Lighting Questions for the SPS Pros

[creefer]

This week I had the opportunity to visit one of our R2R sponsors facilities and was in total awe over their SPS system. It's light by MH with 20K Radiums, IIRC. I was simply blown away by the vibrant color of all the livestock in the system. It got me thinking about changing my lighting.

For some background, I have a young tank that's working toward being SPS dominant. It's a 36 x 18 x 15 display with a total system volume of around 60 gallons. Params are in check (sg. 1.026, nitrate 0 per salifert, PO4 0 per salifert, mag 1380, CA 420, Alk 8, pH 8.3, temp 78-80). I use a BM NAC6 skimmer, a small amount of GFO, and small amount of bio pellets. I run an aquatic life 6 x 39 t5 with ATI Blue +, Blue +, coral +, purple+, blue +, blue +, front to back suspended about 8" above the water level. I'm having decent growth, but the colors are NOTHING like what I saw in this system. They're not as vibrant as I would like.

So, this experience has me considering my lighting. I had previously been thinking of going LED/T5 hybrid of sorts and the desire to do so was primarily based on color, heat, and power consumption. Since seeing this system, I'm now thinking of going 2 150W MH with 20K lamps supplemented by T5. While I do have a few LPS, the intent with the system is to keep the LPS to a minimum, so I think as the SPS grows in and creates more low light areas below, then I can get a few more select LPS pieces. If I do decide on MH, I'll be attempting to build them into a canopy that I have which is currently not in use. In this case, I'll retrofit the reflectors into that canopy with the T5 and fans for cooling purposes. All this said, what say the R2R SPS pros about my position?? What are your opinions?

TIA

C

 

[Reefltx]

Honestly, you may look into your water quality. Start by investing in a Hanna for po4. There's plenty of beautiful tanks out there that are lit with t5.


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[creefer]

Agreed. Ordered one yesterday as well as the alk checker



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[MBG75]

Yes. It's not your lights. Are your colors there, just not vibrant? Start feeding them

 

[creefer]

Yes. It's not your lights. Are your colors there, just not vibrant? Start feeding them

Colors are there, some more vibrant than others. My TDF is simply awesome and looks fantastic. My pink lemonade and Wayne's Rainbow colonies are as well. I have a few that simply just don't seem like they are as vibrant. I feed them twice weekly with a mix of oysterfeast and coral frenzy and they do respond well to that. I'm very interested to see what results the Hana checkers produce as well. There may be an underlying issue that's not picked up by the salifert tests. I'm also planning to switch to Ecobak pellets. I'm using the NPX now and am 6 weeks into it. I have not yet added volume to the initial dose of pellets either. I started with about 25% of the recommended volume in an effort to avoid some of the problems experienced by others in using pellets by stripping the water to quickly.

 

[creefer]

Another thing worthy of note here is that I'm planning to change all my filters and membrane in my RODI system this weekend. I have to make water for the ATO and upcoming WC. It's been a while since I've changed the filters. I regularly change the resin, so it is possible that there's some water quality issues. I just recently saw TDS at 4 and it's typically at 0. Not sure that this has a significant effect but it will be fixed this weekend anyway.

 

[Pkunk35]

Following along here, pretty interested in the topic.

Creefer, have you looked into any of the zeovit supplements to try and improve coloration? Or are you dosing any aminos?

Are SPS able to eat oysterfeast and coral frenzy? I dose both as well but I always assumed i was feeding pods and worms not the sps, I dose aminos to try and supplement the SPS but assumed the lights do all feeding.

 

[creefer]

Following along here, pretty interested in the topic.

Creefer, have you looked into any of the zeovit supplements to try and improve coloration? Or are you dosing any aminos?

Are SPS able to eat oysterfeast and coral frenzy? I dose both as well but I always assumed i was feeding pods and worms not the sps, I dose aminos to try and supplement the SPS but assumed the lights do all feeding.

