Magnesium Super High in Newly Mixed Saltwater - Is it Safe to Use?

brandon429

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http://kb.marinedepot.com/article.aspx?id=10833

+300 ppm variance on his exact kit

an easier test is to just post two side by side alt test kit readings of his water sample and at least work off a short avg. his reading might be verified as correct, just showing how skews come up. my only goal in providing alternates is to prevent too-quick reactions, better to hesitate when param detailing with no known tank impacts that's all. a rolling 300 variance might mean the other batch is low.

To know if his kit was used successfully, we'd need a comparison of two or more. if every reading taken is a few hundred ppm too high it seemed we might be eyeballing
 
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Lou Ekus

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@that Reef Guy

I'm not sure exactly what is going on with your Mg, but I would like to help you sort it out. I don't know of any batches that a high Mg issue of hand. Can you please get me the batch number? It will be a number stamped on the inside of the bucket lid. You can also contact me directly, for support with this, at my email at [email protected] or give me a call in the office at 413-367-0101 next week. The office is closed today and tomorrow.

Also, just to put you at ease, there is really no reason for you to worry about copper or other trace elements that might be toxic at higher concentrations. I will explain more about this when we chat. But I wanted to put you at ease for the meantime, until we do get a chance to talk.

I look forward to speaking with you and getting this cleared up for you. Please contact me as early as you can next week.
 
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that Reef Guy

that Reef Guy

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@that Reef Guy

I'm not sure exactly what is going on with your Mg, but I would like to help you sort it out. I don't know of any batches that a high Mg issue of hand. Can you please get me the batch number? It will be a number stamped on the inside of the bucket lid. You can also contact me directly, for support with this, at my email at [email protected] or give me a call in the office at 413-367-0101 next week. The office is closed today and tomorrow.

Also, just to put you at ease, there is really no reason for you to worry about copper or other trace elements that might be toxic at higher concentrations. I will explain more about this when we chat. But I wanted to put you at ease for the meantime, until we do get a chance to talk.

I look forward to speaking with you and getting this cleared up for you. Please contact me as early as you can next week.
I am busy all day today

I will call you Tuesday or Wednesday
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

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I know people Raise with Tech-M for Bryopsis but

1. It is not long term
2. They are Dosing Magnesium Only so only that will be high. With the Mag High in the Salt I am even more worried at what else it high - Mainly Copper!

Why on earth do these companies put Copper in Salt and Food?

Everybody know that Copper Kills Coral.

One Bad Batch and Boom All your Corals will Die and there is nothing you can do at that Point.

That is what scares me the most is Copper or some other dangerous Metal being High in addition to the Magnesium being High.
Do you know that any salt maker intentionally adds copper? I do not know that, but it might be true.

Just because it might have a listed or measured concentration does not mean it is intentional or any different than other brands. It may just be an impurity in other additions to the mix. None of the chemical used in any mix are ever totally pure. That is not an attainable goal.

That said, copper is an essential nutrient and your corals and other organisms would likely die without it.
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

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There is no way the salt needs to be mixed and that a heavier fraction settled out leaving only magnesium up top.
FWIW, one of the senior reps for a major salt company told me he tested this himself (by leaving a bucket on a washing machine for a while, then testing to see if it separated) and found it can happen, as it might in the back of a truck bouncing down the road for many hours.

But I do agree that user testing errors are VERY common.
 

brandon429

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had also factored it not happening to me since 2000 as well or anyone i knew at lfs but that's amazing theres any percent of it~ good to know. Explains some variances for sure.

wow for the factors that aligned for that to affect ones reading for sure.

batch to batch variance range control is among top ongoing challenges for a salt co and it's good to know that variances even with the same company don't mix up lethal in most every case... the variations alter the dosing but rarely I think one should react and correct a variation on the spot.

If someone has high magnesium and your corals are open and all your CUC is normal, that's a period of algae suppression just enjoy it.
 
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d2mini

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@that Reef Guy

I'm not sure exactly what is going on with your Mg, but I would like to help you sort it out. I don't know of any batches that a high Mg issue of hand. Can you please get me the batch number? It will be a number stamped on the inside of the bucket lid. You can also contact me directly, for support with this, at my email at [email protected] or give me a call in the office at 413-367-0101 next week. The office is closed today and tomorrow.

Also, just to put you at ease, there is really no reason for you to worry about copper or other trace elements that might be toxic at higher concentrations. I will explain more about this when we chat. But I wanted to put you at ease for the meantime, until we do get a chance to talk.

I look forward to speaking with you and getting this cleared up for you. Please contact me as early as you can next week.
I came across this thread while searching for Tropic Marin Pro High Magnesium.
Mine is testing at around 1740 for Mag. A brand new 120g tank and I've already done a couple large water changes. No coral yet.
The first bucket I used was batch 15255 and the bucket I'm on now and almost finished with is batch 14036.
FWIW, Alk in the tank is 7 dkh and Calcium is 440.
 

