic copper, much less for 30 days.

(don’t forget that you often see wrasses in that system too.) you can pretty much neglect any hope that your fish are properly treated at the LFS.
 

Lost in the Sauce

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I stand by my opinion. It’s common practice for LFS to maintain sub therapeutic copper because the fish chain is so polluted.
We've all got em and are entitled to it.

I stand by mine that giving an opinion as fact without having any information on the specifics doesn't actually help.
 

JumboShrimp

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My take on all of this is that the vast majority of LFSs are using enough copper to keep the fish “looking” good until sale. On the other hand, if an LFS truly expended enough money (and the coordination it would take) to “therapeutically” treat an ever-rotating stock of fish with copper, I would think they would advertise that fact from the rooftop.
 
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Mibu

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I will stay on topic, QT your fish. Even if you want to do an observation for 2 weeks. I always treat for flukes and internal parasites. Ich doesn't always show up. In about 7 days it will and that's when copper is treated. I always look for signs of velvet. If there is rapid gill movement, Coppersafe time.

I try to avoid fish showing times signs of ich and velvet. But I can't always. GL
 

Miami Reef

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I will stay on topic, QT your fish. Even if you want to do an observation for 2 weeks. I always treat for flukes and internal parasites. Ich doesn't always show up. In about 7 days it will and that's when copper is treated. I always look for signs of velvet. If there is rapid gill movement, Coppersafe time.

I try to avoid fish showing times signs of ich and velvet. But I can't always. GL
Can I recommend having freshwater black mollies if you plan to only observe in QT? Some fish can hide signs of ich for 1 month but still carry it (especially thick slime coat fish). Black mollies that come from freshwater have no immunity to saltwater parasites (were never exposed) and any freshwater parasites will die in saltwater.

What this basically means is that the mollie will show any parasite that your fish has. Being that the black mollie is…black. It shows even better!

They have no immunity in hiding the parasites. I really recommend them if you plan to only observe fish and want to ensure ich/velvet/brook doesn’t make it past your observation.

(mollies can be acclimated to saltwater. Takes about 4-5 hours of drip acclimating.
 

Mibu

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Can I recommend having freshwater black mollies if you plan to only observe in QT? Some fish can hide signs of ich for 1 month but still carry it (especially thick slime coat fish). Black mollies that come from freshwater have no immunity to saltwater parasites (were never exposed) and any freshwater parasites will die in saltwater.

What this basically means is that the mollie will show any parasite that your fish has. Being that the black mollie is…black. It shows even better!

They have no immunity in hiding the parasites. I really recommend them if you plan to only observe fish and want to ensure ich/velvet/brook doesn’t make it past your observation.

(mollies can be acclimated to saltwater. Takes about 4-5 hours of drip acclimating.
Yes, i know of this. Speaking of mollies, I plan to buy some this weekend. Thank you for reminding me.
 

lion king

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I never buy fish from sources running copper in their systems. There are species which are known to be affected negatively by copper, these fish will have their lifespans decreased. Lions and eels are known to get liver injury from copper exposure along with many other species, I would know what species these are and never buy one of these species from a copper tank. Also running a sub-therapeutic dose will create more of a virulent strain of whatever diseases it may be suppressing, it is only suppressing not curing. Once the suppression wears off, watch out, and be prepared. We have several lfs around, a few that I have done business with over 2 decades. The 2 that run copper in their system get the same comment from every hobbyist I speak to; "fish from that store never lives".
 
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