I have looked into zeovit supplements. I currently use KZ Coral snow twice weekly and pohls xtra twice weekly. I don't use any aminos. I have seen polyps on SPS close up when feeding though, so I assume they're getting something out of the nutrients. I have some aminos but it's not the KZ brand and I have not used them in my new tank. I did in the old tank and seemed to have more problems than benefits but I think that was due to the limitations of the tank and equipment itself. I don't believe I have those limitations on the current system but have not tried those supplements.

Honestly, I really don't want to dose a ton of different supplements and additives if I don't have to. At the same time, I don't believe that lighting provides SPS with all that's required for them to thrive.

 

[MBG75]

Just feed your fish well and that should help.
I recently started feeding my fish 2x daily and my corals have colored tremendously.
Run the fine line of feeding well, but keeping phosphates low and nitrates zero.

 

[Vmacisback]

Really think you need to try some aminos. I dose KZ supplements aswell but I have been using Aquavitro Fuel and it seems to have some good results. If you are using Biopellets and GFO you need to replenish your water with aminos. I would do it at night when the lights are off. Just a thought. How big are your SPS pieces? sometimes it takes some growth for the real color to come out.

 

[creefer]

Really think you need to try some aminos. I dose KZ supplements aswell but I have been using Aquavitro Fuel and it seems to have some good results. If you are using Biopellets and GFO you need to replenish your water with aminos. I would do it at night when the lights are off. Just a thought. How big are your SPS pieces? sometimes it takes some growth for the real color to come out.

I'll have to give the aminos a shot. As far as size on my pieces, I have a decent (4") blue tip stag, a colony of rose millieopora that's approximately 3/4 the size of a baseball. It's color is good. I have a Wayne's Reef Rainbow colony that's roughly 3" x 3". It looks ok and has been coloring up more since I introduced it a few months ago. I also have a sunset millie colony that's about 3" x 3" and it seems pale. The strawberry lemonade is about 3" x 2" and has great color actually. I have a red montipora cap. that's large and growing well, but is more pastel than it was in my old tank. It's nearly doubled in size since the move 5 months ago. the $500 efflo is growing nicely yet is pale. I then have various other SPS mini colonies or frags, some of which look great and others are simply pale or in some cases brown, like my Red Planet and Pearlberry frags. I have a frag of Sunset montipora that is looking terrible, but all others look good and have good PE, just don't look as good as they could.

I feed fish once daily, primarily based on my work schedule, and do so relatively heavily. All fish are fat and happy. I have a radiant wrasse, 2 true perculas, a red scooter blenny, and a Hawaiian Spotted Hawk. The Hawk may have to go soon....he's getting big and aggressive. I like him, but think I like the radiant wrasse better.

Once I started reading the responses to this here at home, I began to think that maybe I have a couple dead snails somewhere in the system. I have put several nassarius snails in the system as well as a few ceriths, and rarely do I ever see any of them, even at feeding time. I don't see the ceriths at night, either. I don't know if there's anything to that or not. It got me thinking though because I got home tonight to find more algae in the system that seemingly I shouldn't have. Will be testing PO4 shortly....just got the kids to bed.

In any case, I should have my Hana's early this week.

 

[Poseidon]

I noticed a HUGE difference in my SPS reef when I started feeding a LOT. Oyster feast seems to be a really big hit with SPS, it sure was in my tank anyway. I also had 18 fish in my 90, and was feeding Arctipods, Spectrum Pellets, and PE Mysis.

 

[creefer]

I noticed a HUGE difference in my SPS reef when I started feeding a LOT. Oyster feast seems to be a really big hit with SPS, it sure was in my tank anyway. I also had 18 fish in my 90, and was feeding Arctipods, Spectrum Pellets, and PE Mysis.

Thanks.

I feed only Spectrum for pellets and flakes, I also feed PE Mysis on occasion as well as Rod's.

I'm a little apprehensive about feeding a lot right now though due to the crap that has been growing on the sand bed.