Lou Ekus

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@d2mini - Thanks for the batch numbers. Is it your tank that is testing at 1740 Mg or your newly made water change water? Please give me a call in the office and I can try to help you figure this out as well. I am still waiting to hear about the batch number from thatReefGuy. I will check these batch numbers as well. It is very unlikely that the Mg is that high in both of these batches, so please give me a call so I can help you figure out this issue. Your Alk and Ca seem great. my office number is 413-367-0101. i hope to talk to you soon.
 

Svet

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Hi guys
Looks like I might have the same issue. Purchased 200g TM Pro Reef bucket couple of weeks ago and tested the newly mixed salt water made with RODI. Sg 35 Alk 7.15 Ca 425 Mg 1750. Tested Mg again and it came to 1740. Mixed the salt in the bucket using a small cup and tested everything again. Sg 35 Alk 6.5 Ca 415 Mg 1650. My batch # is 14036 on the lid but bucket says Art. No 10581 - not sure which is the correct batch number. All test kits are Salifert and are definitely fine as my Instant Ocean salt which I was trying to switch from and my tank parameters are always in line.
 

Lou Ekus

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@Svet - Thanks for your post. I am checking our controls on the batch number 14036 of Pro-REEF salt and will post results as soon as I have them from our lab in Germany. The Ca and Alk in your salt also seems right on. I hope to be able to post our control results very soon. It does seem odd that the Mg test EXACTLY the same to the ppm as the previous posters high Mg test. This is not usually the case with reagent test kits. However, we will know more once I have our lab control test results. Please follow this thread or call me in the office for follow up information. Thanks.
 

brandon429

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in another thread we have watching this, where keepers are detailing magnesium boosting to try and fight bryopsis, we are perspective chuckling at how these levels of 17 and 1800 are being maintained without cause, while the other crew tests and doses furiously to maintain them, pure irony. this crew wants them lowered, the other crew wants the levels right here and are paying extra + testing to get there.

"but we must use Kent to get at its magic properties for bryopsis control"
nope. google this: brightwell magnesium bryopsis control. see our giant bryopsis cure threads, we can get motion off any magnesium boosting.

any magnesium works, searches show we don't need kent... but handy if avail.

If this batch above is set to anti-bryopsis levels, and nobody here has tank loss, I say word up enjoy it while you can.
 
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Lou Ekus

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in another thread we have watching this, where keepers are detailing magnesium boosting to try and fight bryopsis, we are perspective chuckling at how these levels of 17 and 1800 are being maintained without cause, while the other crew tests and doses furiously to maintain them, pure irony. this crew wants them lowered, the other crew wants the levels right here and are paying extra + testing to get there.

"but we must use Kent to get at its magic properties for bryopsis control"
nope. google this: brightwell magnesium bryopsis control.

any magnesium works, and we collect results to show it, don't need kent.

If this batch above is set to anti-bryopsis levels, and nobody here has tank loss, well I say word up.
Please keep in mind, when considering raising Mg levels this high to control bryopsis, that the Ca absorption during the elevated Mg level is greatly compromised unless a slightly higher Ca and Alk level are maintained at the same time. This also points to the important step of doing aggressive water changes to lower the Mg once the bryopsis has died off to return to the normal Mg/Ca/Alk parameters and the proper Ca absorption capabilities of the calcareous tank population.
 

d2mini

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If this batch above is set to anti-bryopsis levels
HA! Thanks for the laugh. :D

Tested freshly mixed water from batch 14036 with NYOS and it tested at 1875. Basically the same as the Red Sea Pro kit.
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

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Please keep in mind, when considering raising Mg levels this high to control bryopsis, that the Ca absorption during the elevated Mg level is greatly compromised unless a slightly higher Ca and Alk level are maintained at the same time. This also points to the important step of doing aggressive water changes to lower the Mg once the bryopsis has died off to return to the normal Mg/Ca/Alk parameters and the proper Ca absorption capabilities of the calcareous tank population.
Hi Lou, is there any published data showing depleted calcium and alkalinity consumption by corals at elevated magnesium levels? You sure it is not just decreased abiotic precipitation, which is expected at elevated magneisum?
 

Lou Ekus

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@Randy Holmes-Farley - You may be right on with that abiotic precipitation concept Randy. I don't know of any "hard" data showing decreased Ca consumption under those very high Mg conditions. That being said, I always get just a little concerned about it when I hear all the talk of elevating Mg levels this high, for any significant period of time, to beat back algae, because of the chemistry behind it all on the Ca/alkalinity side. It may not play out in the tank chemistry the way it plays out in my analysis. But I would like to see a little more emphasis on aggressive water changes to drop the Mg level back closer to NSW levels after the elevated period as part of that particular discussion. I don't ever see that, and I've always felt it is a potential issue. I would love to see someone do the study at some point. :)
 
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