 

[Ike]

Feed your fish well. Skip the amino acids and other random supplements that people (even the companies that produce them) have no clue as to what the benefits actually are. That is of course probably with the false assumption that they are actually beneficial. The people that actually claim to notice a difference from dosing amino acids could probably take a pee in their tank and get similar results.

Feed well while still keeping your phosphates and nitrates down (achieve this with careful use of GFO and a good protein skimmer NOT carbon dosing) as well and provide good lighting and basic parameters and you'll have nice color. I've been able to achieve and see others achieve great color with both T5's and MH. For T5's stick with primarily ATI bulbs and shorter photoperiods of not much more than 8 hours. For MH's it's **** tough to beat Radiums for a good all around bulb that isn't obnoxiously blue. A MH T5 combo can be really great as well. I have yet to see all around impressive colors with an LED set-up.

 

[creefer]

Feed your fish well. Skip the amino acids and other random supplements that people (even the companies that produce them) have no clue as to what the benefits actually are. That is of course probably with the false assumption that they are actually beneficial. The people that actually claim to notice a difference from dosing amino acids could probably take a pee in their tank and get similar results.

Feed well while still keeping your phosphates and nitrates down (achieve this with careful use of GFO and a good protein skimmer NOT carbon dosing) as well and provide good lighting and basic parameters and you'll have nice color. I've been able to achieve and see others achieve great color with both T5's and MH. For T5's stick with primarily ATI bulbs and shorter photoperiods of not much more than 8 hours. For MH's it's **** tough to beat Radiums for a good all around bulb that isn't obnoxiously blue. A MH T5 combo can be really great as well. I have yet to see all around impressive colors with an LED set-up.

I use all ATI lamps. If I do move to MH, it will be with 20K radiums and T5 supplements.

Unrelated to lighting, why are you adverse to carbon dosing?

 

[stunreefer]

I had an Aquatic Life fixture and IIRC they're a one piece, bent reflector. These aren't up to par (hah) with single, polished reflectors. Using eight good T5 bulbs like you are can produce awesome colors in SPS, with the right reflectors. I would still be considering all T5 or T5/LED for your system. You'll have less energy consumption and heat, crucial for home systems. That sponsor is able to have a large area where heat can dissipate without heating up the water.

 

[creefer]

I had an Aquatic Life fixture and IIRC they're a one piece, bent reflector. These aren't up to par (hah) with single, polished reflectors. Using eight good T5 bulbs like you are can produce awesome colors in SPS, with the right reflectors. I would still be considering all T5 or T5/LED for your system. You'll have less energy consumption and heat, crucial for home systems. That sponsor is able to have a large area where heat can dissipate without heating up the water.

You are right on all accounts. The aquatic life fixture is a one piece, bent reflector. It does put out a ton of light however. I've been considering buying a used ATI fixture, which as we all know are outstanding for the price. In general, I have been having a hard time with lighting. This tank is the second I've ever had and the first I started with all LED. I was using a less expensive LED at the time (only a few years ago) and it was not a stellar experience. I know the technology has evolved tremendously in just a few years. As such, I have considered DIY T5/LED for this tank, but had a T5 to run so I ran it. I do love the look of a T5 system yet miss the "shimmer" of the LED, which can also be produced by MH. I do have a 1:1 RB : Magenta stunner that I use in the dusk dawn cycle and colors under it are pretty nice.

 

[chort55]

I was getting awesome results from my DIY LEDs... until one of my skimmer pumps took a crap on my tank


The pics don't do them justice really but....

From T5's:

To LED's:

 

[creefer]

Big difference, chort. What are you using?

 

[chort55]

I have 3 panels w/ 24 3w cree LED's each, on my 180 for a total of 72 LEDs (I was using the ones from Modular LED in canada).... everyone says under powered but they were doing what I wanted them to do.

Also, I was feeding 1-2 good size chunks of the homemade brew from Reef Paradise (local LFS for those that are wondering lol) that has a little of everything in it to my 20some fish, and dosing 1 part vodka, 2 parts vinegar.